Falling Chameleons

Kitdragon2000

New Member
Hey all, So I just got back from an extended trip, had someone come in to watch all my animals. He did the Crappiest job EVER! I am lucky my smaller animals are alive! My 2 chameleons keep falling! Iv been home for about 24 hours, they ate a TON of crickets and drank a Lot of water :mad:, 2 of the blubs were out, 1 light and 1 night. But the babies I have noticed have fallen at least 5 times since iv been home… especially the female! The floor is linoleum, should I pad it with soil or something? But what can I do if anything other than what I have already done? I changed everything, fed, and watered, ext? Keep trying to attach the pictures i took, but its not working. :mad: in the meantime I filled out the form below.

Chameleon Info:
Species: Veiled
Sex: 1 Male & 1 Female
Age: both 7 mo old
Handling: I try to handle them at least once a day, usually just a few minuets.
Feeding Amount: about 20 lrg crickets (each chameleon) every am. Depending on how many crickets are left I may put in another 10 or so in the PM
Crickets: Large, they get the orange cubes all the time, as well as calcium right veggies and fruits when I have them.
Supplements: calcium w/o D3 Every PM
Calcium w/ D3 Every other week
Multi Vitamin Every other week
Watering: Monsoon R400 times to go off every 6 hours for a duration of 18 sec.
Fecal: I have not seen one since I have been back, but before I left they were healthy looking brown as well as healthy looking white.
History: No problems until now, got them from a reputable breeder in the area. Both are from the same hatching, but they are separated so no breeding possibilities. My male has been acting different since I have been back, He’s now hissing and trying to bite me when before he would let me pick him up without a problem. Possibly the not handling for the weeks iv been gone?

Cage Info:
Cage Type: Screen, handmade, 4ft tall by 2ft wide for both sides, with a wooden pegboard.
Lighting: Zilla Daylight 50w & Night 50w on both sides. Both on in the day, night on at night. They also get natural direct light (through screen) every morning, and afternoon I try to put them outside as much as possible, when it’s a good temp outside. (In a smaller screen cage.)
Temp: Floor gets between 60 – 71, Mid cage 75-83, Top 84-90. All measured with specific thermometers for cages.
Humidity: around 70-80%
Plants: I have live and fake plants. Each side has a Dracaena fragrans ‘Massangeana’ , a hanging spider plant, and <fern> all of which are safe according to FL cham safe plant list.
Cage Location: It is in my bedroom, so not full on traffic, but a bit of traffic. My room gets most of the morning light, the vent blows away from them. There is a 2.5 ft shelve under the cage.
Location: I am in the East Bay, California.
 
Sorry about your chams! First of all I would recommend that you get rid of the night lights for good! Chams NEED their 12 on, 12 off lighting cycle!! Then I would also recommend that you use a proper gut load and ditch that orange cricket "junk". There are so many better alternatives out there and/or recipes you can find here to make yourself. Are you currently using a lamp that provides UVB?! Im pretty sure the Zilla day bulb isn't giving your chams the UVB they desperately need! If you don't have this, than this is the first thing you have to get ASAP. Hope this helps, good luck.
 
Hey,

I was told if they get out every day, or every other day a uvb bulb wasnt needed? i mainly have the night bulbs because of how cold it can get at night, i keep my window open and outside usually hits low 50's in summer and lower in winter... they are the Dark ones so its barely visible..

So the cricket food wont work? >.< dang it, its soooo much easier for me, any suggestions? Are there other gut loads that are in the same ... substance for lack of better words?
 
MWAHAHAHA !!!

Got the pictures!!! Had to use image hosting, But it worked!!! >.<
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They really need a constant exposure to UVB and UVA for that 12 hrs., otherwise they can't utilize the calcium and d3 you are giving them. Search MDB and supplements or D3 and read the first few threads, these will explain all you need to know! Yes the lights at night must go! They need full darkness to catch their z's. When this cycle is disrupted it causes stress which we all know is detrimental to good chammy health. I have panthers so for us 50's at night is good but nothing below that. If its a huge concern then buy a ceramic bulb (this is no light just a heat emitter). Again check the care sheets on the low temp range for veiled chams.

Ok so gut loads…I use a ton of different things. I am extremely busy so I know time saving is crucial! 1 method is to food process all your greens and such (recipes are found in Sandrachams blogs for wet and dry) then freeze them in cubes. Change them daily otherwise mold will grow. Also prep your dry the same day and bag it up. Method 2; Chop up your veggie mix and store in air tight container for the week plus give them some pre made "Bug Burger" and dry food. I usually change these out every 2 days, if there is any left :D My roaches go NUTS for the fresh and burger mix!!
 
If your chameleon does have MBD...you have to correct it. To correct MBD you have to give the chameleon more calcium until his bones become strong again. The deformities won't likely go away but at least it's bones and other systems will be good again. It's usually a liquid calcium sandoz or gluconate that is recommended since liquid forms absorb better. In addition to this your need to make sure the chameleon gets proper and enough UVB light so it can produce the vitamin D3 it needs to use the calcium in its system.
You also need to make sure the temperatures are right to aid in proper digestion and thus indirectly in the nutrient absorption.

