Anyone Idea what the problem was?

[Cheeseball01]

I had a 2 month old male veiled and came home the other day and found him dead. I got him at a month old and he seemed very healthy the whole time i had him except for the fact that it seemed like he slept more than he should during the day. He ate good, drank fine, everything was normal till that day. He seemed to be acting weird and was shaking his head around and then would stretch his neck out almost like a wolf howling. It seemed kind of odd but he grabbed a couple more crickets right after that so I didnt think it was anything serious. WHen I came home he was how you see him in the pic and there was a long thing right by him that looked like a big roll of cricket parts that he had puked up. I had him in a 10 gallon aquarium, no live plants, was feeding him only 1/4th inch crickets, misted him twice daily, and used zoo med repti-calcium every other feeding. Ive kept and bred many veileds before and was just starting over again with this baby and have never seen anything like this. The one pic was taken the morning of the day he died and the other one is how i found him about 4 hours later. Anyone seen something like this before?

 

[Dave Weldon]

Howdy Roan,

Sorry for your loss. As you are probably already aware, there are a lot of factors in chameleon husbandry that if they vary much from ideal, problems can result. Although I doubt that his black side is anything more than a condition resulting AFTER death, it did cause me to wonder about your UVB lighting and basking temps. The other thing that comes to mind is his "neck reactions" which, when combined with the fact that he is small and there is a bark substrate, made me wonder about ingestion of a piece and choking on it. You mentioned that it looked like he vomited chewed crickets. If you are up to it, you may benefit from the knowledge gained by seeing what his insides look like, especially between his throat and intestine. Use a razor blade and carefully slice open his chest. http://www.chameleonnews.com/new/?page=article&id=3

Other than that, you might want to post more photos of the setup and maybe even post some of the data for this questionnaire:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/how-ask-help-66/
It may help pinpoint potential problems before you try again.

 

[CammieNLeno]

Possible impaction/suffocation when picking off a cricket from the bark substrate on the bottom? I doubt its anything from the suppliments/watering, as that usually is drawn out and quite noticable.

Is the dark side of him any indication of a burn? Mighta cooked em from the glass aquarium. What were your basking temps? Did you have it monitored both ambient and basking?

If you are going to get back on the horse and try again, I highly reccomend loosing the bark - ANY substrate for that matter. Get a screen cage and toss that glass aqarium in the trash.

I am sorry for your loss

 

[Dankmeleon]

i agree, you can almost see the piece of mulch inside him!

 

[Chameleonboy]

im sorry to hear that but i also agree that he may have caught a piece of bark while he was eating =(


sorry for your loss

-clemonde

 

[chamlover]

Sorry about your loss. I just lost a female chameleon a couple of days ago. It always hurt when your not sure what happened. I agree with everyone else. There tongue is so sticky it is very possible while picking up a cricket he picked something else up too and was stretching his neck trying to remove it. Get rid of the substrate and get a screen cage, maybe do a little more research and next time when you purchase one, buy one a little older. He looks tiny. How old did they tell you he was? The smaller they are the more volnurable they are. Sorry again and i hope this won't stop you from trying again. We have all been there. Read, read, read, and when your done, read some more.

Debby

 

[dodolah]

i second the opinion on impaction

 

[Cheeseball01]

Yes that does make sense and im not really sure why I didnt see that. In my defense though, I got the whole setup from a reputable reptile store in Denver who had a stand at the rocky mountain reptile expo where i got the chameleon from too. I did wonder when i saw that they wanted to give me that bark but they assured me it would be fine and I used to use fish tank gravel in all my aquariums before and never had a problem so I didnt think it would be that much different. I do believe you all have a valid point though and i will be getting another veiled in about a week and and gonna get rid of the bark. And in response to cammienleno's post, that was not a burn on his side. Im not really sure why he turned black like that but it happened after he died. I kept his humidity at about 60%, basking spot at about 80-85 and the rest of his cage between 70 and 75 degrees. I would love to be able to use a screen cage all the time but I live in the colorado moutains and this time of year its usually between 10 below zero and 30 degrees and I find it alot easier to regulate the temp and humidity with an aquarium. Just a personal preference but I like aquariums when they are young and use the screened cages when they get bigger.

