Cham was fine first week but down hill

[dastone181]

ok guys first few days my cham was fine, then he stopped eating this week, hes starting to get skinny and i can see his spine/ribs, the other day i saw him eating some worms but that was when i walked into the room he saw me and stopped eating, i havent noticed him eating since, i really worried tho...the worms were pheonyx worms by the way...he hasnt touched pin head crickets in since i last saw him fully eat..he hates me i think by the way, when i try and take him out of the cage hes horrible, once i get him out he crawls up my arm, yesterday he went onto the top of my head ..BUT im worried so PLEASE help

 

[Scooter]

In order for someone to give you some good advice, you need to give us some more info. Like, how old is your cham, what kind and size cage is he/she in, what lighting are you using, what are the average temps in the cage, what kind of vitamins are you using, and how often, what is your misting schedule, and oh yeah, what kind of cham do you have ? Look at the suggestions for posting with a health problem, and answer all those questions, and someone can better answer you.

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

Congratulations on the new member of your family! What species of chameleon do you have?

What comes to mind first (to me) is temperature and lighting. As scooter sad, give us a rundown on your cage/lighting/feeding etc. and someone here will no doubt get to the bottom of it.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but just to let you know: It's not always a good idea to be handling a new cham, unless they are a rescue effort or have some other health problem that requires nursing care. Handling, and taking out of the cage, can be very stressful. The chameleon is giving its attention to learning its cage environment and assessing its own safety. Initially, with a new cham, feedings and mistings are done with as little personal contact as possible. During this period the cham will most likely not even want to look at you (except from behind some hiding place). He may spend a lot of time climbing the walls of his cage, alternated with periods of hiding. THis can go on for several days or even weeks (altho probably about 1 week is a good average). If you respect his space, and his body language, you give him a sense of control of his territory. This helps him establish self confidence, and helps him develop a balanced personality. Eventually most (but not all, unfortunately) chameleons will calm down. And some chameleons will then begin looking at the front of the cage when you appear and showing interest in their keeper (and what goodie he/she has brought to offer). After that some owners begin to develop a relationship with their cham by slowly offering it food by hand.

 

[Chase]

ok guys first few days my cham was fine, then he stopped eating this week, hes starting to get skinny and i can see his spine/ribs, the other day i saw him eating some worms but that was when i walked into the room he saw me and stopped eating, i havent noticed him eating since, i really worried tho...the worms were pheonyx worms by the way...he hasnt touched pin head crickets in since i last saw him fully eat..he hates me i think by the way, when i try and take him out of the cage hes horrible, once i get him out he crawls up my arm, yesterday he went onto the top of my head ..BUT im worried so PLEASE help

Thats not good. How big is he.

 

[LunaC]

he hasnt touched pin head crickets ... when i try and take him out of the cage hes horrible, once i get him out he crawls up my arm, yesterday he went onto the top of my head

If you have to feed him pinheads, then obviously he's very small, very young .. which could be part of the problem.
The other problem is handling him. When he crawls to the top of your head he's trying to escape. Chams travel up to escape predation. In his little eyes you are just one giant threat. Since he's a new arrival, he needs privacy and time to acclimate, especially if he's so small he has to eat pinheads. Feed him, provide plenty of drinking water and then give him privacy.
Also, it's not uncommon for the ribs of young chams to protrude slightly. That said, there's a fine line between seeing ribs and seeing a malnourished cham.

As already requested, please provide more info re: cham species and age, cage type and size; UVB source and style/brand; heat source type and basking/ambient temps; hydration methods and schedule; supplements.
If possible a pic of your cage & cham would be really helpful.

 

[joefarah]

Pics of the setup please!

Keeping my fingers crossed for you in the meantime...

