Moody Panther Chameleon, ok?

[Thelizardking81]

Hello friends. New to the group and 1st post.

I have a malevAmbilobe x Sambava x cap est panther chameleon, age 8 months

Environment temp is steady 93 basking, 80 middle, about 77 at bottom.

Humidity at 60-75% misting 6 times a day.

Diet 8-10 crickets a day dusted every other w calcium and d3, 5-6 wax worms every other day

He has been a little slow this last week. Hanging in the middle of cage.

Bars and eyes are dark almost black usually. He’s an attitude kinda guy, and not puffing at me like usual. He was recently moved to a higher position in the house, and has more direct light access. Does he look ok? I lost my female veiled Cham last week and am nervous now.

 

[kinyonga]

Welcome o the forum!
Sorry to hear you lost your female veiledlast week. What did she die from? How old was she?

 

[Thelizardking81]

To be honest, I’m not 100% sure on the cause. I’ve narrowed it down to exhaustion after her 1st clutch of 45 eggs, or complication like egg bound, stuck egg, internal damage. She was beautiful and such a unique sweet personality for a veiled. Her name was Ziggy. She was only 1 and half. She has just laid that night I believe, and at 4am she looked ok, and I found her like this at 830am.

 

[MissSkittles]

To be honest, I’m not 100% sure on the cause. I’ve narrowed it down to exhaustion after her 1st clutch of 45 eggs, or complication like egg bound, stuck egg, internal damage. She was beautiful and such a unique sweet personality for a veiled. Her name was Ziggy. She was only 1 and half. She has just laid that night I believe, and at 4am she looked ok, and I found her like this at 830am.

She was gorgeous. I’m sorry that you lost her.

 

[Sonny13]

Sorry for your lost, she was really beautiful. Love her blues.

 

[Morpheo's Mom]

Hello and welcome. I am sorry for your loss. She really was beautiful.

If I am reading correctly it appears your supplementation my be off. You said you dust calcium with D3 every other feeding? I am not familiar with panther cham's but I believe their supplement schedule is similar to veiled. You may be overdosing on D3, and this could be the cause of your concern.

If I am correct, you should dust phosphorus free calcium every feeding and only calcium D3 and multivitamin once every 2 weeks.

I hope a panther owner can chime in to clarify.

 

[jamest0o0]

Hello friends. New to the group and 1st post.

I have a malevAmbilobe x Sambava x cap est panther chameleon, age 8 months

Environment temp is steady 93 basking, 80 middle, about 77 at bottom.

Humidity at 60-75% misting 6 times a day.

Diet 8-10 crickets a day dusted every other w calcium and d3, 5-6 wax worms every other day

He has been a little slow this last week. Hanging in the middle of cage.

Bars and eyes are dark almost black usually. He’s an attitude kinda guy, and not puffing at me like usual. He was recently moved to a higher position in the house, and has more direct light access. Does he look ok? I lost my female veiled Cham last week and am nervous now.

Hey, sorry you’re having some trouble. Going to critique a few things, not that I’m sure these are the reasons for your issues, but it would help to get them straightened out in the mean time.

As mentioned above, assuming you have a normal t5 uvb bulb, d3 every other day is overdoing it and could lead to toxicity. Fat soluble vitamins are stored in the liver and can become toxic when overdone. UVB vit D production can be regulated by the skin, but ingestion of supplements cannot. So we recommend supplementing vitamin d(in normal circumstances with a good uvb bulb) once every other week. Think of it as a back up to sun/uvb bulb vit D production.

I’d lower the basking to mid/high 80s.

I’d keep the misting to mornings and at night. I always had a heavier mist session right before lights came on in the morning when sunlight started to come in the room. Then I’d have a misting right after the lights went out at night. Or when the lights were dim(if you’re able to do that, I used to have several lights and leave one on that would turn off a little bit after the night misting).

You need to really pull back on those wax worms. That’s wayyyy too many. Fatty feeders have higher calories and can quickly lead to addiction(PITA to switch an adult Cham off) and/or obesity. It doesn’t seem like much with those little worms, but fat has over double the calories per gram than protein(9 vs 4). This is fine, fat’s not bad, it’s just very easy to overdo it. Think an equal amount of peanut butter/nuts/oil/fatty steak vs whey powder/skinless chicken/etc. The latter will have far less calories. Protein rich options would be a lot of insects like crickets, most roaches, bottle flies, etc…(there’s lists on here that have good feeder options). Waxworms can be used, but I’d keep it to once or twice a month as a special treat.

 

[jamest0o0]

To add to that, I forgot to mention. You should be dusting with plain calc no vitamin d3 every feeding. Alternating with the d3 every 2 weeks, add a vitamin supplement with good retinol vitamin A like reptivite every 2 weeks. It would also be a good time to pull your feedings back to every other day. When in adulthood feed maybe two or three times a week. Or much, much smaller meals daily if you prefer that way(@JacksJill you do this don’t you?)

