summerseeking
Avid Member
So excited for you 
Is my chameleon receptive?
- Thread starter ConfusedHornwormGuy
- Start date
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
Just an update. I went out and did DoorDash last night to give her some peace and quiet without me checking on her or worrying about her, I came back and she was patting the sand down, kinda like "look what I did!". Her abdomen is normal size, no egg shaped bulges, so I'm going to assume she had a successful lay!
I left her alone last night and left her to lay in her hole with her eggs. This morning I picked her up out of the hole and gave her a few mealworms I had left over from old feedings, currently out of food, will be going to the pet store later today to get her some hearty feeders high in fats like waxworms, will also look for hornworms for hydration, and if her mouth is big enough I'll look for some dubia roaches or crickets, depends on their stock.
She seems fine today, just a little tired, not really lethargic but I can tell she is tired, she didn't really try to fight getting on my hand at all, she basically knew I was there to help her and stayed completely calm the entire time I had her, so it's obvious she trusts me and feels safe with me which is good.
I let her eat while she was on my hand and catch what feeders that I had left out of my other hand. My only worry right now is that she won't have the food right away, it'll be a few hours before the pet store opens.
I think she'll be fine but I just worry.
I'm so glad everything went smoothly, I haven't checked the sand for eggs yet but will be looking shortly, I'm pretty sure she layed them, her abdomen is looking really thin and she was starving this morning!
I left her alone last night and left her to lay in her hole with her eggs. This morning I picked her up out of the hole and gave her a few mealworms I had left over from old feedings, currently out of food, will be going to the pet store later today to get her some hearty feeders high in fats like waxworms, will also look for hornworms for hydration, and if her mouth is big enough I'll look for some dubia roaches or crickets, depends on their stock.
She seems fine today, just a little tired, not really lethargic but I can tell she is tired, she didn't really try to fight getting on my hand at all, she basically knew I was there to help her and stayed completely calm the entire time I had her, so it's obvious she trusts me and feels safe with me which is good.
I let her eat while she was on my hand and catch what feeders that I had left out of my other hand. My only worry right now is that she won't have the food right away, it'll be a few hours before the pet store opens.
I think she'll be fine but I just worry.
I'm so glad everything went smoothly, I haven't checked the sand for eggs yet but will be looking shortly, I'm pretty sure she layed them, her abdomen is looking really thin and she was starving this morning!
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
23 eggs is a bit too much right? If husbandry is on point usually it's closer to around 12, is that right?
Maybe a bit too much feeding?
Maybe a bit too much feeding?
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
MissSkittles
Chameleon Enthusiast
Had she completely covered her hole? Just for future reference, it’s best to not move or do anything with them until they have covered their hole completely and are sitting on their basking branch.
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
Her hole was covered completely and she was in the crater she had packed down above the hole. I gave her about 8 hours overnight and when I checked back in the morning she was in the same spot, she had finished packing her hole and laying and was in the hole I think either to protect the eggs or sleep with them or something, she wasn't messing with the sand at all anymore, she was just laying there on the sand she packed in to cover her hole.
MissSkittles
Chameleon Enthusiast
23 is ok. My girls have only ever laid clutches of around 34. After feeding her very well for the next 2-3 days you’ll want to feed her just 3-4 feeders 3 days a week. I also give infrequent little treats like pupated bsfl when I have them.
MissSkittles
Chameleon Enthusiast
Although my girls have larger clutches than I’d like, they rarely lay. My one went about a year between laying and it’s now been about 18 months with no laying for my other.
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
That makes sense. I'll make sure to feed well for the next few days and move back to regular sheduled feedings. Thank you so much for the advice and support everyone! It wouldn't have gone this smoothly without you!
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
Oh wow that's a long time between clutches!
MissSkittles
Chameleon Enthusiast
Yes! They’ve each had a few receptive periods but no laying. As it was unavoidable when I moved them all to their new room that my male and females saw each other, I expect that may have triggered egg production.
