Is my living situation right for a Chameleon?

[Mijah139]

Hello everyone, in case is wasnt made apparent by the title, I am a newb to chameleons. My experience with reptiles is quite lackluster having only owned a leopard gecko and a kingsnake, my girlfriend (who i live with) has owned bearded dragons and kingsnakes as well. I have been interested in owning a chameleon since I was very young but want to make sure my environment would be suitable for such a delicate creature. I have been lurking on this forum for a few days learning all i can about chameleons in an attempt to decide whether or not caring for one would be possible. Obviously, I have not been able to come to a conclusion, so I will ask for your input. That said, here is my situation.
I have come to the conclusion that the best cham for a starter would probably be a male veiled, right? They seem to be regarded as the hardiest, and dont have problems becoming eggbound for obvious reasons. Am I right here? Veiled? Male?
I live in Tucson, Arizona, so right away I am facing a terrible problem with creating humidity. I would have no problems buying a mister or fogger, filling the enclosure with live foliage, and creating a drip system. But would this be enough? Does anyone have experience raising chameleons in such a dry climate? Should I actually buy a glass enclosure? On the bright side, the natural temps here are great for chams inside 75-85 during the day and 60-65 at night (in the summer). Add a basking light and a uvb light and the temperatures will be great.
I am a part-time work part-time student and while, again, I have no problem saving money to buy all the best stuff for my cham before purchasing him, I have seen stories of ridiculous (for my standards) vet bills and I am afraid that if my cham gets unhealthy that I wont have the necessary money onhand to take him to a specialist. How often do these problems arise? Should this affect my decision in purchasing a cham?
After looking at other "newb" threads, Ive realized that most of us are a little intimidated by the amount of gutloading and sups that chams require. I am interested in starting the gutloading process, feeding my cham an assortment of insects, and adding supplements as necessary. But as stated above, Im a college student. Im stupid and forgetful. I know that adhering strictly to a schedule will also keep your cham more stress-free, but would missing a few days a month be detrimental? Any tips on how to keep a schedule for supplementing (ive already got the care sheets printed out)? Any tips on how to start gutloading for newbs?
I will put this last on the list because it is the least important to me, especially when it comes to my cham. Handling, taming, and bonding. I fully accept that as with any animal, some chams will just not want to be handled. Some will not want any bond with their owner whatsoever. I have always been really good at training and bond with animals so I believe that naturally I will know how to work with my cham and cause as little stress to him as possible. But I would like to be able to take him outside to get some natural sunlight without stressing the guy out too bad. I know that chameleons can be trained to "tolerate" being handled, but never really like it. Any tips for familiarizing a cham with your hand? like hand-feeding? Are there any signs that a cham just plain doesnt want to be touched? hissing and gaping mouth seem to be defensive behaviors. As a beginner I would obviously prefer to have a cham that is as tame as possible, the less he is stressed, the less I am stressed. Is there anything I can do to try to pick out a tame-er cham from whichever provider i choose?

Thank you if you have made it this far! To recap:
1. Is a male veiled chameleon the best for a beginner?
2. Is raising a chameleon in a climate as dry as mine too difficult?
3. Is being able to afford veterinary services for my cham something that should affect my purchasing decision?
4. Does gutloading and supplementing run on too strict a schedule for a forgetful college student?
5. Are there ways to pick out a more friendly cham? What can I do to tame a cham, even if it is only tame enough to come out for cage cleaning day without getting completely stressed?

Thank you so much if you made it through the entire post, and of course thanks a ton for your responses. If I do decide to get a cham, it wont be for some time now, so Im looking for as much feedback as possible.

-Michael aka Mijah

 

[pigglett79]

