chams outside in florida this time of yr?

[DAD3886]

my cham has really seemed to enjoy being in the actual sun the last few days do you all think it would be a ok move to see how he does in his enclosure outside but within my screens porch?

 

[Thompson]

Well first the porch probably wouldn't be a good idea since people like to steal, and that's easy pickings since he'll be right in front of your house. Also you have to look at weather, how hot is it going to be? Will it be really windy? Will there be any storms? If you're going to leave him outside for an extended amount of time he needs morning sun and in the afternoon he needs mostly shade. I wouldn't keep a chameleon outside during the day unattended so If you are usually home in the morning then that's perfect. I wouldn't take a chameleon outside in temps above 90 degrees either. Make sure he gets lots and lots of water while outside.

 

[jannb]

my cham has really seemed to enjoy being in the actual sun the last few days do you all think it would be a ok move to see how he does in his enclosure outside but within my screens porch?

Way too hot this time of the year even in the shade. A little one can over heat very quickly. I am able to get mine out a couple of hours in the evening but not in the direct sun, in the shade. I also have mine on trees outside.

In a cage outside it gets really hot. They also need a cooler area to cool off and the whole cage outside it hot. Do you have a temp gun?

 

[james L]

I and many others keep chams outside in FL most to all of the year. FL is a large state with many different niches. If your cham seems pleased with being outdoors, then you should keep him/her outdoors. Nothing beats natural sunshine and FL's high humidity. Remember to keep an eye on it. If it starts to stress from the weather then its time to bring it back in.
On a side note, there are many speices of wild chams (mainly veileds) showing up here and there in FL. FL's weather seems to do them well!

 

[VeiledChams]

I keep my adult veiled outside in the shade. He gets direct sunlight in the later afternoon when the temps are in the mid 80's. I also have the cobra mister (the S shaped misters from home depot) aimed at a portion of his cage so he gets plenty of water, but also has a dry place to be. I keep that running for an hour in the morning and another hour in the afternoon.

 

[fluxlizard]

My temp today (southern VA) is 93 miami it is 85.

Mine are out 24/7 for a couple of weeks or more now and today they are doing fine.

I keep them outside all summer every summer since the mid 90s without problems- as long as night temps remain above 50 they are out.

You can keep outside - you just need to make sure they can cool down (I use patio misters in part of each terrarium so they have dry and sunny, dry and shade, wet and shade and wet and sunny. I provide this nearly all day long- I don't like forcing them to sun or shade at certain times of the day- it is best to make sure they have all options available at all times. The mist I only turn on in the heat of the day- my area that is anywhere from 11 am to 8 pm depending on the day and conditions in the forcast. Of course I keep mellers as well as veileds and panthers- if it was panthers only it would be less hours of mist and veileds only it would be far, far less as they enjoy the heat. Plus when the misters cool the air in part of the terraria that are dry simply by evaporative cooling effect.

Storms and wind- no problem. Mine do great in storms and wind every summer for years- and some ferocious storms. The chameleons have great grip plus can shelter in the plants- just make sure the cage is securely fastened down and nothing can blow over and fall on it. I use tables with supports that cannot blow over and tie the cages to the tables.

I agree with leaving unattended to a point- I wouldn't do it until you have experience with your chameleon outside in different kinds of extreme weather like hot or storms so you can be there to keep an eye on things until you know you have your environment set up properly for your lizard and he's OK. After you know what you are doing and your enclosure is secure- no big deal.

As far as security goes- each situation is different. I live in the country so my concern
here is more wild animals. Keeping the cages up on tables has prevented problems. I had a cage that went to the ground many years ago that a raccoon cut into and ate a clutch of dilepis. Simply raising on low tables solved that. My other problem was a 5 year old boy who lived down the street who opened and released a bunch of corrucia one year. He moved away and problem was solved... That's it since the mid 90s. The coon was in town too- not here when I moved, but here I have seen possums, skunks, some kind of short tailed wild rat, mice, coyotes, roaming dogs, roaming house cats, large birds including some kind of falcon that nests on our property most years, and even a bobcat. None of them have bothered my enclosures...

 

[jannb]

The OP's cham is a baby he just got. It was sold to him as 4 months old but looks more like a 2 month old. I live in FL and use a digital temp gun and in the small screen cages it gets up over 100 real quick. Already once this year I measured the temps at 115 in an outside cage but there was no cham in it.

