New Chameleon hasn't eaten in 6 days

[philipjames11]

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - Giant Spiny Chameleon, got him from a reptile expo
• Handling - None to allow him to acclimate to new environment
• Feeding - Gut loaded supers. I leave 2 in a bowl for him in his enclosure for the whole day
• Supplements - Just calcium with D3.
• Watering - I mist him 3 to 4 times a day and he drinks consistently
• Fecal Description - Urates are solid white. The brown part of his excretion is getting less and less each day and is becoming watery (I think this is just because he hasn't eaten yet.
• History - Nothing crazy. However my cham goes into his feeding bowl and just sits in it without eating anything in it. the worms will crawl by him and even on his legs and he'd rather move away than eat them. He's very active however. He moves around all day, occasionally takes a short nap or rest.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Screen with 3 sides covered by shower curtains to allow for more humidity retention. 18x18x30
• Lighting - Both UVB and a regular bulb. I keep it on for about 13 hours a day
• Temperature - Slightly above 80 for the majority of the day. Goes down to the mid to high 70s at night
• Humidity - I don't have a way to measure humidity at the moment but I do mist regularly.
• Plants - I have a couple fake plants a a few real plants. The largest one is a ficus.
• Placement - My cage is in my dorm room right next to my desk. I leave the room quite a bit so he has his private time, but there is admittedly a large amount of time when I'm doing work sitting next to him
• Location - New York City

I hope that information might be enough for someone to help me. I'm not really sure how much longer he can live without eating.

 

[Extensionofgreen]

Several things need to be addressed with your husbandry, but currently I don't think those things are your problem.
If superworms are not enticing him, you need to try different food items, until he eats. He almost 100% certainly wild caught, which means he is dehydrated and has parasites. Hand misting is not enough for him. White urates are a good sign, but does not mean that he is as hydrated as he needs to be. The amount of time you are near him is likely a part of the problem and the enclosure is fairly small, so he's feeling a lot of stress from confinement. It's a high possibility the lighting is fairly dim, compared to his life of freedom in the natural sun.
Ditch the D3. Plain calcium only, until he's properly hydrated and feeding well.

Start with perusing the threads under the enclosure sections and make sure your enclosure looks like some of the better ones. Horizontal space and him being above eye level are important considerations. Your temps are ok. Humidity should be 50-60%, with spikes during the day and an increase at night. No light or heat at night. He should have a cage at least twice as wide as he is long and 4 times as long as he is long. Treat him like a panther chameleon ( reference that caresheet), but consider he needs more hydration at the moment. Get his stool to a vet or even a science lab and compare the eggs to images on google. He needs to get hydrated, possibly cleared of parasites, and he needs to feel safe and secure in his surroundings. Try ordering some hornworms to entice him to eat and to hydrate him. Crickets are not a bad option as they move a lot and are stimulating. Blue bottle flies are another good option.
Good luck.

 

[philipjames11]

Thank you for taking the time to reply back to me! Unfortunately I won't be able to upgrade my cage immediately, but so far, according to you, the only main issue with my cage is the length as its only about 2x as long as he is. I will get some hornworms tomorrow and schedule a vet visit. Are you sure a hand mister isn't enough? He seems to be drinking a good amount and there are many plants in his enclosure to retain water droplets on. If not, then what alternative is there, a mist machine maybe? In respect to the low light levels as well, I'm using a zoo med lamp,could it be possible i need an upgrade for the lamp as well?

 

[Extensionofgreen]

A picture of the enclosure would help. A mist system is fairly standard equipment for chameleon keeping. The fact that he eagerly drinks every time you spray him is a sign of thirst. My animals take several mins to start drinking, because they have amble water and are in no hurry.

 

[kinyonga]

Please post a photo of the chameleon too. How long have you had him? Are you sure it's a male?

 

[AZChamFan]

Unless I missed it somewhere what is the temperature of his basking site? He must have a basking site above 90 degrees - my Verrucosus has a basking site pushing 100 degrees and he spends a fair amount of time there. I first had this basking site in the low 90's but based on observation and research, have raised it to about 98 degrees and he is very happy now! Also, superworms are the only food mine won't eat. He likes dubias and crickets, and LOVES hornworms. They (hornworms) are not his main staple but I feed them fairly often and they would also help with hydration for yours. I couldn't agree more with the recommendations for a vet visit. Mine was treated at the reptile store for parasites and still needed further treatment by a vet after I brought him home. I also have fairly bright lighting including the basking bulb and a three tube flourecent which runs the length of his enclosure and includes two daylight bulbs as well as a reptisun 10.0.