 

[Thelizardking81]

To add to that, I forgot to mention. You should be dusting with plain calc no vitamin d3 every feeding. Alternating with the d3 every 2 weeks, add a vitamin supplement with good retinol vitamin A like reptivite every 2 weeks. It would also be a good time to pull your feedings back to every other day. When in adulthood feed maybe two or three times a week. Or much, much smaller meals daily if you prefer that way(@JacksJill you do this don’t you?)

Thank you so much. The more I’ve been reading, I find a lot of owners are misinformed w the calcium d3 from pet stores. Super grateful for this forum. Going to get to work today on what you have recommended. Thank you so much. Is his darkness a reflection of those stressing things? Do you find panthers to be on the skinnier side? My veiled was a big girl. And Zkittlez, my panther, is much leaner.

 

[Thelizardking81]

Him this a.m. I took out the red light, it was giving more heat. I’ve also ordered new calcium powder without d3. I don’t wanna lose any one of my babies.

 

[Thelizardking81]

To add to that, I forgot to mention. You should be dusting with plain calc no vitamin d3 every feeding. Alternating with the d3 every 2 weeks, add a vitamin supplement with good retinol vitamin A like reptivite every 2 weeks. It would also be a good time to pull your feedings back to every other day. When in adulthood feed maybe two or three times a week. Or much, much smaller meals daily if you prefer that way(@JacksJill you do this don’t you?)

Thank you so much. I have a lot to learn, and just want to be a good care giver to these beautiful creatures. My heart still hurts from losing Ziggy.

 

[JacksJill]

Yes, I feed daily but very small amounts half of what you would feed every other day. It makes it easier for me to track my supplement schedule. Both ways seem to work well.

 

[Thelizardking81]

I’m going to try the every other day routine w the chameleon and my adult bearded dragons. Still offering the veggie tray daily, but pulling back on insect feeding. Also going to switch up feedings with crickets and Dubia Roaches. Thank you for the insights!

 

[jamest0o0]

Thank you so much. The more I’ve been reading, I find a lot of owners are misinformed w the calcium d3 from pet stores. Super grateful for this forum. Going to get to work today on what you have recommended. Thank you so much. Is his darkness a reflection of those stressing things? Do you find panthers to be on the skinnier side? My veiled was a big girl. And Zkittlez, my panther, is much leaner.

Oh definitely, trust me we’ve all been there at some point with getting poor info from pet stores. The thing with veiled vs panthers, usually panthers manage their eating better than veileds. I hate to say it and I’m not trying to kick you while your down(just losing your girl), but females can be very susceptible to obesity and dying from it. They generally should be fed at the most every other day and lightly when ready for egg laying. Too much food puts a massive strain on their body which can cause early deaths(they already are vulnerable just from egg laying as it is and don’t live as long as the males). Not saying I’m sure this happened, but just wanted to let you know for future reference.

Him this a.m. I took out the red light, it was giving more heat. I’ve also ordered new calcium powder without d3. I don’t wanna lose any one of my babies.

Awesome, you’re doing a fantastic job of taking advice. You seem like a good keeper

Thank you so much. I have a lot to learn, and just want to be a good care giver to these beautiful creatures. My heart still hurts from losing Ziggy.

I’m very sorry about losing her, post here anytime. We’re all here to help and just want to see people have healthy animals

 

[Thelizardking81]

Hey friends! Since my last post and making the recommended adjustments, Zkittlez is a happy guy! Still a brat when it comes to handling, but that’s to be expected. I wanted to post a pic, just as a nervous Nelly, I once read if they are pointing there nose upward it could be a respiratory issue. Or he could just be enjoying the sunshine. Any thoughts are greatly appreciated! Chad

 

[Thelizardking81]

This is the 1st I’ve noticed. The power was off today from 8am til now, and his lights were not able to be on. I’ve cut back misting to once in morning and once before bed. I’ve googled a bit and I’m getting mixed info.

 

[CalamityCrow]

If he does it once, that's not necessarily need for concern. I'd say though, if you see it multiple times, if you hear any clicking or see heavy breathing from him, if he SLEEPS with his nose in the air (or at least generally as vertical as he can get instead of horizontal on a branch), and/or if you see any discharge or mucus in/around the mouth, you're probably fine.

I'd keep a good eye on him though.

Does his cage dry out completely during the day?

 

[Thelizardking81]

He seems to have stopped for the moment. His cage was really warm. After lowering temps, giving a spray, and watching him eat, he seems better and isn’t doing the nose up. Yes, I spray in the a.m. about 10 min before lights go on, and once in the evening about an hour before lights go off.