 

[carol5208]

The OP's cham is a baby he just got. It was sold to him as 4 months old but looks more like a 2 month old. I live in FL and use a digital temp gun and in the small screen cages it gets up over 100 real quick. Already once this year I measured the temps at 115 in an outside cage but there was no cham in it.

Jann, I agree, for a young cham it is just too hot outside. Romeo does go outside alot during the day but I, or someone in my family is here to monitor him all the time to see if he is overheating. I put him out early in the morning and like you, later in the evening for sun and sometimes in between if it is a breezy day and we mist him alot also to cool him off.

 

[fluxlizard]

Well, I put mine outside during the summer as soon as they hatch.

Day 1 if it's 95 like last summer when veileds were hatching, they go outside. My baby panthers arrived at the beginning of the summer and they were so small they were shipped in ketchup cups. Temps were like today- low 90s. They were unpacked into outside cages. They did great and I've got eggs incubating from that pair.

Who turns on the AC in nature I wonder?

I'm not saying put them in 95 degrees and don't let them escape it.

I'm also not saying pick the cage up and put it in the middle of the yard without some thought, planning and followup observation to make certain you are providing for your lizard's needs and you don't heat stress or kill it.

A proper setup will allow them to escape the heat. My setup does this by providing shade, and a cool mist during the hot hours. Of course they also have access to the heat. Even baby lizards know how to thermoregulate.

For example since the chameleon is 4 months old- I put my babies in 30 gallon reptariums laid on their sides (for easy access to food insects in all directions. I fill them with twigs so they can move throughout the entire enclosures and use the thermal gradients set up within. Over the top of the south end I place a board which covers at least half of the top, providing shade below and to the north. Direct sunlight is available if the babies move very close to the south side, and if they move up near the top of the north side. A patio mist nozzle cools and provides water in about half of the enclosure, providing mist in shade and sun, while leaving some shade and sun dry.

Temps last summer hit the mid 90s many many days here, and near 100 a few times. Everything was fine.

This system has worked fine since the mid 90s when I first started keeping things outside 24/7 during the summer.

But of course, indoors is always a safe bet...

I'm not trying to argue against safety, I'm just trying to point out that it can be done safely if care is taken.

 

[carol5208]

Well, I put mine outside during the summer as soon as they hatch.

Day 1 if it's 95 like last summer when veileds were hatching, they go outside. My baby panthers arrived at the beginning of the summer and they were so small they were shipped in ketchup cups. Temps were like today- low 90s. They were unpacked into outside cages. They did great and I've got eggs incubating from that pair.

Who turns on the AC in nature I wonder?

I'm not saying put them in 95 degrees and don't let them escape it.

I'm also not saying pick the cage up and put it in the middle of the yard without some thought, planning and followup observation to make certain you are providing for your lizard's needs and you don't heat stress or kill it.

A proper setup will allow them to escape the heat. My setup does this by providing shade, and a cool mist during the hot hours. Of course they also have access to the heat. Even baby lizards know how to thermoregulate.

For example since the chameleon is 4 months old- I put my babies in 30 gallon reptariums laid on their sides (for easy access to food insects in all directions. I fill them with twigs so they can move throughout the entire enclosures and use the thermal gradients set up within. Over the top of the south end I place a board which covers at least half of the top, providing shade below and to the north. Direct sunlight is available if the babies move very close to the south side, and if they move up near the top of the north side. A patio mist nozzle cools and provides water in about half of the enclosure, providing mist in shade and sun, while leaving some shade and sun dry.

Temps last summer hit the mid 90s many many days here, and near 100 a few times. Everything was fine.

This system has worked fine since the mid 90s when I first started keeping things outside 24/7 during the summer.

But of course, indoors is always a safe bet...

I'm not trying to argue against safety, I'm just trying to point out that it can be done safely if care is taken.

Well I guess you cannot argue with experience then!! I just would just be a nervous wreck all day checking on them constantly. What part of Florida do you live in????

 

[jannb]

Well, I put mine outside during the summer as soon as they hatch.

Day 1 if it's 95 like last summer when veileds were hatching, they go outside. My baby panthers arrived at the beginning of the summer and they were so small they were shipped in ketchup cups. Temps were like today- low 90s. They were unpacked into outside cages. They did great and I've got eggs incubating from that pair.

Who turns on the AC in nature I wonder?

I'm not saying put them in 95 degrees and don't let them escape it.

I'm also not saying pick the cage up and put it in the middle of the yard without some thought, planning and followup observation to make certain you are providing for your lizard's needs and you don't heat stress or kill it.