Hello everyone, in case is wasnt made apparent by the title, I am a newb to chameleons. My experience with reptiles is quite lackluster having only owned a leopard gecko and a kingsnake, my girlfriend (who i live with) has owned bearded dragons and kingsnakes as well. I have been interested in owning a chameleon since I was very young but want to make sure my environment would be suitable for such a delicate creature. I have been lurking on this forum for a few days learning all i can about chameleons in an attempt to decide whether or not caring for one would be possible. Obviously, I have not been able to come to a conclusion, so I will ask for your input. That said, here is my situation.
I have come to the conclusion that the best cham for a starter would probably be a male veiled, right? They seem to be regarded as the hardiest, and dont have problems becoming eggbound for obvious reasons. Am I right here? Veiled? Male?
I live in Tucson, Arizona, so right away I am facing a terrible problem with creating humidity. I would have no problems buying a mister or fogger, filling the enclosure with live foliage, and creating a drip system. But would this be enough? Does anyone have experience raising chameleons in such a dry climate? Should I actually buy a glass enclosure? On the bright side, the natural temps here are great for chams inside 75-85 during the day and 60-65 at night (in the summer). Add a basking light and a uvb light and the temperatures will be great.
I am a part-time work part-time student and while, again, I have no problem saving money to buy all the best stuff for my cham before purchasing him, I have seen stories of ridiculous (for my standards) vet bills and I am afraid that if my cham gets unhealthy that I wont have the necessary money onhand to take him to a specialist. How often do these problems arise? Should this affect my decision in purchasing a cham?
After looking at other "newb" threads, Ive realized that most of us are a little intimidated by the amount of gutloading and sups that chams require. I am interested in starting the gutloading process, feeding my cham an assortment of insects, and adding supplements as necessary. But as stated above, Im a college student. Im stupid and forgetful. I know that adhering strictly to a schedule will also keep your cham more stress-free, but would missing a few days a month be detrimental? Any tips on how to keep a schedule for supplementing (ive already got the care sheets printed out)? Any tips on how to start gutloading for newbs?
I will put this last on the list because it is the least important to me, especially when it comes to my cham. Handling, taming, and bonding. I fully accept that as with any animal, some chams will just not want to be handled. Some will not want any bond with their owner whatsoever. I have always been really good at training and bond with animals so I believe that naturally I will know how to work with my cham and cause as little stress to him as possible. But I would like to be able to take him outside to get some natural sunlight without stressing the guy out too bad. I know that chameleons can be trained to "tolerate" being handled, but never really like it. Any tips for familiarizing a cham with your hand? like hand-feeding? Are there any signs that a cham just plain doesnt want to be touched? hissing and gaping mouth seem to be defensive behaviors. As a beginner I would obviously prefer to have a cham that is as tame as possible, the less he is stressed, the less I am stressed. Is there anything I can do to try to pick out a tame-er cham from whichever provider i choose?

Thank you if you have made it this far! To recap:
1. Is a male veiled chameleon the best for a beginner? I find that this is dependent on your commitment. I was told jacksons are hard, but that was our first and he is doing very well and we later got a panther.
2. Is raising a chameleon in a climate as dry as mine too difficult? Not really if you plan to get the proper supplies such as a mister, etc.
3. Is being able to afford veterinary services for my cham something that should affect my purchasing decision?Possibly, you may get lucky and not run in to any issues. Be careful in your purchase and this may change. Neither of our chameleons has had any issues requiring vet care, however my frog has cost me $100 this year in medications and we have a bearded dragon that had an eye infection and parasites that cost around $70. You can find online sources for meds and vets online that will send them cheaper.
4. Does gutloading and supplementing run on too strict a schedule for a forgetful college student? You can make big batches of dry gutload and freeze it, I also make batches of wet gutload and put it in mini ice cube trays and freeze it, then you feed insects every other day with both, not that bad.
5. Are there ways to pick out a more friendly cham? What can I do to tame a cham, even if it is only tame enough to come out for cage cleaning day without getting completely stressed? In my experience, best to buy a young Chameleon and work with them daily. We have a timid jackson who was sub adult when we bought him. The panther was 4 months when we got him and worked with him for around 5 minutes every day and he is what we call overly friendly now. Just takes time and patience. We would hold our hand out with food on it until we thought our arms would fall off to gain trust.

Thank you so much if you made it through the entire post, and of course thanks a ton for your responses. If I do decide to get a cham, it wont be for some time now, so Im looking for as much feedback as possible.

-Michael aka Mijah

See above reply

 

[Mew]

Hello there!
Let me start off with commiserating with you, I am also from Arizona (Clarkdale, which is kind of by Jerome), so I can speak as to the humidity issue here.

I have a male Jackson, however we carry veileds at the store where I work, and both seem to do fairly well here. Keeping the humidity up in this desert just requires some extra things.

Let me just start off that keeping a 70-80 is near impossible without a waterfall tank or moss. Unfortunately, both of those things are not recommended for chameleons. I can keep my humidity solid at 60, reaching maybe 70-80 after just misting. Here's my official Arizona humidity routine.

