vilded chameleon from petsmart

[Vincentuanluu]

i got a vilded chameleon after seeing one yesterday at petsmart when I was buying crickets and they had her in a critter box next to the betta fishes with nothing but tissues... I asked why they had her there, maybe on hold for someone but they said they didn't have an extra display tank available................ I went home and looked online since I felt really bad,

if I was able to put her in same enclosure as my Fischer but was worst idea I ever came up with after researching a bit since I'm bit new to chameleons. Since I was already planning to built outdoor one for my Fischer for him to get natural sunlight, decided to built a small one for the vilded so I went and brought her right away and couldn't finish building it today so I put her in a 20gallon terrarium for the night till I get back from work tomorrow.

I notice she has 3-4 bumps on her body, I asked the worker at petsmart and she said it was calcium built up since its soft and doesn't hurt her when she was rubbing and touching the bump. Was wondering if anyone know what it is?
It's on the sides of her body. Also if anyone can sex the vilded chameleon since I don't trust petsmart. Couldn't really see the spur, maybe someone else can figure it out.
They said they had her for 3 weeks, could anyone guess the age on the size?
Also does anyone notice any health problems? Planning to bring my vilded chameleon to vet with my Fischer next Monday... Only have one vet around area unless I drive an hour and half to another vet..
Been having problems with my Fischer chameleon cause haven't seen him eat in almost 2 full weeks..

I would fill out the "how to get help" but just got the vilded today so all I know is they had her for 3 weeks, they say the chameleon is a she and been eating crickets only. ( how many crickets should I be feeding her daily for her size)

 

[MeruJack]

Does your Veiled have a tarsal spur on the back of her back feet/heels? If she doesn't, it's a girl.

Click on this link and check out the Veiled chameleon care sheet here on Chameleon Forums. It has valuable information
regarding Veiled chameleons and baby veiled chameleons specifically.

https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/caresheets/veiled/

Temperature:
Baby/juvenile (<9 months): ambient 72-80F (22-26C), basking 85F (29C)

Cage Size:
screen cage (length x width x height):

juveniles/sub-adults
: 16x16x30" (40x40x76cm)

Feeding:
Juveniles 3-6 months of age: 10-12 small crickets daily
Juveniles 6-12 months of age: 10-12 medium crickets every other day

 

[jajeanpierre]

Follow the care sheets for the veiled and keep her on the cool side and very lean to try to minimize egg production. Veileds are an incredibly tough chameleon. I think the biggest problem with veileds for pet owners is that the babies hatch incredibly malnourished. The female produces many many times more eggs per clutch and more clutches per year than a veiled does in the wild. She has to put in a lot of nutrients into the egg. A lack of Vitamin A and calcium being the two that I think cause the most problems for new chameleon owners. Most animals are fed a very poor diet to begin with, so her babies don't have a chance to be born strong and healthy.

What concerns me is that you have what seems like an adult Fischers chameleon that is not doing well. Not only do you have an adult wild caught not doing well, but you are a novice. You are such a novice, you didn't even know a veiled couldn't go in with him. Don't get me wrong, we were all novices at some time and that was NOT a criticism, just an illustration of how little you know about chameleons. I know next to nothing about Fischers chameleons, but I am pretty sure they are not bred in the US. That means you have bought an adult wild caught and THAT is not an easy animal to keep alive.

While I don't know anything about Fischers, I do have a fair amount of experience with keeping wild caughts alive and getting them to thrive. The facts are that most imported animals will die within the first few months in captivity, usually sooner. It doesn't have to be that way.

I'm assuming yours is a wild caught. I did a quick search in the IUCN Red List (International Union of Conservation of Nature) and found this article on Fischers. http://www.iucnredlist.org/details/172565/0 Note that it states that few "Fischers" chameleons imported are actually Fishers, instead being other species. Regardless of what species you actually have, I believe you have a wild caught chameleon from the mountains of Tanzania.

Wild caughts pose so many problems to keepers that I don't know where to start.

Let's start with with their parasite load. All chameleons in the wild have parasites. In the wild, parasites and the chameleon live in harmony with each other. In fact, there might even be a benefit to a chameleon having parasites. The problem with parasites is when their population explodes and overwhelms the host. Stress suppresses the immune system and a stressed immune system can't keep parasites in check. Your wild caught has suffered incredible stresses and probably continues to do so. So, his parasite load will likely be massive, but dealing with the parasites will likely kill him.

So, it's a Catch 22 situation with parasites--do you treat a declining chameleon or not? It is not an easy answer. Most vets and keepers treat but most of those animals die. Zoos don't treat generally for at least 45 days and in general they never treat a declining animal. I don't treat for a long time. I consider treating them a last ditch effort because the treatment is so dangerous. I know, counter intuitive.