 

[AZChamFan]

Also what size is he? The cage is definitely far too small if he is anything but a baby ( a baby could have different temperature requirements as well). My enclosure is 46" wide by 46" tall by 24" front to back, and that is by no means huge for a Verrucosus. Not trying to give you a hard time - just being honest. It is extremely honorable for you to be here asking for advice in the first place!!!

 

[philipjames11]

My apologies for misspeaking before. When I said my chameleon rushes to drink, I meant more that after a few minutes after spraying he'll go and drink for a very long time and very intently. It's definitely possible he is still dehydrated though. In terms of a misting system, that seems very expensive and hard to maintain, is it possible I could be wrong?

I've had the chameleon for 6 days now, I am not positive it is a male as the person that sold it to me was in a rush and didn't really answer any of my questions---he did say one thing though, he said that i should get an 18x18x30 cage, so i fear I may have been mislead by him quite a bit if a spiny chameleon really does need so much space. Is there any kind of cage that is on the cheaper size that would have more favorable dimensions anyone might know of?

In terms of lighting I have a 60w UVB bulb that came with the enclosure and a reptisun bulb that looks like any standard energy saving bulb (the brand is zoo med, it all came bundled). I'm not really sure why the basking site isn't hotter. Is it a wattage issue? What kind of wattage would be better, around 80 or 90 perhaps?

Also, I really appreciate all of you trying to help me. I'm not taking a hard time to any of what you're saying, I just want the little guy to be happy.

I've attached some images for y'all too. The image with him without anything in the background was taken earlier, and the one with a lot of shrubs I took just now. In case you're curious the largest one is a ficus and the smaller ones are misc. species that I made sure were safe for chameleons.

 

[philipjames11]

Also I'm definitely going to get some hornworms tomorrow. So is there any other kind of feeder I should get. I can't have crickets however, it needs to be something I can control if it gets out of its feeder box/cham cage.

 

[AZChamFan]

I can't help you with finding an inexpensive cage as I always build my own (they are not inexpensive the way I build them!) and I'm not that familiar with the prices out there, but it's always best if you can get one with generous height and length/width - rather than just height. Chameleons do like to move about in horizontal space just as much, if not more, than vertical. One of the great advantages to horizontal space is that you can provide a nice warm basking spot at one end of the enclosure and the other end will remain cool even at the higher elevations where your cham should prefer to hang out (whether it is basking or just relaxing away from the heat). When you have a tall cage without much horizontal space, and you put the heat light at the top, the animal is pretty much forced to move down towards the lower areas of the cage where it is not normally as content, in order to escape the heat. Being able to escape the heat when it wants and still remain high in the cage is a huge advantage in my opinion. Also like someone else pointed out the cage should be elevated. My animals are at about eye level when they are in the upper levels of their cage.

Your guy (it is a male) does look healthy enough although a little thin. Keep getting water into him and of course he needs to start eating. To be honest, a misting system is a great piece of equipment but IF you stay on top of the hand misting I wouldn't consider it an absolute necessity. They are a little pricey but well worth it, and no they are not difficult to maintain at all once set up. It is ideal to use filtered water if possible - some people use R.O. water and some use other types of filtered water. The minerals in tap water can cause issues with the nozzles, although there are some people who even use tap water and don't have issues - but purified water is ideal.

It is extremely important that you feed him some type of insect that can be well gut loaded - without this he will not get the nutrition he needs. If you cannot use crickets, then dubia roaches will work very well, but I fear they will fall into the same category as crickets for you. Even if he had eaten the superworms they are by no means a good staple diet. The hornworms are nutritious but also not a good staple diet. If he starts eating the hornworms for you, that is good, but a diet of only hornworms will not suffice and it will most likely cause loose stools. They are great as a supplemental food, but he needs more!

