Ambilobe Panther not projecting tongue

Bowmancj85

Bowmancj85

Member
I have a 3-4 month old ambilobe panther cham. We had a previous issue with the same type of cham and spoke with the breeder and he swapped him out to watch the issue and see what was wrong. Currently our new cham seems to be doing the same exact thing.

He uses his tongue maybe a 1/2" just to stick to the feeders and just chases them around the enclosure. I can hand feed him and if the cricket is held far enough away that he can't reach it and should be able to use his tongue he won't attempt to eat it any longer. Im assuming since this has happened twice it would be an issue with his housing but I just can't seem to figure this out. The breeder said they all where using there tongues perfectly as they were all free range fed.

Currently he is housed in a 18x18x24 exo terra until his new cage setup arrives. Basking spot is roughly 84 and i have a spiral repti-sun 5.0 bulb for uvb. feeder are powdered everyday with calcium and d3 every other week. Humidity is at a high of 85 after a fogging and misting, drops down to 60 and back up. Misting about 4-5 times a day, drinks tons, will even drink right out of the spray bottle itself while misting.

Any help is appreciated. Seems like we have to constantly hand feed him which we won't always have time to do and don't want anything to happen for us missing a feeding. Thanks.
 
We got it at the pet store we always venture to. It is the eXo terra calcium w/o D3.

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.

Here's a couple pics if needed.
 
Hi, please fill this out. https://www.chameleonforums.com/how-ask-help-66/

It is hard to help without more information. EX: How long he has been in your care? How old is the uvb? How far is the uvb from the basking spot? What multivitamin do you use and regimen? Describe his urates, etc.. Additional pics of the enclosure will help.

Tongue issues stem back to a deficiency, hydration, injury/illness.
 
Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - 3-4 month Amibilobe Panther. I have had this one in my care for 7 days right now.

Handling - Minimal, open the cage to mist and he climbs up to drink water. Handles once since 2 since arrival.

Feeding - Feeding mostly on Crickets, few super worms for now. Gut loading with various fruits and vegetables as read online. She does most of that so not fully sure.

Supplements - Plain calcium powdered feeders w/o D3 everyday and D3 every other Thursday.

Watering - Mist with spray bottle 4-5 times a day, fogger on timer to keep humidity up the rest of the day. See him drink from the bottle tip while spraying, not so much from the leaves. Occasionally ill see him drink from the leaves.

Fecal Description - Perfectly fine, no issues same as all others i have and have owned. Has not been tested.

History - No prior history issues.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - 18x18x24 Exo Terra. Currently waiting for screen cage arrival to swap over.

Lighting - Zilla 50w heating bulb, repute sun 5.0 UVB bulb.

Temperature - Roughly 84-86 Basking with a low of about 74 and lower end of enclosure. Lowest overnight temp is about 68-69

Humidity - 85-90 Max after misting and fogging dropping to a low of possibly 55-60 then back up. maintained mostly by the fogger itself.

Plants - One smaller live pothos plant. The rest os foliage covered by fake vines.

Placement - Cage is in the living room, not the highest of traffic, but i do have a 2 yr old running around near the cage occasionally. Doesn't seem to bother him. the enclosure is roughly 2 feet of the ground on a stand.

Location - Philadelphia, PA.

Current Problem - Chameleon will hold his tongue out roughly and 1/4" and chase the crickets. Uses tongue just to stick the crickets. Will not project his tongue at all to catch the crickets. Cant eat unless he can catch them, has been hand fed a lot bc of this.

I have had this issue with the first baby panther i purchased two weeks ago. Spoke with the breeder and he swapped it out just to watch for anymore occurring issues. received those and the same thing started happening. According to breeder they all where free range fed and they all used their tongues correctly. So I am assuming it is something that I am doing wrong just can't get a grasp on it.
 
Since this has happened twice from the same breeder and they have been in your care a very short while. Even though they are young and typically outward signs of deficiency do not show themselves yet. I would suspect deficiency.

We can only do a process of elimination without a vet intervention (which would be the best case). Ferretinmyshoes, DR.O's and a few others are great vets if you live near them.

I would start with getting a good multivitamin. Reptivite or calplus would be my recommendations. You can buy reptivite without D3 or Calplus LOD.

At the moment since he is young yet and over dosing is much harder as their bodies are using the vitamins much faster than what a adult would. Using the versions with no VitD3 or LOD i would start off doing it every three feedings. Make sure he has an appetite these days and is eating a fair portion. If this is indeed a deficiency it will take some time to correct.

You might want to try cup feeding and delegging the rear legs of the crickets to make them slower.

Other things to also consider with husbandry:
Be sure that your uvb is within 8-10" from the basking spot.
Make sure his urates stay nice and white.
 
I have been cup feeding for a few days and would try free ranging one day thinking maybe it will start going away but no luck. I will buy a multivitamin and see where that leads. When he is hand fed and eating from the cup he eats plenty about 10-12 crickets. Just seems odd that I would get two in a row from same everything breeder and all and have the same issue twice. The breeder after we met up the second time that this current one I have has used his tongue perfectly fine since day one. He made sure to give us one that was in tip top shape just to be careful I would assume.
 
Thats why i would think it is something with the breeders husbandry causing this issue.

Let us know how the multi goes.
 
Since it's happened with two chameleons from the same breeder it makes me think it's a nutritional issue although I suppose it could still be due to something like dehydration (still not from your care).

If it is nutritional then it's likely needing more calcium to balance it again. Along with this your chameleon needs a proper supplementing schedule, appropriate temperatures, and exposure to UVB as well as a good diet for the insects....which you seem to be doing with the exception of a vitamin powder.
 
That's not normal at all. I've gotten two different chams from a breeder at the Harve De Grace Reptile show and both chams thunder punch their feeders with so much force that it shakes the cage :eek:. Just curious, but did you get your cham from an older gentleman and his son?
 
Bowmancj85 said:
Sure did. 2 weeks ago just inside the front door.
Click to expand...

That's interesting because I've had zero issues with both chams I've gotten from him. I swapped chams because my first one appeared to be a female (members opinion) and I didn't want to chance it, so he gave me a red bar that had a definitive hemipenal bulge. Have you shown him the video?
 
I met up with the father a week after the show to swap the older one out and he didn't seem interested to see the videos. It was like ten degrees I understand that. Not sure if they are members or not. Do you know??
 
I don't believe they are members. I actually found them through a craigslist ad and met up with him at a public location. This is definitely a weird situation. I am unsure of how many different clutch he was selling, but I bought my first one December 7th and swapped out for the red bar January 10th.
 
Yea we got the red bar also so you possibly have one from the same clutch. Idk. I'm starting to think its something I'm doing but as soon as we got the second one home this issue starting happening right away as we fed him as soon as we got home and he did this exact thing ever since now.
 
Here's a picture I took today of my cham. I know the breeder mentioned that all of his chams were currently eating small crickets from the petco/petsmart, so I would imagine more chams would be affected if he wasn't using supplements for his feeders? :confused: If you don't mind, can you take a picture of your entire enclosure setup

IMG_20150125_155647.jpg
 
Yea almost exactly like mine above. Idk its just weird. Maybe the Exo terra tank is causing it. My new cage should be here tomorrow or Tuesday.
 
This is older before we got the new chameleon. No more water dish or bedding. I've added two new live plants to the bottom of the tank and extend up some branches. Also a vine adding more hiding areas in the center. I actually just got to work so don't have a as of now picture.

4c9a2c4cdd02e6d2caf62fe381e8f6b0.jpg
 
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