 

[dastone181]

srry shoulda put more info up on him, hes a male veiled, hes probably 3-4 months...i was just told to get him pinhead crickets..hes about3-4 inches long w/ tail curled up..his cage is big, like 30 inch down, 16 deep and 30 wide, i realize its a big cage, but i tried cupfeeding him and that worked good until this week, he wont touch anything, lighting is a 5.0 reptisun i think and the heating is a compact ceramic bulb...i NEVER see him basking anymore, hes been on the back part of the cage, the mesh part, hes on it right now actually, does have a regular sleeping spot tho. I was thinking..hes next to a window and can clearly see a big green bush thats planted by the window, its touching the window its so close (this is outside i mean)...can he see the bush outside so he wants to climb on it or something? the temps are...ok now im pissed..i walk in there and the basking light isnt even on...who knows for how long!..the switch was on but this happened to me once before..the switch is on but it just turns off for some reason..i might have to buy another bulb...the damn ceramic bulb doesnt give off light so i was screwed...well i put one in from another cage i have...hes warmin up in there..2 inches directly beow is like 93-95F..he has a fake plant that he can use to get lower or higher under the baskinglight..to temp regulate...i hope that helps, i desperately need hep

 

[dodolah]

post a pic of your cage please.
One problem that i have is your ceramic heat.
Just get regular bulb as basking lamp.
or if you want to get a specific (more expensive just for a slightly better job) is the zoo med basking spot lamp (i use 75 watt one).

How about the humidity?
and supplement?

 

[LunaC]

In addition to changing the ceramic heat emitter to a regular household bulb, he probably should be eating larger crix. At 3-4 inches he should be able to take 3/8" or small end
1/4" crix. The general rule of thumb is to offer feeders no longer than the width of the cham's head.

Also, a heat element just 2" above a cham could result in unintentional thermal burns.

 

[Chase]

srry shoulda put more info up on him, hes a male veiled, hes probably 3-4 months...i was just told to get him pinhead crickets..hes about3-4 inches long w/ tail curled up..his cage is big, like 30 inch down, 16 deep and 30 wide, i realize its a big cage, but i tried cupfeeding him and that worked good until this week, he wont touch anything, lighting is a 5.0 reptisun i think and the heating is a compact ceramic bulb...i NEVER see him basking anymore, hes been on the back part of the cage, the mesh part, hes on it right now actually, does have a regular sleeping spot tho. I was thinking..hes next to a window and can clearly see a big green bush thats planted by the window, its touching the window its so close (this is outside i mean)...can he see the bush outside so he wants to climb on it or something? the temps are...ok now im pissed..i walk in there and the basking light isnt even on...who knows for how long!..the switch was on but this happened to me once before..the switch is on but it just turns off for some reason..i might have to buy another bulb...the damn ceramic bulb doesnt give off light so i was screwed...well i put one in from another cage i have...hes warmin up in there..2 inches directly beow is like 93-95F..he has a fake plant that he can use to get lower or higher under the baskinglight..to temp regulate...i hope that helps, i desperately need hep

Move him up to 1/4-1/2'' crickets. Pinheads are very small. Its amazing that he even trys to eat them because they are so small.

 

[dastone181]

ok when i go today ill get u said 1/4 in? crickets? ok...for 2 days straight he got very little misting to be honoest...that was my fault i got caught up in family stuff..as for dusting i have MINER-ALL I...i try and dust the crix..but its not like hes eating them..and on the visible bones part...its not noticeable from like 2 feet away..u have to be looking very hard to see it but its still visible and worries me..hes always dark colors and crawling around on the mesh of the cage..im thinking..should i get a smaller cage and just put some crix in instead of keeping large cage and cup feeding..cuz they crawl out of the cups in about 10 min..and he wont show any interest in them...and i just realized that the crix arent pinhead...well some are..some can go about 1/4 inch..its a variation..im guessing the rep store breeds them there..i dont have a humidity gauge..my dads the person who will trust what the store says more than what i say..and i researched for like 2-3 weeks on veileds..and he says if they say we dont need a humidity gauge then we dont need one..but he showed some interest in pheonyx worms like i said..but he will NOT eat around me anyore..it sucks cuz the first 2 days he ate from hand ..and for the light ur saying i could take a regular house hold bulb?

