Big Humidity problems

[Ksauber]

I am having some big humidity problems in my enclosure right now, and I am not sure how to solve them. I have included a pic of the enclosure so you can see if I may be doing something wrong.

The enclosure is 16" deep, 16" wide, and 18" tall, and all screen, except for the bottom, which is plastic. Pretty much your basic screen cage. I realize this cage is small, however it is home to my 1month old Veiled chameleon, and from everything I have read, this seemed to be a good size cage for him, until he gets a little bigger. And yes I do have a much larger cage waiting for him when that day comes.

The plant you see in the enclosure is a pothos vine that I have wrapped around some varying sizes of bendy fake vines. I honestly was concerned about the plant being a little too dense, but I didn't want to trim it back until I could get the humidity right. I figure if I can't do it with a lush plant, a barren one would make it harder.

For humidity, I spray the cage with water from a pesticide sprayer multiple times a day, and have a fogger going down the middle of the cage. I was originally going to only have the fogger on during certain parts of the day, but when it is on full blast, I am still only getting a humidity reading of 22%.

My humidity gauge is a temp/hygro in one, and the probe is attached to the vine where he likes to bask, so it is generally the drying spot in the cage, which could account for a lower humidity reading but really by how much? The other part of the issue, is that I live in AZ, in the middle of the desert. this means the climate is dryer, and even now in October, we have the AC on constantly, which drys the air out more.

I am really stumped. I want to provide the best home for this little guy, but right now, I don't know what to do. Any suggestions would help!

Also I have read about the humidity needing to be around 50%, but I am not sure if that is right after you spray, or before you spray, when the plants have had time to dry out.

 

[Chameleopatrick]

Three things.

1. Veilds are a hot loving species. You do not need high humidity.

2. Because of the small size cage and a light sitting on top it will be nearly impossible to maintain higher humidity.

3. Screen enclosures do not hold humidity. Temporary at best.

18" is way too short and can not support a thermal gradient that's adequate.

 

[SaintJimmy]

You should be fine, honestly. Whatever you use to read humidity must just be bugging out.

With that sprayer, spray 3 times a day, each time for around 2 minutes. Get everything nice and wet, make sure the water inside the sprayer is warm so that the chameleon doesn't freak out from cold water.

Do one spraydown in the morning perhaps, before you leave for school/work/whatever for 2-3 mins.

At school/work/whatever, he will have time to drink water drops off the leaves, and eat the food (cup feeding is good, you can count how much they eat) you provide.

Then when you get home (afternoon) spray him down gently for the same amount of time, allow a drying period between EACH MISTING.

In the evening, give him another quick spraydown and you should be fine.

If you want, a great way to make sure he has drinking opportunities ALL DAY is to get a drainage system and then poke holes in the bottom of a water bottle, so it "rains" on the enclosure slowly.

 

[Ksauber]

Thanks for the quick replies guys! I'm surprised to hear the cage is too small, but I do have a larger one I could move him into. Right now his basking spot is getting to around 85 degrees, which again is what I read is appropriate for veilds of this size. (He is 1month old and only 2 inches long lol.) I am not sure about the temp in the bottom/middle on the cage, but I can feel the temp variation on my hand when I stick it in there. however it may not be enough variation if the cage is too small.

As for misting, I work from home and my office is where he lives, so I am able to mist as often as needed, and monitor the temps and things. Also, I am definitely cup feeding him for now (and then most likely switching to the sunny D death trap when he gets big enough to handle the crix we have available around here.)

 

[SaintJimmy]

Thanks for the quick replies guys! I'm surprised to hear the cage is too small, but I do have a larger one I could move him into. Right now his basking spot is getting to around 85 degrees, which again is what I read is appropriate for veilds of this size. (He is 1month old and only 2 inches long lol.) I am not sure about the temp in the bottom/middle on the cage, but I can feel the temp variation on my hand when I stick it in there. however it may not be enough variation if the cage is too small.

As for misting, I work from home and my office is where he lives, so I am able to mist as often as needed, and monitor the temps and things. Also, I am definitely cup feeding him for now (and then most likely switching to the sunny D death trap when he gets big enough to handle the crix we have available around here.)

The cage is not too small for a one month-two month old chameleon. My baby jacksons chameleon is around 4 months, only around 2-3 inches long, but is loving the space in a 16x16x20, almost the same as yours.

As he gets older, around 4-6 months old, raise the basking spot to maybe 88-90. Then when he is 7-9 raise it to 92-95 and I wouldn't go much higher than that.

