The knight in changing armor.

[rowdaddy]

Hello Cham fans. My girlfriend and her children have brought a very young(2 weeks?) male Veiled Chameleon into our family, after their trip to Repticon. His name: "Sir Lancelot".

After a talk about everyone understanding the responsibility of such a pet, it was decided that I would be the primary caretaker of the fine knight.

I am posting today for opinions, advice, and general gathering of knowledge.

Here is a rundown of the specs:

Cage: Zilla Fresh Air habitat 18"L x 12"W x 20"H (Obviously his childhood room)

Lighting: 5.0 Repti-sun, 25 Watt Repti-basking spot, 40 Watt moonlight blue headlamp, 60 Watt Great Value incandescent flood light. All 4 are ran for 12 hours a day, none used at night.

Substrate: Paper Towels

Decor: Artificial: All Things Living Bend-a-Branch, Exo Terra medium Ampallo
Natural: Sweet Gum branches(washes & baked), bamboo, (washed, baked, coarsely sanded)

Flora: Jade plant

Feeding & Supplements: Smallest accessible crickets some free ranged, some in a cup. Always dusted with Reptivite w/o D3 Romaine lettuce made available.

Water: Spray bottle misting 3 or 4 times a day.

The numbers: Basking temp 90-93F
Mid range temp 78-82F
Bottom/night temp 68-72F
Humidity: 40-60%


I hope I didn't forget anything.


I may be an over anxious father here, but I am worried about Sir Lancelot. He has been with us for 4 days and I have a few concerns.

#1- I have never seen him eat. Or defecate.

#2- I have never seen him open his left eye, and he often has both closed.

He's a tiny little thing, and I want him to have a long and happy life. He has a relatively good spirit, he tends to either climb the cage, and/or the highest branches of the cage, and hang/or perch for extended periods.

Thank you for stopping by.

 

[werecat]

Hi and welcome to the forum! You are definitely on the right track with your beginning setup but there are a few things that could use some tweaking.

First, you do not need the blue light bulb and besides a little extra heat it is doing nothing for your little guy.

Second, good job with all of the branches! Plenty of places to climb, but he needs more foliage. They like to hide especially when they are young and new to you and their new home. Add more plants either live or fake to give him more areas for shade and privacy.

Please review the care sheets here regarding gutloading and supplementation. He will need his food dusted with calcium no D3 daily, calcium with D3 twice per month and multivitamin twice per month. I know you haven't had him that long so you may already know this bit.

I also think your basking temps may be high for such a small baby. Hopefully someone with baby experience can confirm what the temp should be.

You are right to be concerned about him. I am too. Closed eyes during the day is a bad sign. Unfortunately he probably should not have been sold to you at such a young age. Being as you've only had him a few days I doubt your care is to blame, but try dropping the basking temp a bit (maybe mid 80s). You should probably take him to a vet although hopefully someone else will chime in with ideas.

Contact jannb. She has great resources for caring for veileds.

I wish I had better news and I hope he does turn around for you! He's a cutie and I can tell you really care about him.

 

[ponders]

Try turning off the reptisun coiled uv lamp. I had this happen to hatchlings and they actually got blisters from the uv intensity. Some of these bulbs are too strong. Turn it if for a few days and see if he starts opening his eyes.

 

[werecat]

One question. What are you doing for watering him? Do you mist him and for how long? Does he have a dripper? It's important for hydration and humidity. Also, it helps them wash their eyes of debris. Not getting enough water could be an issue.

 

[rowdaddy]

I'll ditch the blue.

I am scouting local nurseries for pothos, and/or some small ficus benjamina. Oddly enough he has rarely ever gone to any of the foliage. Almost always on the branches or cage roof.

I had attempted to create a canopy with varying levels of branches in order to allow him to choose his basking spot.

I am aware that I'll need to get other supplements and intend to do so.

From my research and observation I have to believe it is a congenital abnormality or a vitamin A deficiency. I hypothesize the latter because he does spend a fair amount of time with both closed. I don't believe it to be an infection, since there is no sign of inflammation or any discharge. I had hoped he had something in his eye, and misted him directly when I misted his cage.(Which I felt terrible about. Like hosing down a new prisoner.) But there has been no change.

I have found an "exotic" vet near me, and will call them tomorrow.


Thank you for all of your advice.

 

[rowdaddy]

Wouldn't turning the uvb off be detrimental?

 

[rowdaddy]

I am using a spritz bottle, and am misting about 16-20 oz of water over the course of the day. Going to give the DIY drip a go too

 

[ponders]

Wouldn't turning the uvb off be detrimental?

No, please turn it off and see how he does. If it is too strong, he should respond quickly. Do you have two heat lights on him? One should be sufficient.

You can make a dripper from piercing a small hole in a cup.

Good luck!

 

[werecat]

You are correct that he needs uvb but he can do without for a very short period. Turning the uv light off for a few days is ok to see if there is a positive change. If there is a positive change you will need to switch to a linear tube style uvb bulb which requires a different fixture. These are what most of us use and are prefered over the coil style bulb. *Coil style bulbs are not supposed to cause issues anymore, but some still pop up with problems and so many of us don't trust them.