A proper setup will allow them to escape the heat. My setup does this by providing shade, and a cool mist during the hot hours. Of course they also have access to the heat. Even baby lizards know how to thermoregulate.

For example since the chameleon is 4 months old- I put my babies in 30 gallon reptariums laid on their sides (for easy access to food insects in all directions. I fill them with twigs so they can move throughout the entire enclosures and use the thermal gradients set up within. Over the top of the south end I place a board which covers at least half of the top, providing shade below and to the north. Direct sunlight is available if the babies move very close to the south side, and if they move up near the top of the north side. A patio mist nozzle cools and provides water in about half of the enclosure, providing mist in shade and sun, while leaving some shade and sun dry.

Temps last summer hit the mid 90s many many days here, and near 100 a few times. Everything was fine.

This system has worked fine since the mid 90s when I first started keeping things outside 24/7 during the summer.

But of course, indoors is always a safe bet...

I'm not trying to argue against safety, I'm just trying to point out that it can be done safely if care is taken.

An experienced keeper knowing how to set up properly might be able to keep chams outside but most keepers here asking this question are new and some of them can barely get the set up correct for inside and I just hate to see them put the inside cage outside and cook their cham......which I see on here every summer since I've joined. I've even seen a fairly experienced keeper put the cages outside and come home with three dead gorgeous panthers. It's kind of like keeping them in glass. Some experienced keeper can control the heat and humidity but I ALWAYS recommend screen to new keepers.....I see them here all the time with the 100 watt bulb in a glass tank. I'm only looking out for the chameleons.

 

[DAD3886]

sorry for my delaying my response from these reponses.No i dont have a temp gun im just going off a digital gauge .Im not to worried about predators or someone stealing my cham.We live on a 15acres and no one even knows we leave there so.. Yes i wouldnt want to risk my little buddys health.I live in central florida north of tampa ive be bringing him out around 8am till about 12pm.then i was bringing him back in the plant im using is halfway in the sun(pretty heavy amount) then the other half is in the shade.I was misting the plant about every hr just to keep everything ok.The only thing is my buddy hates getting wet and when i bring him out he avoids being brought back in...he just seems reallly bright green when outside.hes green inside but he tends to stay alittle more brown inside.the room hes in doesnt have high traffic and i dont handle him unless it is to bring him in or out or the day he escaped his cage (inside)

 

[carol5208]

the choice is yours on what to do. Just monitor him outside if that is what you decide. I keep my chameleon outside for a good part of the day but I am constantly checking on him. I also bring him in the house to cool off also. It can be done, but you need to be smart about it. Like JannB said there have been sad stories on here about people putting there chameleons outside. When I was researching a breeder I talked with one and he had this beautiful chameleon on his website that had died. I asked him what had happened and he told me he had put it outside, his sister got in a car accident, he ran to the hospital, forgot about the cham and when he came home the sun had moved and the cage was all exposed and the chameleon was dead. This was an experienced person and this happened. Just be smart and aware is about all I can say if you decide to house outside.

 

[DAD3886]

yea not sure maybe ill just try the fews hrs a day on the wekends see how they goes i dont want to cause my buddy problems.also like i said he does not want to go back inside once out and he avoids me at all cost where he actually "jumped" from my hands and thank god i was able to stretch so he grab his umbrella plant.. just dont want to oevr stress either

 

[fluxlizard]

An experienced keeper knowing how to set up properly might be able to keep chams outside but most keepers here asking this question are new and some of them can barely get the set up correct for inside and I just hate to see them put the inside cage outside and cook their cham......which I see on here every summer since I've joined. I've even seen a fairly experienced keeper put the cages outside and come home with three dead gorgeous panthers.

I agree with the point of safety. I don't mean to push people to do one way or another, only to say it is possible and explain how to do so if someone wishes to do it. It isn't rocket science, it's pretty simple and basic. (well maybe the above isn't quite true- I would encourage anyone who wants to give it a try who hasn't tried it to give it a careful go and see if they can come up with results that the lizard likes and if they see the benefit in their lizard).

There's only one way to gain experience though, and that's to do something and then evaluate the results.

Which is why I also say, don't be like that "fairly experienced keeper" and put your chameleon outside at first when you will not be home to monitor the situation throughout the day. Be home the first time you expose your lizard outdoors when extremes occur to monitor those as well- like extreme heat, extreme storms, etc. If you can't, then bring him in until those situations pass and you can be home to monitor them in the future.