 

[kinyonga]

Are his eyes open or shut most of the time?

Are you gutloading the insects? How often do you use the minerall I? Do you not use a phos.-free calcium powder or vitamins?

Is he pooping?
Do you have a substrate in the cage?

What is the temperature in the basking area? The rest of the cage?

 

[dodolah]

ok when i go today ill get u said 1/4 in? crickets? ok...for 2 days straight he got very little misting to be honoest...that was my fault i got caught up in family stuff..as for dusting i have MINER-ALL I...i try and dust the crix..but its not like hes eating them..and on the visible bones part...its not noticeable from like 2 feet away..u have to be looking very hard to see it but its still visible and worries me..hes always dark colors and crawling around on the mesh of the cage..im thinking..should i get a smaller cage and just put some crix in instead of keeping large cage and cup feeding..cuz they crawl out of the cups in about 10 min..and he wont show any interest in them...and i just realized that the crix arent pinhead...well some are..some can go about 1/4 inch..its a variation..im guessing the rep store breeds them there..i dont have a humidity gauge..my dads the person who will trust what the store says more than what i say..and i researched for like 2-3 weeks on veileds..and he says if they say we dont need a humidity gauge then we dont need one..but he showed some interest in pheonyx worms like i said..but he will NOT eat around me anyore..it sucks cuz the first 2 days he ate from hand ..and for the light ur saying i could take a regular house hold bulb?

all of these can be confirm with pictures.
Do u have any access to a camera that you can upload to show us this "skinny" chameleon?
Humidity gauge is very important to monitor your chameleon's health.
Mainly for his respiration system.
without it, you will be forever guessing what's wrong with your chameleon.
Perhaps your father can be persuaded if you tell him your chameleon is sick.
I think hygrometer is a lot cheaper than a veterinarian treatment.

Walmart and Lowes has a very affordable digital thermometer with hygrometer built in.
and yes, regular household bulb (75 watt).

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

ok when i go today ill get u said 1/4 in? crickets? ok...for 2 days straight he got very little misting to be honoest...that was my fault i got caught up in family stuff..as for dusting i have MINER-ALL I...i try and dust the crix..but its not like hes eating them..and on the visible bones part...its not noticeable from like 2 feet away..u have to be looking very hard to see it but its still visible and worries me..hes always dark colors and crawling around on the mesh of the cage..im thinking..should i get a smaller cage and just put some crix in instead of keeping large cage and cup feeding..cuz they crawl out of the cups in about 10 min..and he wont show any interest in them...and i just realized that the crix arent pinhead...well some are..some can go about 1/4 inch..its a variation..im guessing the rep store breeds them there..i dont have a humidity gauge..my dads the person who will trust what the store says more than what i say..and i researched for like 2-3 weeks on veileds..and he says if they say we dont need a humidity gauge then we dont need one..but he showed some interest in pheonyx worms like i said..but he will NOT eat around me anyore..it sucks cuz the first 2 days he ate from hand ..and for the light ur saying i could take a regular house hold bulb?

Don't be discouraged. This is probably all very fixable. Answer Kinyonga's questions and she'll be able to help you alot. He perhaps has just seen a bit too much of people for now. Giving him his own space and privacy will likely help. And, larger crickets. The rib-showing thing is likely from him trying to make himself thin and smaller in order to hide from you when you observe him. They all do that. Next thing you know, they relax, and the ribs disappear. But, you do need to be sure he's eating and pooping.

 

[dastone181]

Are his eyes open or shut most of the time?

Are you gutloading the insects? How often do you use the minerall I? Do you not use a phos.-free calcium powder or vitamins?

Is he pooping?
Do you have a substrate in the cage?