If you treat a heavy load of parasites, a lot of things can happen that are far worse than the parasites. Anthelminic (worming) drugs are not without risk, even if the drug itself is quite safe. First off, there is his hydration status and his kidney function. These drugs are hard on kidneys to begin with and made much much worse when an animal is dehydrated. Wild caughts can be so loaded with parasites, that the dead and dying parasites form a blockage in the gut. Worming meds suppress the appetite so your original problem is made worse. Handling them and medicating them is incredibly stressful. (Keep in mind, stress is what kills all these imported animals.) As well, many of the parasites this animal is carrying do not just stay nicely in the gut. Their life cycle is such that they are ingested and then pass from the gut into the body/blood stream/organs where they either become encapsulated and wait or they continue on until they make it to the lungs where they are coughed up and swallowed to become adult worms that live in the gut. This animal probably had a lot of incapsulated parasites just waiting for the right conditions to burst out and continue on their life cycle. I think a stressed animal is the right conditions they are waiting for. All that moving around the body is not without damage. There are not doors out of the gut and into the body. The parasites pierce the body, the blood vessels, the organd,, the lung, putting lots of little holes in his gut (intestinal tracts are LOADED with bacteria) and the rest of his body allowing all kinds of pathogens to get out of the gut and into the body. This is into the body of a stressed animal with a poorly functioning immune system caused by stress.

It is not as simple as just giving worming meds. It's complicated. You need a healthy animal before your medicate. Most vets will find parasites in the stool and immediately worm. Most of those animals do not do well and everyone blames the worms when I believe it is the treatment that killed the animal.

Next is the habitat. A Fischers chameleon comes form the mountains of Tanzania. I have no idea where the other species that are sold as Fischers come from, but I suspect the same area. So, you have a montane (moutain dwelling) chameleon. You need to know the climate of where they are found. Even though they might be found right on the equator, they are likely found where it is quite cool much of the time. Cool and humid.

I see you have a screen cage. I would suggest you cover three sides with plastic to keep in the humidity. Misting every three hours is just not going to do the job. The wild caugts I have worked with have all been montane species. I will run misters on them for 10 and 20 minutes at a time every hour when I first get them. I don't let the cages dry out for weeks with a new wild caught. Hand misting isn't very good because you--a scary predator--is standing right in front of them stressing them. I think an automatic mister is an absolute necessity for keeping chameleons, even a single veiled. They need the mist not only to drink but to clean their eyes. Mist King has a great little mister and they are located in Windsor, Ontario. I believe you are in Vancouver, Canada?

Find the temps they need. Right now, Tanzania is in the middle of a rainy season. Even the semi arid plains are flooded right now. He needs a LOT of water.

Stress is one of the biggest problems facing wild caughts. They had horrible conditions before they were exported and then being passed around until they end up in a pet home. Most die. I can't emphasize enough that most die. I don't think they need to. You have to do everything to reduce the stress of this animal. That means not looking at him and not handling him. Leave him alone. Fill his cage so he can hide. Fill it with live plants so there is more humidity in the cage as the plants breath plus more surfaces to hold droplets of water.

Why do you think he hasn't eaten? I see a fly in the cage--great choice of food to tempt him, by the way. What other insects have you tried? Don't cup feed. Just let the insects free. Don't add any supplements. Wild caughts are much less tolerant to supplements. They often get things like gular edemas more easily with some of the artificial vitamins. Don't worry about his vitamins for a while. He's grown up, he doesn't need a lot plus he just came from the wild so he had much better, more nutrient dense food than you can ever provide unless you catch all your insects from the wild.

Bright green is a really stimulating colored food for chameleons. Flying insects are very stimulating.

Have you found any stool in his cage? That will mean he is eating, by the way. If you can find a fresh stool, take it in to the vet. Put it in a plastic bag in the fridge until your appointment. Try to get one that is only a few hours old.

I see you are taking him in to the vet Monday. Remember my warning about worming? If the vet wants to worm, discuss my points with him. If the vet doesn't have experience with chameleons, especially wild caughts, you might not get the best advice. You really need a vet that has experience with reptiles. If the vet thinks the animal is dehydrated, by all means give sub cutaneous fluids. Have the vet add a bit of B Complex vitamins to give him a boost. A dehydrated chameleon won't eat or drink. When you take him to the vet, put him in a box of some sort so he is in complete dark. A plastic shoe box-sized tote in a dark cloth bag or kept under a dark towel will work. Add a few wadded up slightly dampened paper towels. Discuss your concerns with the vet BEFORE you take him out of the box. Don't take him out of the dark box until the very end of the appointment. Stand your ground with vet techs and vets who want to see them first. Discuss everything first, then let them see the chameleon and put him right back in the box. When I go in with an animal, I state right off the bat that I'm leaving them in the box to the last moment to reduce stress. Being exposed under bright lights on a bare steel examination table is incredibly stressful for any chameleon, much less a wild caught. Stand your ground with everyone. You can do it with a smile and not offend anyone.

Good luck. Just because you are a novice doesn't mean you can't do this. Sometimes novices do a better job than experienced keepers because they are so attentive and paranoid. Stress and humidity are the biggies. Send me a PM if you have any other questions since I might miss it if you just post it here.