Honestly if you can feel the gradient go from high to room temp with your hand, that should be fine.

It doesn't really need to be a gradient, just a broad basking spot, correct temp. And then have the rest of the cage be slightly warmer around the basking spot (which happens by itself) and then make sure the rest of the cage (bottom, sides, a bit of the middle maybe) is around 65-70 degrees as a cool temp.

A comfortable low temp for a chameleon at night is 62, they can go a BIT lower, but it's not good to go too much below that.

room temp is ideal for 'ambient'

 

[Ksauber]

The cage is not too small for a one month-two month old chameleon. My baby jacksons chameleon is around 4 months, only around 2-3 inches long, but is loving the space in a 16x16x20, almost the same as yours.

As he gets older, around 4-6 months old, raise the basking spot to maybe 88-90. Then when he is 7-9 raise it to 92-95 and I wouldn't go much higher than that.

Honestly if you can feel the gradient go from high to room temp with your hand, that should be fine.

It doesn't really need to be a gradient, just a broad basking spot, correct temp. And then have the rest of the cage be slightly warmer around the basking spot (which happens by itself) and then make sure the rest of the cage (bottom, sides, a bit of the middle maybe) is around 65-70 degrees as a cool temp.

A comfortable low temp for a chameleon at night is 62, they can go a BIT lower, but it's not good to go too much below that.

room temp is ideal for 'ambient'

Good to know. I do have the other cage ready just in case, but it is good to hear that it won't be needed yet. I already have a hard time finding this guy in his cage as it is! The heat I wasn't too concerned about, it was more just the humidity. I was prepared to get some plexi to seal in 2 sides if need be, but I think I am going to try moving the hygro around a bit more and see what the mid cage humidity is before I do any of that. I really just don't see how I can spray for two minutes, have a fogger on, and have everything soaked, and still not even break 30% humidity.

 

[MelissaB]

Another thing you can try, is wrapping 3 of the sides in plastic. That will help hold the humidity in longer. People use shower curtains, the heat shrink window covering plastic, plasticore, and other sheeting. I have three sides of my guys enclosure covered in plasticore and it works really well.

 

[Ksauber]

Another thing you can try, is wrapping 3 of the sides in plastic. That will help hold the humidity in longer. People use shower curtains, the heat shrink window covering plastic, plasticore, and other sheeting. I have three sides of my guys enclosure covered in plasticore and it works really well.

I had thought about doing this with plexigass cut to size, but it is good to know there are other materials I can use. I may have to try that.

Where should I be measuring the humidity? Is measuring it from the basking spot a good idea?

 

[MelissaB]

I measure my humidity lower and a bit to the side of the basking spot. My Jackson's cage is 36 inches tall, so I go about 1/2 way down, and it's on the side, to keep it from getting hit by over spray. The basking spot is going to have the least amount of humidity. I measure my temp at the basking spot, and have a temp gun to the check other areas.

 

[CLP]

First off, if you are using one of those "cheapy" dial readers, they are notoriously innaccurate. You need to use a digital one. Either way, I would not take the reading right under the basking spot as that spot will always be significantly drier than other areas in the enclosure. I would move to the middle of the enclosure and do your readings from there.

As for the comment of veilds being a heat loving species, this is true, but you still want the humidity to fluctuate up as high as 70% at least once a day, and you really don't want it staying as low as yours is reading for any extendend period of time. I would try to keep the lowest readings above 30% and have it fluctuate up and down from there.

 

[Ksauber]

First off, if you are using one of those "cheapy" dial readers, they are notoriously innaccurate. You need to use a digital one. Either way, I would not take the reading right under the basking spot as that spot will always be significantly drier than other areas in the enclosure. I would move to the middle of the enclosure and do your readings from there.

As for the comment of veilds being a heat loving species, this is true, but you still want the humidity to fluctuate up as high as 70% at least once a day, and you really don't want it staying as low as yours is reading for any extendend period of time. I would try to keep the lowest readings above 30% and have it fluctuate up and down from there.

Thanks for the reply. I am using a digital thermometer with a probe that attaches to a vine. I had it in the basking spot to just make sure the temp was ok, but since it is temp/hygro combined, it measures both at the basking spot. Now that I know the heat of the basking area, I will definitely move it down to the middle on the cage, and see what my readings are like.

 

[Ksauber]

Just an update, but after moving the gauge to the center of the cage I am getting to 80% right after a spray, and it slowly goes down to about 40% when it drys out a bit. So hopefully I can maintain that. The temp goes down considerably when I spray which seems pretty normal, so hopefully both of these issues are fixed.