What is the temperature in the basking area? The rest of the cage?

His eyes are usually open unless hes sleeping(which is at night obviously) i use minerall about 3 times a week...i do not have any other supplements at the moment..a list of and where to buy them online would be nice..yes hes pooping as far as i can tell..i see the poop on the ground and on the leaves..no he does not have substrate..

 

[dastone181]

all of these can be confirm with pictures.
Do u have any access to a camera that you can upload to show us this "skinny" chameleon?
Humidity gauge is very important to monitor your chameleon's health.
Mainly for his respiration system.
without it, you will be forever guessing what's wrong with your chameleon.
Perhaps your father can be persuaded if you tell him your chameleon is sick.
I think hygrometer is a lot cheaper than a veterinarian treatment.

Walmart and Lowes has a very affordable digital thermometer with hygrometer built in.
and yes, regular household bulb (75 watt).

i Will be posting pictures of him later today when my mum gets home..shes the comp freak

 

[dodolah]

i Will be posting pictures of him later today when my mum gets home..shes the comp freak

cool!
I'll try my best to spot any concerns and give you some of advices.
(sometimes i realize my way of spotting concerns might sound harsh to people.
but, just so you know, i am not judging anyone. I tend to get passionate when it deals with chameleon).

take pics of the cage (the whole thing). not part of it here and there.
Get the shots of your cham at different angles. Some close ups are nice if you have some concern over a specific body part.
and Try your best not to give blurry pics... Blurry pics are equal to ambiguous sentences.

 

[Dave Weldon]

Howdy,

Sorry if I missed it somewhere in your posts, but how is he getting water and how much of it is he drinking? I'd suggest that if you are not seeing him drink then try using a pump-up hand mist unit with very warm water. Sneak-up on him starting with a little water on his tail. Little by little end-up with him getting a nice, constant mist over his entire body as if he was in the middle of a light rain. He may run from it at first but they usually begin to enjoy the warmth and water and drink if they are thirsty. It may take 5-10-15-20 minutes of being misted before he drinks even if he is very thirsty. You want mister that pumps-up with pressure so that you can provide a constant flow not a trigger-pump, squirt-squirt sprayer. I like the one in the middle: http://rlflomaster.com/sprayers/hand.htm They sell for about $7. Home Depot carries a different model but similar results anyway. Plan on draining away a quart of water after a good session .

What part of the world are you located?

 

[dastone181]

Howdy,

Sorry if I missed it somewhere in your posts, but how is he getting water and how much of it is he drinking? I'd suggest that if you are not seeing him drink then try using a pump-up hand mist unit with very warm water. Sneak-up on him starting with a little water on his tail. Little by little end-up with him getting a nice, constant mist over his entire body as if he was in the middle of a light rain. He may run from it at first but they usually begin to enjoy the warmth and water and drink if they are thirsty. It may take 5-10-15-20 minutes of being misted before he drinks even if he is very thirsty. You want mister that pumps-up with pressure so that you can provide a constant flow not a trigger-pump, squirt-squirt sprayer. I like the one in the middle: http://rlflomaster.com/sprayers/hand.htm They sell for about $7. Home Depot carries a different model but similar results anyway. Plan on draining away a quart of water after a good session .

What part of the world are you located?

im in southern california..ill try that full on body mist thanks

 

[dastone181]

cool!
I'll try my best to spot any concerns and give you some of advices.
(sometimes i realize my way of spotting concerns might sound harsh to people.
but, just so you know, i am not judging anyone. I tend to get passionate when it deals with chameleon).

take pics of the cage (the whole thing). not part of it here and there.
Get the shots of your cham at different angles. Some close ups are nice if you have some concern over a specific body part.
and Try your best not to give blurry pics... Blurry pics are equal to ambiguous sentences.

ok the pic files are like 2.13 and they have to be 2.0 to post..how do i downsize them? iv been tryin for 15 min to get a pic in my gallery and it wont work