Concerned about Sancho..

[Jason4045]

I know when the get dehydrated thier eyes will sink into thier sockets, the eye closing im sure is part of it aswell.

 

[blackbetty]

Did the vet do anything? I know this is what Leo is experiencing too and trying to get an idea of what to expect? We are driving an hour each way to get him there so I wanna make sure the vet isnt just gonna tell me to put him in warm water and he will be fine.. I want Leo to be safe but I dont wanna hear what I already know and pay out the wazoo for it.. Ya know..

Glad to hear Sancho is doing better!!!!

 

[Dave Weldon]

...Is closing the eye or eyes a sign of dehydration>?

Howdy Tim,

Eye closure, like you've described, is, not always, but most often a symptom of a health issue brought on by something we are doing or not doing with our husbandry. Dehydration could one of the many causes. That's why it is so important for us to eliminate the causes that lead to illnesses that we have control over. Examples of things that we have some control over (in no particular order) are UVB and general lighting, vitamins and minerals, hydration, temps, the availability of seclusion, feeder selection, over-handling, close proximity to other chameleons, enclosure size, etc. Having eliminated those and others offers us a better chance to minimize illnesses and if an illness does present itself, we may have a better chance for successful treatment.

A photo of the urate would have been interesting. Let's hope that he's all better .

 

[yoza717]

Very sound advice Dave....
And I like your signature, I've got 2 books on your list and getting ready to order Thoughts for Food.

 

[Sancho]

Howdy Tim,

Eye closure, like you've described, is, not always, but most often a symptom of a health issue brought on by something we are doing or not doing with our husbandry. Dehydration could one of the many causes. That's why it is so important for us to eliminate the causes that lead to illnesses that we have control over. Examples of things that we have some control over (in no particular order) are UVB and general lighting, vitamins and minerals, hydration, temps, the availability of seclusion, feeder selection, over-handling, close proximity to other chameleons, enclosure size, etc. Having eliminated those and others offers us a better chance to minimize illnesses and if an illness does present itself, we may have a better chance for successful treatment.

A photo of the urate would have been interesting. Let's hope that he's all better .

Dave, nothing is different from my other Cham cage. Same plants, lighting, location and everything my chams are in different rooms but in the same location in each room. Only difference is the basking bulb witchy has a regular house bulb and Sancho has a 100 watt zoomed basking bulb which is located 5 inches above the top of the cage and 8 inches below the top of the cage and at the top of his highest basking branch. Could it be something with the basking bulb? He did drink a lot last night when I gave him a shower. I should of took a picture of the poo but was such in a rush to get him to the vet when I got home last night.

 

[Howdyco]

Good Luck Sancho & Sancho.

 

[Cainschams]

Hey Tim, sorry to hear about Sancho. Im glad you have a good eye and are willing to find out the problem from the first signs that somethings wrong. As Dave stated, eye closures can mean a slew of things. A couple questions I have. You said at first he was closing both eyes and your other post he was just closing one of his eyes?

Did the vet check for debris in the eye/eyes?

Do you mist him directly? Is it a hard mist if so?

What brand of vitamins do you use? Does it have a beta carotene source of vit a or a pre formed source?

I had a problem with Mrs. Fireball last summer with her closing her eye. Im not sure exactly what corrected it but I did a few things. I will try and make this short First I stopped misting all my chameleons directly because of a post from Chamco. It doesnt mist in nature it rains is basically what he said They dont need water sprayed in the eyes. I now use a light mist more like small rain drops and I make sure if its hitting the chameleon it is falling from above not shooting from the side.

The second thing I did, and I know this is controversial, was dose her up with preformed vit A source via capsule. I had stopped using reptivite which has preformed vit A and started using herptivite quite earlier before the problem. Herptivite has a beta carotene source of vit A which may or may not be able to be converted to useable vit A. (Im not starting a debate)

She also laid eggs just before the problem began so it could have been debris in the eye also but after "fixing" these issues her eye got better with in days and I havent had a problem since (knock on wood).