 

[dodolah]

cheeseball, if you have the stomach to do it, i recommend doing what Dave Weldon suggest you to do.
If it is an impaction, you will be able to see the object lodge in your chameleon's internal organ.
Sent you a PM

 

[Julirs]

I wouldn't use fish tank gravel-that sounds like it could be worse than the bark. Use nothing-that is the safest way to go.

 

[stevereecy]

Yes that does make sense and im not really sure why I didnt see that. In my defense though, I got the whole setup from a reputable reptile store in Denver who had a stand at the rocky mountain reptile expo where i got the chameleon from too. I did wonder when i saw that they wanted to give me that bark but they assured me it would be fine and I used to use fish tank gravel in all my aquariums before and never had a problem so I didnt think it would be that much different. I do believe you all have a valid point though and i will be getting another veiled in about a week and and gonna get rid of the bark. And in response to cammienleno's post, that was not a burn on his side. Im not really sure why he turned black like that but it happened after he died. I kept his humidity at about 60%, basking spot at about 80-85 and the rest of his cage between 70 and 75 degrees. I would love to be able to use a screen cage all the time but I live in the colorado moutains and this time of year its usually between 10 below zero and 30 degrees and I find it alot easier to regulate the temp and humidity with an aquarium. Just a personal preference but I like aquariums when they are young and use the screened cages when they get bigger.

Really sorry for your loss. I hope you will not allow this set back to throw you off completely and you'll try again. Note that even rocks can be ingested too unless they are the right size. My wife's cousin has a cham and that she keeps in a cage with a plastic bottom and one day she heard a loud "plink"! sound. Turned out her cham had passed a stone that it had ingested, which fell onto the floor of the cage and reverberated.

Steve

 

[xoiceox]

I'm so sorry for the baby's loss I teared up seeing him like that , losing a pet is so hard .

 

[Cheeseball01]

Well I really appreciate everyones support. I would cut the little guy open but i already buried him a few days ago. And yes Im getting another veiled in about a week or whenever the weather warms up and they can ship it to me and I plan on doing away with any substrate. By the way, is anyone from Denver or anywhere around there and if so do you know anyone that has any baby's for sale? I would much rather pick one out myself than have one shipped to me.

 

[Justin Carl]

I might suggest buying one from a good breeder too.
You will be very happy with the Kammers(chameleonsonly.com).
They have an awesome veiled named Emperor ming.
You will get a 3 month old veiled shipped to you for under 150 bucks.
That sounds like alot, but it is worth it.
Ask AFH, he has one.

 

[CammieNLeno]

Well I really appreciate everyones support. I would cut the little guy open but i already buried him a few days ago. And yes Im getting another veiled in about a week or whenever the weather warms up and they can ship it to me and I plan on doing away with any substrate. By the way, is anyone from Denver or anywhere around there and if so do you know anyone that has any baby's for sale? I would much rather pick one out myself than have one shipped to me.

I know someone here in denver that sells panthers - any interst in that, or are you sold on getting a vieled?

 

[Cheeseball01]

I would love to have a panther but I really cant afford one at the moment. Do you know how much they want for them and how old they are?

 

[bucky]

Sorry for your loss
Ill agree with everyone and say no substrate is the best substrate.

 

[bucky]

Try places like FL chams,altho i dont have a veiled or have never had one,their veileds seem nice.

 

[Cheeseball01]

Yeah I looked at their site and all the others on kingsnake.com saying they had baby veileds. there were alot of good looking ones but i decided to go with these people. http://www.lostlakechameleons.com/veiled.html

 

[CammieNLeno]

Cheese i sent ya a PM