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
That makes sense as chameleons are very behavioral and operate pretty much on instinct, so it's cool to see how they work like that, they don't make eggs unless they see a male, or they make more if they see a male, etc. I think it's interesting.
I really would like to get a male veiled or a male panther and breed mine eventually, but I don't have the room here for that right now. I would love so much to have a bunch of cute little baby chameleons, but I don't know enough about newborn chameleon husbandry to even be comfortable trying right now anyway.
I hope you're able to continue to go without lays, as I'm sure they are stressful on a chameleons body.
watch your temps at basking as well. 78-80max end is a good temp. This with the reduced feedings will help lower the clutch size. Since this is her first you just want to make sure everything is spot on so the next clutch is the same or less rather then larger.
You said..."That makes sense as chameleons are very behavioral and operate pretty much on instinct, so it's cool to see how they work like that, they don't make eggs unless they see a male, or they make more if they see a male, etc. I think it's interesting"...TH don't have to see a male to produce eggs...but it definitely can trigger them into making eggs. The eggs will be produced if you feed her too much and keep her too warm....and if you really constantly overfeed the female and keep her too warm she will produce huge clutches and almost certainly suffer from follicular stasis and/or eggbinding.
You really want to keep her producing small clutches or even none at all by controlling the food and temperature. I would only feed her once or twice well after the laying and then get her right back on the diet.
Please post a photo of her now that she's laid them. Inho she didn't retain any.
You really want to keep her producing small clutches or even none at all by controlling the food and temperature. I would only feed her once or twice well after the laying and then get her right back on the diet.
Please post a photo of her now that she's laid them. Inho she didn't retain any.
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
She didn't, no lumps.
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
As of today she is no longer shower gravid or receptive colors and has gone back to her normal shade, her abdomen has no lumps.
I will monitor her behavior and if she is rejecting food and drink I will take her to the vet, my understanding is egg binding can be life threatening so if it gets to that point it's out of my hands and in the hands of a vet.
Yesterday I didn't have food for a couple hours and she saw a fly outside of her cage and I think she hurt herself trying to catch it because she was so hungry. I think her mouth was hurting or something so it seemed like she was rejecting food, so I was able to get her to open her jaw and i put a mealworm in her mouth and she started eating it, I had JUST offered her dubia roaches and she had rejected them.
As of today I'm offering her the dubia roaches and no mealworms, as I try to avoid feeding those when possible. I was able to get her to eat 5 or 6 mealworms last night, after she ate the first one she started using her tongue again and caught the rest herself.
She is currently basking and seems fine/in high spirits, and isn't acting lethargic by any means, totally back to normal as far as I can tell.
As mentioned will observe for aforementioned behaviors like lethargy, eyes closing, still maintaining gravid colors, etc. But as of right now she is showing none of the typical behaviors associated with egg binding.
As you mentioned you can't always see lumps, their eggs are so tiny, I don't see any lumps, but I can also see her behavior currently isn't matching up with that of a typical egg bound chameleon.
Based on what I've looked at, your average veiled clutch size is 23, if you are able to manage your temps and feeding schedule you can get them to lay none, so I'm going to work this next year on getting even better at my husbandry to try and avoid a clutch altogether.
Thanks for the help and advice. Will post back here if I see her acting oddly and get some advice on whether or not I should bring her to the vet, if it ever gets to that point.
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
Caught a fly that was in our apartment and tossed that in her cage, watched her eat that quickly. She's still not going for the dubia roaches but I'm hoping once she gets pretty hungry she'll go for them. They shouldn't be too big for her as I've fed her larger hornworms so she should be able to handle it, I don't know what she doesn't like about them.
MissSkittles
Chameleon Enthusiast
I would suggest getting a food scale and weighing her every couple of weeks. Right now you can get a baseline weight on her without eggs. You’ll see if she starts gaining and it will give you an idea of when she is growing eggs and nearing laying. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01H5ZQTES/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1
ConfusedHornwormGuy
Avid Member
Great idea. Thank you.
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