1. A room humidifier: I happened to have one for my guitars, however they come fairly cheap at pawn shops and can be found fairly often on sale at places such as Target and Wal Mart.

2. An automatic fogger: Based on the reviews and feedback from the machines small enough to fit inside the enclosures, I would not recommend these. I use a Zoo Med Reptifogger, which has a base that sits outside the enclosure and pumps fog through a tube.

3. Twice daily misting: I mist in the morning and at night for two reasons. Chameleons usually will not drink standing water, and he loves to lick the drops of water from the plants and his vine as they roll down. The second reason is that it helps apply a direct thick fog of water, while the fogger and the humidity do more of a fine mist that regulates more than adds to the humidity. I bought a bottle from Home Depot for around seven bucks that has a little pump, so it makes spraying a lot easier than the classic spray bottle.

4. A glass enclosure: I agree with most everyone here that a wire enclosure is best, however in Arizona you do what you can. I have a Zoo Med enclosure made of glass with the door on the front and a mesh removable top. The glass will retain humidity far better than the mesh.

5. A dripper system: This really is more of two steps, but I have a mesh carpet over a bed of Zoo Med Hydroballs. These are basically clay balls that absorb water and allow a more slow release, better regulating humidity. As for the dripper system, I Jb welded some irrigation tubing to a CLEAN 2 liter plastic, which then attaches to a secured tubing with small emitters that slowly drip water through the mesh into the enclosure all day. The hydroballs help absorb this water as these terrariums are not really meant to hold water. The dripper really serves two purposes, refilling the hydroballs, helping keep humidity up, as well as providing constant moving water all day for the chameleon. Some chameleons are shy about drinking water while you watch, but especially in Arizona the misted water doesn't hang around very long.

In general, it is definitely more difficult here in Arizona than in Hawaii where temp and humidity are always right without any equipment, but it is more than doable to provide a safe, happy and healthy home for a chameleon here.

Just as a P.S. make sure you have a UVB bulb. I'm sure you have probably got your lighting info down as you said you've been scouring the forums for a while, however I wouldn't burden you with all the horror stories of the poor animals who died or worse due to lack of a UVB bulb. I prefer the Reptisun by Zoo Med (I'm not a ZM salesperson, I promise!) just remember to use 5.0, as 10.0 is a desert grade and will burn a chameleon.

Good luck, and I hope you have a wonderful adventure with a new friend!

Your fellow Arizonite,
Zack

 

[Mew]

By the way, when it comes to taming a chameleon, just don't be disappointed if you don't get a social one. They are more often than not "look don't touch" animals. That being said, my Jackson loves to spend time on my shoulder, and they can definitely be social animals. Remember that chameleons don't really form opinions about a person, they attach either negative or positive experiences to a person. A great way to tame a chameleon is to slowly work your way up to hand feeding it its favorite treat, mine loves superworms. Also, just from personal experience, veileds tend to be fairly anti social while Jacksons tend to be more open to human contact.

 

[Ksauber]

Hello there!
Let me start off with commiserating with you, I am also from Arizona (Clarkdale, which is kind of by Jerome), so I can speak as to the humidity issue here.

I have a male Jackson, however we carry veileds at the store where I work, and both seem to do fairly well here. Keeping the humidity up in this desert just requires some extra things.

Let me just start off that keeping a 70-80 is near impossible without a waterfall tank or moss. Unfortunately, both of those things are not recommended for chameleons. I can keep my humidity solid at 60, reaching maybe 70-80 after just misting. Here's my official Arizona humidity routine.

1. A room humidifier: I happened to have one for my guitars, however they come fairly cheap at pawn shops and can be found fairly often on sale at places such as Target and Wal Mart.

2. An automatic fogger: Based on the reviews and feedback from the machines small enough to fit inside the enclosures, I would not recommend these. I use a Zoo Med Reptifogger, which has a base that sits outside the enclosure and pumps fog through a tube.

3. Twice daily misting: I mist in the morning and at night for two reasons. Chameleons usually will not drink standing water, and he loves to lick the drops of water from the plants and his vine as they roll down. The second reason is that it helps apply a direct thick fog of water, while the fogger and the humidity do more of a fine mist that regulates more than adds to the humidity. I bought a bottle from Home Depot for around seven bucks that has a little pump, so it makes spraying a lot easier than the classic spray bottle.

