Frog Moss?
- Thread starter trdlabs
- Start date
eisentrauti
Avid Member
Where have you read this ? I have substrate in all of my enclosures and non of my chameleons ever died because of this.
pssh
Avid Member
There have been threads about chameleons dying from impactions. I meant to say can cause. I didn't mean to make sound like they always will, but they can. I believe there was a thread not too long ago where the owner actually had all of the backed up waste and material that was in the chameleon who had died.'
My friends grandmother had a chameleon who had died from a severe impaction from eating dirt and moss in the enclosure.
My friends grandmother had a chameleon who had died from a severe impaction from eating dirt and moss in the enclosure.
QuioteCham
New Member
If you type it in to the search engine, there are several threads on why substrate for anything other than pygmies is a huge danger to chams. This danger not only includes impaction, but more likely a parasite and bacteria breeding ground from water collected at the bottom of the cage and not properly drained.
Julirs
New Member
It depends on the substrate. It is not uncommon here for Petstores to sell ridiculous things like cedar shavings, wood chips, corn cobb bedding, etc. These are dangerous substrates that can and will cause impaction. There are plenty of x-rays out there that show impacted lizards from substrate eating.
sandrachameleon
Chameleon Enthusiast
Dont know what Frog Moss is, but spagnum moss is considered a safe substrate material. eco-co fibre and sand are also commonly used. Especially in the UK.
And papertoweling is common in North American, to facilitate easier clean-up.
Many of the USA members on this forum are very anti-substrate. Their thinking is that substrate can harbour bacteria, mold, fungus, insects can hide in it, and some chameleons may ingest it. Impaction is a true danger if the chameleon ingests the material, if the material is something like bark or wood chip or other difficult to pass material.
ijmccollum
New Member
Frog moss is like spagnum but vivid green. I have used it in the past but have wondered if it really is that green naturally. Anything ingested has the potential for impaction, diligent husbandry is essential. ...And yes, I use substrate -- sterile soil, coco bedding, moss.
trdlabs
New Member
Thankyou so do I. No problem yet.
I HAD frog moss in my pygmy enclosure for quite a while. That is, until one time I saw my female eating, and some moss got caught up with the feeder. She couldn't get the moss out and I ended up pulling it out myself. I'm glad I was there. At that point I pulled it all out of the enclosure. I know all kinds of accidents can happen, but for me it was better safe than sorry. I know keepers here that use it and have had no problems.
Impaction in chams from substrate is much less of a concern to me than the difficulty it is to clean and disinfect an enclosures' floor when you have substrate. I would say we loose a vast majority of our chams to Upper Respiratory Infections (URI) and eye infections, than to impactions. WAY, WAY more.
So, if you want to use substrate, you need to:
1) be able to remove all the waste from the chams and the feeders.
2) be able to kill the bacterial growth on and in the substrate from waste, water, and feeders.
Nick
I
A feeder that
So, if you want to use substrate, you need to:
1) be able to remove all the waste from the chams and the feeders.
2) be able to kill the bacterial growth on and in the substrate from waste, water, and feeders.
Nick
I
A feeder that
Clifford
New Member
Impaction in chams from substrate is much less of a concern to me than the difficulty it is to clean and disinfect an enclosures' floor when you have substrate. I would say we loose a vast majority of our chams to Upper Respiratory Infections (URI) and eye infections, than to impactions. WAY, WAY more.
So, if you want to use substrate, you need to:
1) be able to remove all the waste from the chams and the feeders.
2) be able to kill the bacterial growth on and in the substrate from waste, water, and feeders.
Nick
What if you had a "clean up crew" like wood louse and spring tails and earth worms - you wouldnt need to clean up as often, right?
but I actually agree with you - no substrate is far easier.
djfunkshowkid
New Member
Moss
I have rock moss in my enclosure and have no issues. Just be sure that you don't gather the moss out in the wild.
Grab some from nature, then transplant the spores into a terrarium to grow clean, bug free moss. Once you have enough grown (about a year) transplant to your enclosure!
I have rock moss in my enclosure and have no issues. Just be sure that you don't gather the moss out in the wild.
Grab some from nature, then transplant the spores into a terrarium to grow clean, bug free moss. Once you have enough grown (about a year) transplant to your enclosure!
CWarlord87
New Member
If you do a bioactive terrarium then you shouldn't need to clean up nearly as often because the isopods and springtails will clean up droppings and what not, you just mainly need to brush off poop from the leaves
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