Mixing Cal w/D3 and Calcium without D3

[sandrachameleon]

My general dusting schedule has me using Calcium with D3 about twice a mont (every other Sunday). I currently use Calcium without D3 every morning meal.
My partner asked me (I didnt have a good answer.... it just felt wrong) :
Why not mix one teaspoon Calcium w/D3 and one Teaspoon of calcium without D3 and use it every Sunday (so we dont have to remember if its a d3 or no d3 weekend)? Or for that matter, why not mix one teaspoon with D3 to five or six teaspoons without D3 and then use that every day. And while I'm at it, why dont I add in some of the vitamin dust too, (which I also use only a couple times a month, usually the opposite Sundays to D3) and make it real easy.

thoughts?

 

[Dean Pulcini]

Mixing vitamins with calcium can actually break down the components of each. Although I'm sure people do it but who know if its a correct ratio.

 

[ttshibby]

hmmm, good question. I dont see why you couldn't mix them. they shouldn't react to each other, I think it just may be hard to get a perfect blend so that each cricket became dosed properly?

 

[jannb]

I like the way you have been doing it. That seems correct and I would just continue on as you've been. Jann

 

[Julirs]

You can OD on the D3, that is why it is used sparingly. The Repcal with D3 and without is the same thing except for one has D3, so why would you mix them?

 

[sandrachameleon]

Thank you very much for your input!
The only real reason for considering mixing was, ultimately, laziness (my partner would call it efficiency ). I can now see that there is potential for getting improper proportions, and potential interaction with the Vitamins. So I will continue with my current system as described and can now give my partner an adequate reason why I've been doing it as I have!

cheers
S

 

[kinyonga]

I don't see a problem with mixing it as long as you have the ratio right. After all...calcium and calcium with D3 are "compatible"...its not like you were mixing vitamins in with it.

 

[opihiman]

wouldn't you end up with too much D3 in the end result? I like your current method of supplementation too. In addition there would be no way to introduce any consistency with the the formulation. Cool thought though.

OPI

 

[ChromaChameleons]

Sandra:

There are supplement manufacturers that do exactly what you proposed.

Sandfire cham dust and Zoomed Reptivite make formulations with signifigantly less D3 for daily dosage. Zoomed's calcium with D3 is also a much reduced D3 and calcium formulation compared to RepCals. I am recommending Zoomed's Reptivite to newbs that are overwhelmed with the requirements of separate compoment supplementation , but I still prefer the separate application.

Also, OT, Zoomed's reptivite has preformed Vit A as opposed to RepCal's Herptivite using beta carotene.

 

[blackbetty]

Okay well apparently, I missed this section on dosing and when and how.. Is there a link..Im sure I could find it on Brad's, correct? I just use Reptivite with d3 and dust whenever I feed her something new.. (just started this 3 days ago so if its wrong, I apologize!)

 

[sandrachameleon]

You do not need to supplement with D3 at every feeding. They make D3 from UVB, so as long as your cham is under a good UVB lamp (or real sun) you only need to use the D3 supplement every other week (some would say as much as once a week for youngsters). A phosphorus free calcium (without D3) you need pretty much daily, because most of the insects we provide have a poor calcium to phosphorus ratio. Vitamins weekly or every other week (this is assuming you gut load your insects well).

You can check my new blog to see what I feed my panther chameleons, including what I dust with and when.

Check out these links for more info:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/supplementation-mbd-1-a-2451/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/supplement-schedule-14739/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/supplimenting-schedule-issue-13515/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/my-supplementation-schedule-ok-16028/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/feeding-d3-supplements-15789/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/calcium-d3-without-15065/
Bug nutrition: http://www.chameleonnews.com/?page=article&id=92
http://webhome.idirect.com/~chameleon/owners/chapter4-sub1.html
gutloading: http://chameleonnews.com/?page=article&id=101
Calcium: http://chameleonnews.com/?page=article&id=96
Calcium: http://chameleonnews.com/?page=article&id=102
Calcium http://chameleonnews.com/?page=article&id=93
Vitamin A discussion: https://www.chameleonforums.com/food-thought-12472/#post100844
Vitamin a https://www.chameleonforums.com/food-thought-12472/index2.html
Vitamin A http://web.archive.org/web/20060502...rnals.com/vet/index.php?show=5.Vitamin.A.html

 

[Dave Weldon]

Howdy,

Another thing to consider regarding calcium and D3:

Rep-Cal has 400,000 IU/kg of D3
Miner-All (I) has 4,400 IU/kg of D3

That's about a 100x difference in D3 strength .

If a keeper is using Rep-Cal Ca/D3; for example, twice a month and another keeper is using Miner-All (I) every day, the Rep-Cal user is still giving 6x more D3 and it is coming in big bursts. Is that a problem? There doesn't seem to be much evidence of an issue either way, one being 100x or the other being 1/100th of the other (although one may still exist ).

I haven't been looking very hard for medical data on D3 dosages but one data point in my medical book is 200 IU/kg of animal weight once a week (or maybe spread out per week). That would mean a 100 gram chameleon should get a dose of 20 IU in a week. If Rep-Cal has 400,000 IU per kg of product weight then there are 20 IU (the weekly dose of D3) in 0.05 grams of it. 50 mg (0.05 g) of D3 might actually be what you would end-up with after dusting 5-10 insects. In my case that might mean if my chameleons didn't get any sunshine then I would need to dust all of the 8-10 insects that each eats every week. But since they do get sunshine (76F outside today ), I continue to just use the Miner-All (I) product with its very low-level of vitamin D3 . I do like that fact that it has many other minerals (Miner-All ) with the calcium and D3.

Anyone have literature on D3 dosages? I also recall reading an article that spec'd just how much of a typical dust actually sticks to crickets and maybe other insects. Anyone remember where it is?

 

[sandrachameleon]

Gosh I had no idea the difference was so great between these two products. Good info - thanks!

 

[RachelRiot]

Gosh I had no idea the difference was so great between these two products. Good info - thanks!

Agreed. I love reading these forums.