4. A glass enclosure: I agree with most everyone here that a wire enclosure is best, however in Arizona you do what you can. I have a Zoo Med enclosure made of glass with the door on the front and a mesh removable top. The glass will retain humidity far better than the mesh.

5. A dripper system: This really is more of two steps, but I have a mesh carpet over a bed of Zoo Med Hydroballs. These are basically clay balls that absorb water and allow a more slow release, better regulating humidity. As for the dripper system, I Jb welded some irrigation tubing to a CLEAN 2 liter plastic, which then attaches to a secured tubing with small emitters that slowly drip water through the mesh into the enclosure all day. The hydroballs help absorb this water as these terrariums are not really meant to hold water. The dripper really serves two purposes, refilling the hydroballs, helping keep humidity up, as well as providing constant moving water all day for the chameleon. Some chameleons are shy about drinking water while you watch, but especially in Arizona the misted water doesn't hang around very long.

In general, it is definitely more difficult here in Arizona than in Hawaii where temp and humidity are always right without any equipment, but it is more than doable to provide a safe, happy and healthy home for a chameleon here.

Just as a P.S. make sure you have a UVB bulb. I'm sure you have probably got your lighting info down as you said you've been scouring the forums for a while, however I wouldn't burden you with all the horror stories of the poor animals who died or worse due to lack of a UVB bulb. I prefer the Reptisun by Zoo Med (I'm not a ZM salesperson, I promise!) just remember to use 5.0, as 10.0 is a desert grade and will burn a chameleon.

Good luck, and I hope you have a wonderful adventure with a new friend!

Your fellow Arizonite,
Zack

Just want to say, your reply has help me out big time. even though this isn't my thread lol. I just posted last night in another thread about the humidity issues I was having here in Tucson AZ, and there are definitely some things listed here that I definitely want to try!

 

[Mijah139]

Would I be better off with a panther? Some say that they are a little more mellow than the veileds. Are they just as easy to care for? Some say veiled is the hardiest, are panthers significantly less hardy? And am i correct in assuming that a male would be better for a beginner?

 

[Ksauber]

I have heard veiled a are the easiest for beginners but I only have a veiled so idk

 

[Mew]

I hear that panthers can be either extremely friendly, or extremely aggressive. I wouldn't recommend it if you are wanting a social chameleon unless you can meet it for yourself. You take a major 50/50 chance from what I hear about panthers, and they can be nasty biters. Veileds are definitely more likely to hiss and back away than bite, although you really can't beat panthers for the variety of stunning colors.

 

[pigglett79]

I don't think a panther is any harder to keep than a veiled. I would go with whichever species you really want and not worry as much about which is hardier. As long as you plan to read up and understand the requirements you should be fine. Any chameleon is going to be significantly more complicated to keep than the other reptiles you are used to keeping. So as long as you are prepared for that complication then you should be able to keep either one.

Edit: Although you cannot control the temperament of your chameleon, I think that working with them early helps. Our panther is ultra friendly and will walk on to just about anyone, he will even come over to our computer area to hang out with us from his free range area.

 

[kplatvoet]

My vet takes the GM care card - which my daughter used for what her insurance didn't pay for her wisdom teeth - but also to use for unexpected bills for the vet- she gets 6 months interest free on anything over 300.00 i think (it may depend on the medical provider) - she's trying to pay off her car a couple of years early so she worries less about an emergency with her cat and bearded dragon.

 

[Mijah139]

So as to the age of the cham i should be looking to purchase... I want it to be old enough to be healthy and strong yet young enough to start taming. Is there a happy medium here?

 

[TerryLund]

Forgetful Student

Make sure you don't forget timers. That way if you forget the timers don't. They are great for controlling the lights and the misters. I make sure that when the lights are off that the misters are off too. I live in Texas and it is pretty dry here too. I just make sure I mist more times throughout the day to compensate. These timers can be found in your local Home Depot/ Lowes for about $10.

Terry

 

[kplatvoet]

Babies eat more often - little crickets and such are a pain - fruit flies are worse for a first I would go for at least 3-4 months old for a panther and 5 for a Jackson's I know nothing about veileds - If I had been prepared as I should have been when I got my baby I would have looked at the size of my local store small crickets and gotten one that could eat that size-
My panther has never been aggressive I got him at 4 months old- he's now about 8 month- he gives me dirty looks and pretty much hates my guts but he will eat out of my hand - sometimes - if he feels like it.

 

[pigglett79]

I think 4 months or so is a good age.