At first you have to put your evaluations very close together or you might have a final evaluation of failure before you can tweak the situation. Later as more experience is gained, evaluations can be made farther and farther apart and in extreme situations.

When I was researching a breeder I talked with one and he had this beautiful chameleon on his website that had died. I asked him what had happened and he told me he had put it outside, his sister got in a car accident, he ran to the hospital, forgot about the cham and when he came home the sun had moved and the cage was all exposed and the chameleon was dead. This was an experienced person and this happened.

IMO the breeder was very stupid about his outdoor housing and did not know enough about what he was doing. That isn't to say the breeder was not intelligent, we are all humans and we all make mistakes. But what he was doing by putting his chameleon into an environment that could fail so easily was stupid, and shows a lack of basic understanding of the needs of his lizards or careful consideration of how to meet those needs outdoors.

I would not call his setup even competent if it could fail simply because the sun moves during the day. The sun moves everyday for crying out loud. I would not call this a true outdoor setup- more like a sunning station for a couple hours of use... In my opinion, this kind of setup is asking for trouble because it counts on the fact that the keeper will not forget about the lizard or that the keeper can trust the environment to remain stable when it is in use.

It's kind of like keeping them in glass. Some experienced keeper can control the heat and humidity but I ALWAYS recommend screen to new keepers...

Well, that's a different topic so I probably shouldn't go there, but I'll bite anyway. Any keeper with moderate intelligence and a modest understanding of the thermoregulatory needs of a lizard could control the heat and humidity in a glass enclosure. It isn't rocket science. I didn't use screen enclosures until years after I began keeping breeding chameleons in the early 90s. I used glass as a brand new beginner with great success to breed my first several species. And at first even in the mid 90s I only used screen outdoors.

The environmental needs of the chameleon remains the same whether it is indoors or outdoors or screen or glass. It has to be able to find heat and cool, moisture and dry, full spectrum light and shade. Meet those needs and the lizard will be fine no matter where you are keeping it.

If you do not meet those needs, you will fail whether indoors or out, glass or screen.

In spite of my argument- outdoors things are more extreme, and if you cannot take that into account or are not comfortable taking that into account, then indoors is a safe bet. I'm not trying to push anyone out of their comfort zone with their own animals. My argument is with the idea that with temps in the 90s it cannot be safely done with a minimum of planning and considerate design...

 

[jastate09]

I live in FL and the sun is very intense here, more so that other parts of the country. I'm like Carol and take mine out a couple hours in the morning and again in the evening when I'm home. I have no shade because my yard consists of concrete and a pool. The few times I have been on here lately there seems to be quite a few new members and it must be allot of kids, I hope these are kids, because I'm seeing more sick chameleons than ever and the keeper are not listening or understanding general husbandry. Over and over one of the senior members kept explaining supplementing and gut loading and I don't think the kid ever understood. I know he never understood the lighting. I also wonder what happen with the egg bound female that the kid posted wanting to know if after the eggs were laid could he buy a male to fertilize the eggs. These kids have got to get the basic first and after reading a few of these recent posts, some never do and I’m not referring to DAD 3886, just speaking in general.

 

[DAD3886]

well thanks no generally when told so i do so.This has been to long of a time coming and i dont want to loose the animal/time/effort etc by not lsitening.No im not a kid im 25 with a five yr old so..Basically it wasnt meant as a post saying hey this is what im going to do.I wanted to get responses and answers.As for now im going to wait on him being permantly on my porch Im just going to let him chill out there for a few a.m. hrs on the weekends..I do keep a very close eye on him..im looking about every 15min lol its more nerveracking then anything

 

[carol5208]

Flux, I agree with you that that was very careless behavior on their part. I was very surprised when he told me that, coming from someone with experience. I am not going to name names, but I remember the story very well.

 

[Julirs]

My two cents: I live right outside of Tampa and I have stopped keeping outside after dealing with respiratory infections and mouth rot. I had been keeping them outside of my lanai, under the overhang of the roof where they mostly were getting indirect sunlight. They were also by the pool. I also battled rats that luckily did not ever eat a cham, but ate into the aluminum cage. I can also only imagine that rats and squirrels peed onto the cages possibly causing issues. I think if one is set up correctly, with good airflow, cages up off the ground, and auto-misters it is entirely possible. Personally I do not want to deal with the issues since I have a less than perfect environment. Days and days of 100% humidity and near 100 degree temps are just not the best possible environment in a cage.