Cham abuse, from family

[Psychobunny]

What do you do when a cham is abused by a family member?

Some months ago, I gave my nephew a male panther cham for his b-day, he is 22, an adult. He had been coming over to see my chams, and he loved them. He gave me every indication that he would take really good care of one if he had it.

So, I called my brother a few days ago, and his wife answered the phone.
I talked to her for a few minutes, and asked how Richie was doing with his chameleon. She told me she didn't think he was taking very good care of it!!

So I called my nephew and he told me he thought the cham was sick, and if he could bring him to my house so I could have a look at him.

My heart sank the second I saw the little guy, he was very dehydrated and malnourished.

I took the cham away from my nephew, and told him he can not have it back!!

I took the cham to the vet, and Dr Rhody hydrated him and did a blood test.
I have been feeding him bug juice slurry fortified with calcium and vitamins and giving him lots of water with a pipett.

Anyway, the cham looks healthy now, and my nephew saw how he had improved in my care, and now he wants the cham back!!

I really don't have room for him, had to do some major rearranging to get another cage in the cham room.

My brother thinks I did the right thing, taking the cham away from Richie, but his wife, and Richie, are both mad at me because I will not let him have the cham back!!

What would you do?
I will try to post some pics of him, he is very skidish and terrified of everything. I don't want to stress him. But he now looks like a normal, healthy cham, and I want him to STAY that way!!!

 

[Cait0420]

That must be horrible having a family member not taking care of the Cham u gave him, and now they want it back after it was malnourished? I personally wouldn't give it back and I would explain why you aren't giving it back.

 

[MelissaB]

I'm so sorry that your nephew wasn't able to take care of the little guy properly. It had to be very disappointing for you.
Seeing as he didn't even bother to contact you when it was obvious that the little guy was in trouble, I wouldn't feel comfortable giving him back. I think your nephew would give him better care for a couple weeks, and then go back to the way it was before. It wouldn't be fair to the animal, unless the whole family was committed to taking care of him.

 

[Cait0420]

I'm so sorry that your nephew wasn't able to take care of the little guy properly. It had to be very disappointing for you.
Seeing as he didn't even bother to contact you when it was obvious that the little guy was in trouble, I wouldn't feel comfortable giving him back. I think your nephew would give him better care for a couple weeks, and then go back to the way it was before. It wouldn't be fair to the animal, unless the whole family was committed to taking care of him.

I agree with this as well

 

[Olimpia]

I'm sorry, what a tricky situation!

I also would make it clear why he is not going to get him back, and then find him a proper home with someone else if you can't take him on permanently.

I had a roommate who is still one of my best friends, and I love him, but he was awful with his reptiles. I would be the one to notice that this animal was getting MBD deformities in their tail, or that animal had suffered thermal burns to their stomach, etc. And then I'd be the one to pester him to take them to the vet, or to buy rodents to feed his snakes because his 6' boa hadn't eaten in weeks and she was starting to get really mean, striking at the glass and at everyone's hands.

As much as he was a great guy in general he just sucked as an exotic pet owner. So I was glad that when he went back to his country he gave up all his exotics. I guess it takes a special personality type to take on the effort of caring for a pet and stick to it, and you can't necessarily change them if they don't see what they're doing wrong. And it seems like your nephew is very similar, I'm sure he's a great kid but this just isn't his focus/priority right now. So I would not return the chameleon to him either.

 

[Leslie11]

Return??

I agree with all the replies. He does not deserve to have him back! Give him a book on Chameleon Care, for his BD.

 

[Rottsko]

stan,
you did the right thing. i wouldn't let them have him back either. idk if you have a before and after pic of the guy to show them the difference between a healthy and unhealthy cham and to show them they let an animal that is 100% dependent on them get that sick.

even if they're mad, they'll get over it. plus your brother knows you did the right thing and he should support you over his wife and kid. you did the right thing and don't let them pressure you to give him back to them.

 

[Psychobunny]

Thanks for the input you guyz, I am taking your advise and holding my ground.

My nephew will likely do just that, take really good care of him, now that he see's the cham is looking healthy, then loose interest after a few weeks.

If they are mad at me, they will have to get over it. Surly his mom is wise enough to finally agree with my brother.
I have told them why he can not have the animal back, and now that I have been nursing him, I am getting attached, which is what I was afraid would happen!!

I think the family fude will fade in time, I just don't want hard feelings.

He was only feeding him mealies, and he put a capful of calcium powder on the floor of the cage, not dusting!
He had a outdated UVB, which I gave him, and TOLD him the bulb needs to be replaced. He didn't do it!
The cage was also filthy!! poop and dead mealies everywhere!! The cham is in a new cage now. I didn't even bother to try to clean the old one.
It was small, and battered up. So I just tossed it!
I even typed out a care sheet for him.

 

[Cait0420]

Good for you! It's great that you're standing your ground, he'll get over it eventually

 

[Psychobunny]

I used to raise leopard geckos, years ago. My nephew loved those too, and I gave him 2 males, which he did take very good care of, and followed my instructions to the letter.
But that was when he was a kid, not even teenage yet.
Now, he has a "night life" with his friends. Comes home at 4am, and sleeps till 2pm!!!!