 

[AZChamFan]

I'm not sure what to say about your lighting as I can't tell exactly what bulbs you have - generally there is one fluorescent which provides UVB and one incandescent bulb which provides heat in that type of light. I use a spot type incandescent for heat which is in a dimmable fixture - that allows adjustment of the bulbs wattage for the temperature of the basking site. Some people take it a step further with a thermostat. If you must use that fixture then you will have to experiment with different wattages until you get the desired basking temperature. It's not surprising that 60 watts is not enough, especially if it is not a spotlight type bulb. Still, it's difficult to provide truly adequate lighting with just that fixture.

 

[philipjames11]

That's all very good advice. I'll try to see if he eats some hornworms tomorrow and then I'll attempt to build a full diet by introducing new feeders one at a time to keep the diversity up. I guess I'll also have to get a larger cage and some better lighting soon as well. Thank you for the advice AZ!!

 

[Extensionofgreen]

You need a halogen basking bulb and a linear UVB bulb. I would use caution with a basking spot over 90F and never higher than 95F. Your cage is not poorly set-up, but is very small and won't do. He really needs a dragon strand atrium and that's $500+ and a mist system is around $100 or more. These aren't really optional for a healthy chameleon, unfortunately. Respectfully, I would suggest selling him or rehoming him with someone with less budget and space restraints. Chameleons aren't like goldfish, they don't limp along in sub-optimal conditions; they just die.
If you want a chameleon more suitable to your means, a jacksons chameleon is likely best, but with cooler day temps and you still need a mist system.

 

[AZChamFan]

A lot of people, including myself, keep healthy and happy chameleons with only hand misting. Based on what I've read Verrucosus can require higher temperatures than panthers, and I saw an improvement in my guy when I raised the temperature of his basking area - that's why I recommended a warmer basking spot. I'm providing for my own Verrucosus based on close observation and how much time he spends basking. I guess in the end there will always be disagreements on these things and one of the most important things you can do is research as much as possible on your own, and also do as much careful observation of your own animal as possible. There are also many good incandescent spotlight basking bulbs for reptiles which are not halogen. Not sure why it has to be halogen, unless it's because a halogen might have a better spectrum than a regular spotlight bulb and this would be beneficial considering his other poor lighting? Not trying to argue - just curious!!! I've never used halogen but then again I've always had excellent flourecent lighting in addition to the spotlight.

 

[Extensionofgreen]

A lot of people, including myself, keep healthy and happy chameleons with only hand misting. Based on what I've read Verrucosus can require higher temperatures than panthers, and I saw an improvement in my guy when I raised the temperature of his basking area - that's why I recommended a warmer basking spot. I'm providing for my own Verrucosus based on close observation and how much time he spends basking. I guess in the end there will always be disagreements on these things and one of the most important things you can do is research as much as possible on your own, and also do as much careful observation of your own animal as possible. There are also many good incandescent spotlight basking bulbs for reptiles which are not halogen. Not sure why it has to be halogen, unless it's because a halogen might have a better spectrum than a regular spotlight bulb and this would be beneficial considering his other poor lighting? Not trying to argue - just curious!!! I've never used halogen but then again I've always had excellent flourecent lighting in addition to the spotlight.

I don't disagree with your methods. I am not disputing that your chameleon enjoys a higher basking temperature, but his chameleon is dehydrated and I suggest he start lower and increase the temperature as needed, rather than shoot for what many would consider an unusually high basking temperature. Higher temps mean higher metabolism and more water loss.
Halogen bulbs are good for sun-loving species and are capable of projecting the heat better than incandescent bulbs. Are they the only option or the key to good chameleon health, not at all, but it is a good starting place for someone newer to chameleons and that needs a warmer temperature for basking. Sometimes, giving specifics and not elaborating is better for newer folks as they can easily be overwhelmed by too many options and too much information. This isn't saying new people are incapable to understanding, it's just better to keep it simple and straight forward until they have the basics covered and then build on that knowledge and consider the other options and their pros and cons.
As far as keeping chameleons healthy with hand misting, I think this is a challenge and an arduous task, not for someone with a college schedule and not for someone starting with a dehydrated, wild caught animal. Being a dorm limits his options for using the shower or other means to hydrate him and you already have a situation where a newly captive animal is experiencing close human presence, without adding the stress of a human standing over it to hand mist it. When it is adjusted and hydrated, maybe, but for most people, hand misting is not enough, simply because of the time commitment.

 

[kinyonga]

Has he been drinking well? Do you have a dripper?
Btw...it is a male.