Keep misting the cage several times a day as you are doing and set up the dripper for him. Try to avoid spraying him directly and just let the edge of the most hit him. He is so small I fear he could aspirate if misted directly.

 

[rowdaddy]

So, you're saying. Only to use the 25 watt basking bulb for a while?

 

[rowdaddy]

Are the lights you use T5, T5HO, T7? I have some T5 and T7 fixtures

 

[MeruJack]

I bought a neonate male veiled cham last October at a reptile expo. He has been growing like a weed and just moved into his big boy 2'x2'x4' cage a couple of weeks ago. Before that I had him in a small Zilla 18"x12"x20". I used a Reptisun 5.0 and a 40 or 50 watt bulb for his basking spot. Your little guy's basking temp should be no higher than 85F until he is 9 months old and the rest of the enclosure should be 72-80F. I think your enclosure is too hot. Also, as "Werecat" stated, he needs LOTS more leaves to hide in. For my little guy, Spike, I had a dowel across the top of the enclosure about 2" from the top and then wrapped a fake, leafy vine along the full length of the dowel so he could travel the entire length of the cage without being too exposed. Also, I put a pothos in there that was tall enough so that some of the leaves reached above the dowel and he would snack on it when he cared to. It was a few months before I actually saw him eating from it but there were bits of leaf missing from the get go. Also, he may not be pooping because he may not be eating. Petco sometimes has "extra small" crickets that would probably be small enough for him. They don't sell them in bulk. Rather they sell them in those little clear plastic boxes with like 50 in it. If those aren't small enough, you may want to try flightless fruit flies. I am currently raising 5 tiny 2 month old Dwarf Jackson chameleons that showed up in their mama's cage unexpectantly the day before Thanksgiving. They have been on fruit flies (almost exclusively) since birth. They are now 2 months old but they are still smaller than your little guy. I feed them fruit flies twice a day and spray their enclosures twice a day. My little babies only have a Reptisun 5.0 and no basking light as they like it in the 70's. They get a bit of heat from the Reptisun. I think you need to keep the Reptisun to help your little guy digest his food and for bone health but lower the basking temp so that it is no higher than 85F. Even my 4 month old veil, Spike, only has a basking spot of 85F as that is the recommended temperature until he is 9 months old. In short, ambient temp 72-80F, basking 85F max, LOTS more leaves especially near the top of the enclosure, smaller crickets &/or flightless fruit flies (both available from Petco or online). Be sure to mist him really well as he may be dehydrated from the high temps (90-95F) that he currently is exposed to. All these are pretty easy fixes and, if acted upon quickly, can get this little guy turned around in no time…before it's too late. Good luck!

 

[ponders]

Try just the 60 watt.

Here are some informative threads about lighting

https://www.chameleonforums.com/sick-jacksons-probably-mbd-135122/

https://www.chameleonforums.com/my-baby-cham-keeps-getting-worst-128062/index2.html

 

[werecat]

I use a T8 with a 5.0 Reptisun bulb (as to many others here). Some people here use T5HO with success also, but I think that will be too strong for a baby, especially in your smaller sized cage. I think it's recommended to keep T5HO bulbs about 12" away at the minimum. If you do use that I would raise it higher than the cage so that there is enough distance. Try the T8 though if you can. When he's a adolecent/adult you can go to the T5HO.

 

[Decadancin]

You could also try to place a spare piece of screen between your UV bulb and the enclosure. This will reduce the intensity a bit. Definitely, as stated, more foliage. The setup looks really nice and hopefully your little one will bounce back quickly.

By the way, I think he is likely a bit older than two weeks, I'd say more like 4 weeks from the pics. Did you get a hatch date from the breeder?

Oh and... Welcome to the forums !

 

[rowdaddy]

I wasn't involved with the selection and purchasing of the little guy, so all I can go off of is what she told me. Lol

 

[rowdaddy]

Here is the progress thusfar.

Lighting- ditched the blue heat light, and the spot light. I am diffusing the UVB bulb with a screen, and only running it part time.

Habitat - Got a few golden pothos abd have wrapped it around some of my branches. Added a tiny corn plant, and removed the had plant.

Dietary- Got some flightless fruit flies, and have a pudding cup to feed them in. They're getting out, apparently pretty good climbers.

Fecal -We have droppings! I repeat, we have droppings! We've found two little nuggets, believed to be feces. (I can add pics if you want. Lol

 

[ponders]

That's great news.

 

[werecat]

That's great! How are his eyes? Is he keeping them open more?

Also, I still would recommend switching to a linear uvb as soon as you can. Just in case you have a bad coil bulb.

Hope he keeps making good progress!

 

[Pharaoh2015]

I had a similar experiencing with my chameleon. I think he was giving to me at 1 week old. It could be stress induced
I just monitored my guy and left him alone. After I added a spider plant to his set up he soon became very active and was more relaxed. That's my advice give him some fruit flies, pinheads a nice leafy plant and see if that helps