 

[Psychobunny]

Got phone message this morning from him Mom. They want to know if they reimburse me the money I spent on the vet (almost $400) would I give the cham back??

I haven't replied yet, adds a new twist to this dilemma

 

[Cait0420]

That's a tough one. I would explain why u took him in the first place, maybe then he'll understand

 

[little leaf]

my thoughts - NO NO NO ! that cham would be DEAD had you not taken him- why did he not take it to the vet ? it is not fair for him ( the poor cham ) to be put back in the hands of someone like that - and next time- he will NOT bring him to you , for fear you wont give it back a 2nd time - PLEASE do not give him back the cham- he has no rights to it if you ask me - he brought you basically a living CORPS - I know it is hard to "eat" the vet bill - I get so many sick chams/ critters brought to me- I have to eat many vet bills ( try some salt on it - helps it go down better ) but I tell the ppl when they bring them here - you are SURRENDERING it - not bring it here to get better - getting it back so you can have a 2nd go at it - I know its a bit different w/ a 501c3 VS family - but he is not a little kid-he should know better ! I would maybe sell him if you do not have the room, and it will help get back some of the cost on the bill - but only to someone who will care for him - and do you really want to hear you gave it back, and then he killed it - you are an AWESOME keeper- I think in your heart you know giving it back is wrong - and just need some support in your decision- WE SUPPORT YOU !!!

 

[Cait0420]

I agree not to give it back but also explain to him exactly why you aren't giving him back

 

[Psychobunny]

my thoughts - NO NO NO ! that cham would be DEAD had you not taken him- why did he not take it to the vet ? it is not fair for him ( the poor cham ) to be put back in the hands of someone like that - and next time- he will NOT bring him to you , for fear you wont give it back a 2nd time - PLEASE do not give him back the cham- he has no rights to it if you ask me - he brought you basically a living CORPS - I know it is hard to "eat" the vet bill - I get so many sick chams/ critters brought to me- I have to eat many vet bills ( try some salt on it - helps it go down better ) but I tell the ppl when they bring them here - you are SURRENDERING it - not bring it here to get better - getting it back so you can have a 2nd go at it - I know its a bit different w/ a 501c3 VS family - but he is not a little kid-he should know better ! I would maybe sell him if you do not have the room, and it will help get back some of the cost on the bill - but only to someone who will care for him - and do you really want to hear you gave it back, and then he killed it - you are an AWESOME keeper- I think in your heart you know giving it back is wrong - and just need some support in your decision- WE SUPPORT YOU !!!

That's what I'm afraid of. If I give it back, and it gets sick again, he will never come to me, or even admit it!!
I don't think his mom would even tell me if the cham died, but my brother would!!
I think I will keep the cham. I have money and time invested in him, and he is just now starting to eat on his own (but not while I'm watching).
He is doing well eating from his "Sunny D death trap" crick feeder.
But he still runs and hides when I approach.

I think his untamed, wild behavior is maybe why Richie lost interest!!??

He was expecting a tame, friendly pet. Not one that has a temper, and may bite him!!??
The cham was much more people friendly when I gave it to him. I don't know what happened. Richie probably didn't work with him as he was told.
He saw my taming blog, I even printed it out for him!!!

 

[little leaf]

I think I will keep the cham.

YAY I think you are doing the right thing - in both NOT giving him back, and keeping him

 

[Psychobunny]

Thanks, I still feel a little....odd and disturbed about this.

Mean old Uncle Psychobunny just got taken off someone's Christmas list!! LOL

 

[MelissaB]

They'll get over it. I think you'd feel even worse if you gave him back and something bad happened. He can always come visit him at your house, provided you can trust him not to try to grab him and run.

 

[sandrachameleon]

I havent read the entire thread, mostly just the opening post - pls forgive if I am repeating or missing half the story

I wonder if having a very honest discussion with your nephew would help. Explain that the animal was not well cared for before, and your concerns that if you give it back the same will happen again. Go over the husbandry that it received and point by point explain what was lacking and what would need to be done better. Explain that you cannot in good conscience give the animal back until you are assured it will not suffer.

Have the Nephew pay for the vet bill - if hes not willing to pay for the vet care, its likely he doesnt value the chams life and may never do so. But if he does pay, that shows something positive

Perhaps have Nephew prove himself by coming to your home and assisting with cham duties on a regular (daily?) basis to show commitment (if you dont live too far from each other). Or an agreement (perhaps in writing) that you will visit weekly to help / check up on the animal.

He is of course mad that you arent giving the animal back - you gave it to him, it therefore belongs to him - irregardless of whether or not you think he will kill it. That's the terrible misfortune of pet ownership - many people do not properly care for their pets.

But maybe if you come to some agreement that you could both live with, it will ease the friction and save both your family relationship and the animal?

 

[Hoj]

I feel for you. Sounds like the Cham would be better off with you.
But I do understand second chances. Is there anyway you can insure propose care like insisting on the purchase of a misting system timers and what not to make sure the very basics are being taken care of. As well a possibly reg visits to check on the lil guy ( if they are close enough ) or maybe a blog by him or weekly emails and pics to prove he is doing right by the Cham.