worm?
- Thread starter dodolah
- Start date
Silkworms make a better staple diet than crickets, Phoenix are even better... calcium to phosph. ratio is great. Phoenix worms are really small though and would probably take dozens to equal five or six crix. Super worms come in at No. three. Hope that helps. Everone says that their chams love the silkworms. Mine wouldn't touch them. Never ate a single one. He does like phoenix though.
S
SuperRad
Guest
Phoenix worms and silkworms provide more liquid to your chams. these two also provide alot more natural calcium as well. Silkworms you can feed less, lets say 4 silkworms compared to 8 crickets. that's not a good example but you get the idea.
Phoenix worms are small. Very small. there pretty much maggots as the adult are "Soldier Flies" and are classified as flies. Your cham can eat alot of these.
Superworms are very hard. have you ever handled one? i wouldn't feed one to my cham. One time i had a cup with a little mixed buffet like crickets, waxworms, phoenix worms, and superworms. the superworm grabbed a wax worm and just tore a big hole on his side. He was vicious, and i didn't want that to bite my chams lip while he was chewing him, cause sometimes my chams will take a breather with food hanging out of their mouths.
hope that helps.
Phoenix worms are small. Very small. there pretty much maggots as the adult are "Soldier Flies" and are classified as flies. Your cham can eat alot of these.
Superworms are very hard. have you ever handled one? i wouldn't feed one to my cham. One time i had a cup with a little mixed buffet like crickets, waxworms, phoenix worms, and superworms. the superworm grabbed a wax worm and just tore a big hole on his side. He was vicious, and i didn't want that to bite my chams lip while he was chewing him, cause sometimes my chams will take a breather with food hanging out of their mouths.
hope that helps.
Brad Ramsey
Retired Moderator
Superworms (zoophobas) are one of my top favorites!
Easy to gut-load, easy to digest, and they are the easiest feeder to keep!
They are the main staple in my chams diet right now.
I love silkworms too, although the gut-load is specific and it's harder to get a balanced diet in them. They are still very nutritious with lots of moisture.
I have no use for phoenix worms. Almost impossible to digest unless pierced before feeding and generally not high on the list of what my cham will take.
Waxworms are a favorite, and the best for administering a Vitamin A supplement. They are high in fat, but I don't offer them every day...and my cham's not fat
-Brad
Easy to gut-load, easy to digest, and they are the easiest feeder to keep!
They are the main staple in my chams diet right now.
I love silkworms too, although the gut-load is specific and it's harder to get a balanced diet in them. They are still very nutritious with lots of moisture.
I have no use for phoenix worms. Almost impossible to digest unless pierced before feeding and generally not high on the list of what my cham will take.
Waxworms are a favorite, and the best for administering a Vitamin A supplement. They are high in fat, but I don't offer them every day...and my cham's not fat
-Brad
Brad Ramsey
Retired Moderator
Zoophobas are great chewers and they have a lot of legendary tales that are told about them chewing through plastic containers, chewing out of the stomachs of reptiles, etc.
I've never had any chew through a plastic container and they have certainly never chewed out of anyone's stomach
.I don't inject the vitamin ...I place a tiny drop on the back of the worm.
Waxworms are perfect because my cham LOVES them and they are an occasional treat....so they get zapped up fast while the vitamin is still on them.
-Brad
Marc10edora
Avid Member
yep, as Brad pointed out, phoenix worms go right through my chams digestive system. Plus, they are a pretty small meal compared to Zophoba and Silkworms. I love the silkworms. Every once in a while I let a couple of silkworms mature into moths and feed them to my cham.
Chamero
New Member
I bought some silkys last month and had about 5 free ranged at all times in specific areas of the cage. I also added some of their food on the vines to keep them confined. Anyway, after a while most were eaten but some had turned into moths. I decided to let them go because it looked natural and what not, but is this ok. I found the cacoon during todays cage cleaning and the top was opened, so I assume it hatched(?)..was born... Figured it added food variety, am I correct. P.S> I routinely use crickets and superworms as feeder and they work great. Cham especially loves the supers.
Brad Ramsey
Retired Moderator
If your cham can't/doesn't digest it...it doesn't matter how much calcium is in the feeder...it just goes right through.
-Brad
dodolah
Retired Moderator
lol.. do you mean you let them go in the wild?
bombyx mori is a human experiment. They are entirely dependent upon human to take care of them. Bombyx Mori cannot survive in the wild (actually none ever found in the wild, period. With the exception of Bombyx Mandarinae. its wild cousin)
The moth is kinda cute in my opinion.. but they cannot fly eventhough they have wings. It's completely vestigial.
but, the moth is as good as the silkies i believe.