Once the bones are strong again you need to maintain proper levels with supplements, uvb and proper temperatures so the MBD won't return. You also need to feed/gutload the insects properly with a wide assortment of greens such as collards, escarole, endive, dandelion greens, kale, etc, and veggies such as carrots, sweet red pepper, squash, zucchini, sweet potato, etc.

If your temperature drops below 60F you can use a heat emitter bulb".
Good luck.
 
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Cool Ill take a look for some recipes, Part f my concern is not just time, but convenience for my family, who Usually watches my animals while i am away, but they couldnt this time. so usually its easy to move food, move crickets and be done :/ Oh and check water.

Do you know if i can use a UVB & UVA bulb in a normal 2 dome light? the last time i tried to use a big basking light lamp it didnt work >.< and thats happen with i cant even Remember how many!! (They hate me....)
 
If your animal watcher did a "crappie" job he may of neglected them of the little sunlight available to them as well...I would look into a UVB/UVA lighting system for them. As far as gut loading goes you can find recipes and make small batches to store in the fridge for use during the week. Don't be afraid to put some effort and creativity into it, it will pay off with happy healthy chams. :D
 
True, from what i came back too i could very easily see that >.< And This is why im a pet sitter!!! Grrr.

Lol so i can just have fun with it as long as theirs calcium? I know my girl has a tendency to get the calcium deposit from her nose if i do normal calcium every day :/ i have to do her's eod, or less. so i mixed the cricket food with some of the calcium supplement hoping to help with that...

What im trying to ask, is how could i make sure not to over due her calcium if i do home made stuff?
 
yeah its quite possible your chams have MBD. I can't see your pics :confused: One other thing an above member said…you do need to increase supplements! A vet (herp vet) visit is BEST right now, they will also be able to give some calcium boosters. After that you must dust w/ plain calcium at every feeding.
 
Try this link i think it will pick up. I dont know why it wasn't working before :/ https://imageshack.com/i/eySeTwzuj

But w/ the supplements, they get the calcium dusted every day its the calcium w/ d3 and multi thats every other week. i barely dust the girl's crickets because if i give her much at all she gets the calcium deposit out her nose? and it happens in just a few days!!

w/ the UVB bulbs, what's the recommended watt? and i need to get a bulb for each the UVB & UVA? I want to make sure they are taken care of. i appreciate the help.

I checked them right before I turned the lights off and they seemed to be more.. sturdy? I plan to go get some more crickets for them tomorrow. (They ate all i had left. i think a bunch got out while i was gone :/ good thing my dogs AND cats Love cricket hunting!!! Hehe:cool:)
 
For uva you can use a regular household incandescent bulb of a wattage that gives you the right temperature in the basking area. For a UVB light I have used the long linear reptisun 5.0.

What you see coming out her nose is not calcium salts so she should get phosphorous - free calcium powder at most feedings....all the feedings four a month. Two of those four should be a phosphorous - free calcium D3 powder and two of them a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A.

I don't know what brand of supplements you're using so I don't know how much of the nutrients mentioned are in them....but too much D3 or prEformed vitamin A or a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorous can lead to bone issues and other issues in the chameleon's system.

In the photo I don't see any major signs of MBD....but a few more photos might help.
 
Which angles would you like? they are pretty accommodating once i get them out of the cage.

At the moment i am using Repti-Cal Calcium w/o d3, and exo terra w/ d3 & multi vitamin.

so the stuff coming out of her nose is normal? so give her the normal amount of dusting as the boy gets every day?
 
Side views are best....but do both sides please.

They discharge excess salts out of their nose....so yes its typical. Doesn't happen to them all though.
 
Cool!!! with the salt, i kept worrying on how to get her the calcium w/o her discarding it, i was considering putting it in her water, and covering the cricket food with it, hoping they would give her more. lol

So below is the link, i got a couple others of my boy's other side, haven't gotten the girls yet. https://imageshack.com/i/iqot1uGSj

changed their bulbs around, and finished up their cage, so they should be all set in that respect, while i was finishing the plants i put them in the outside smaller cage with a good bit of crickets and let them have at 'em. the female went Bonkers!! Male, not so much :/ but he is eating!! *happy dance*:D

On a slightly different note, i have the left over pots from the plants, two are really deep, could i possibly use those for the female to nest in? or should i get like a big plastic shelf and fill it up?
 
Are they both in he same cage?

His arms are good but the right leg around the knee is a little odd....not sure why. Let's see the female's photos.
 
Yeah no light at night. If the temps get into the 40's you can get a ceramic heat emitter. It emits no light.

Did the person who watched your Chams take them outside in the sun everyday? I assume not. You don't need a light if your Chams are getting multiple days outside. Since they reside in your bedroom, you will need UVB. The falling is probably a result of MBD from not getting proper UVB.

Your Cham would not become aggressive because you have been gone. Could the person you let watch them had messed with them, trying to hold them or get them out of the cage?
 
there was so much F***ed up, i highly doubt he did anything. it is quite possible he messed with them :mad: Makes me FURIOUS!! needless to say im not paying his sorry ***!

The cage is separated so they are separated. if you flip through the pics on the link you'll see it. https://imageshack.com/i/p5zsniZnj its HUGE!!

I got the bulbs as switched, a ceramic heater, as well as the uvb. Can they get to much Uvb? Say i have the uvb every day and still take them out as i can? when im home i try to have them outside most of they day since we are in CA and lots of sun / a good bit of humidity too :p
 
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