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Brad Ramsey
Retired Moderator
Nope.
So much better than a mealworm. And, again, thet'll eat anything so they are great to gut-load.
I will feed freshly shed ones when I can find them in the pile. They're quite a bit softer.
My adult male veiled only gets 2 or 3 zoophobas, three or four times a week.
That's the biggest % of his weekly intake though. The rest...crickets, silkworms, etc probably make up 20 to 30% of his diet.
I don't offer everything all the time either. It helps with finicky times if there are some feeders he hasn't seen in awhile.
We'll go on silkworm or cricket only binges for a week or so at a time.
By the way:
Make sure you don't mistake the King Mealworms for zoophoba (super) worms. The King or Giant mealworms are hormone fed and not (in my opinion) a good choice.
My cham has never even seen a mealworm (regular size or otherwise).
-Brad
Brad Ramsey
Retired Moderator
I will try to contact different companies and ask them about chameleon unable to digest phoenix worms thing.
And i'll share the result to u guys
Here's a thread from when I experimented with them in February.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/phoenix-worms-2660/
-Brad
dodolah
Retired Moderator
hey.. check this one out.
I found that Phoenix worm larvae pose a rare threat to human.
Myiasis is an animal or human disease caused by parasitic dipterous fly larvae feeding on the host's necrotic or living tissue. Colloquialisms for Myiasis include "fly-strike" and "fly-blown".
emphasis on the RARE.. but, some people might find it interesting.
So, i send an email to the company. and here's their reply:
We are aware of the incidence of myiasis you found which is noted in scientific literature because of its extreme rarity. In order for this to occur, a person much ingest the worms, being careful not to chew them, and the worms must survive gastric juices, etc. This is incredibly rare and has never happened in our experience after working with this insect for over 30 years. There is no real risk to humans who handle the insects.
However, reptiles and amphibians obtain incredible benefits and excellent nutrition from Phoenix Worms. They also love this new feeder. We hope you'll get some for your chameleon and see for yourself.
Sheila Sheppard, Vice President
Insect Science Resource
768 Brighton Road
Tifton, GA 31794
229-382-0363
I found that Phoenix worm larvae pose a rare threat to human.
Myiasis is an animal or human disease caused by parasitic dipterous fly larvae feeding on the host's necrotic or living tissue. Colloquialisms for Myiasis include "fly-strike" and "fly-blown".
emphasis on the RARE.. but, some people might find it interesting.
So, i send an email to the company. and here's their reply:
We are aware of the incidence of myiasis you found which is noted in scientific literature because of its extreme rarity. In order for this to occur, a person much ingest the worms, being careful not to chew them, and the worms must survive gastric juices, etc. This is incredibly rare and has never happened in our experience after working with this insect for over 30 years. There is no real risk to humans who handle the insects.
However, reptiles and amphibians obtain incredible benefits and excellent nutrition from Phoenix Worms. They also love this new feeder. We hope you'll get some for your chameleon and see for yourself.
Sheila Sheppard, Vice President
Insect Science Resource
768 Brighton Road
Tifton, GA 31794
229-382-0363
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My chams eat a lot of phoenix worms. I make it a point to feed them off on non calcium supplement days and have never noticed any issues with digestion. As soon as I drop them in their worm feeder cups they run to the cup and zap them all up pretty fast.
Ill have to try superworms eveentually though. Theyre kinda big for my chams at this time until they get a little older.I did have one container of superworms mysteriously get a hole in the top. I started finding them escaping too
Ill have to try superworms eveentually though. Theyre kinda big for my chams at this time until they get a little older.I did have one container of superworms mysteriously get a hole in the top. I started finding them escaping too
dodolah
Retired Moderator
well... finally it has come:
I have 3 worms in my house and crix (after this batch, i shall no longer feed my cham crix, unless if he has issues with these worms).
i put fat juicy silkies and zappp all gone within 5 minutes..
I put phoenix worms and my cham just look at them wiggling..
his face is so confused looking at the worms..
So far, he ignores them completely..
but it probably because he ate that 6 fat silkies.
I shall try again tomorrow..
If he end up not eating... anybody wants to buy a can of 100+ medium phoenix worms from me? i only took 6 out of the can.
I have 3 worms in my house and crix (after this batch, i shall no longer feed my cham crix, unless if he has issues with these worms).
i put fat juicy silkies and zappp all gone within 5 minutes..
I put phoenix worms and my cham just look at them wiggling..
his face is so confused looking at the worms..
So far, he ignores them completely..
but it probably because he ate that 6 fat silkies.
I shall try again tomorrow..
If he end up not eating... anybody wants to buy a can of 100+ medium phoenix worms from me? i only took 6 out of the can.
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