Also, Sancho is what, around 10 months? I know you starved him for a week but its about time to start gradually decreasing his food/supplement intake. How is his eating now? This may have caused the issue??? Another thing is, I know you use a very good gutload regimen so less is more with the supplements, you dont want to over do them.

Hopefully my thoughts arent too jumbled I am glad one of my little guys made it to such a dedicated caretaker ( I would like to think they all did). Im sure you will find and fix the problem soon. I hope something in my rant can help you out.

Cain

Edit: Missy was around 1.5 years old at the time.

 

[Sancho]

Hey Tim, sorry to hear about Sancho. Im glad you have a good eye and are willing to find out the problem from the first signs that somethings wrong. As Dave stated, eye closures can mean a slew of things. A couple questions I have. You said at first he was closing both eyes and your other post he was just closing one of his eyes?

Did the vet check for debris in the eye/eyes?

Do you mist him directly? Is it a hard mist if so?

What brand of vitamins do you use? Does it have a beta carotene source of vit a or a pre formed source?

I had a problem with Mrs. Fireball last summer with her closing her eye. Im not sure exactly what corrected it but I did a few things. I will try and make this short First I stopped misting all my chameleons directly because of a post from Chamco. It doesnt mist in nature it rains is basically what he said They dont need water sprayed in the eyes. I now use a light mist more like small rain drops and I make sure if its hitting the chameleon it is falling from above not shooting from the side.

The second thing I did, and I know this is controversial, was dose her up with preformed vit A source via capsule. I had stopped using reptivite which has preformed vit A and started using herptivite quite earlier before the problem. Herptivite has a beta carotene source of vit A which may or may not be able to be converted to useable vit A. (Im not starting a debate)

She also laid eggs just before the problem began so it could have been debris in the eye also but after "fixing" these issues her eye got better with in days and I havent had a problem since (knock on wood).

Also, Sancho is what, around 10 months? I know you starved him for a week but its about time to start gradually decreasing his food/supplement intake. How is his eating now? This may have caused the issue??? Another thing is, I know you use a very good gutload regimen so less is more with the supplements, you dont want to over do them.

Hopefully my thoughts arent too jumbled I am glad one of my little guys made it to such a dedicated caretaker ( I would like to think they all did). Im sure you will find and fix the problem soon. I hope something in my rant can help you out.

Cain

Edit: Missy was around 1.5 years old at the time.

Vet did look in the eye and didn't see anything. He is only closing one eye and he will open and use it from time to time while walking and etc. I use a hand mister and he does get wet in the process so I'm not sure if the water got into his eye. (I have a mistking coming this week)

 

[Cainschams]

I dont think that getting water on him is bad just not blasting in his eye Not saying thats what you are doing. I just wanted to give you a run down of my situation.

I guess I could have ran over your cage and cham info not just the problem first

Is he still only eating supers? Also , repcal vits only has a beta carotene source of vit A. Have you givin him any type of preformed vit A? If it was me I would give him a dose. I dont think it would hurt. Just get a capsule and make a pin hole in it. Put the least amount of liquid possible on a feeder and give it to him.

Like I said, if it was me I would try it. Maybe Dave will chime in or consult with him to see if he thinks it would be a good idea

 

[Sancho]

I dont think that getting water on him is bad just not blasting in his eye Not saying thats what you are doing. I just wanted to give you a run down of my situation.

I guess I could have ran over your cage and cham info not just the problem first

Is he still only eating supers? Also , repcal vits only has a beta carotene source of vit A. Have you givin him any type of preformed vit A? If it was me I would give him a dose. I dont think it would hurt. Just get a capsule and make a pin hole in it. Put the least amount of liquid possible on a feeder and give it to him.

Like I said, if it was me I would try it. Maybe Dave will chime in or consult with him to see if he thinks it would be a good idea

The water does come out of the hand mister fast but I try to keep it away from him but get all his leafs wet. I only use repcal with d3 without d3 and vits on my chams.

 

[Sancho]

Here is sancho and the eye he is now closing a lot during the day just 2 days ago

 

[Sancho]

Update: sanchos poo came back clean. I set my camera on sancho filming all day long and the video shows him with his eyes open 90% of the day and closing the right eye for a few times some for a few seconds sometimes for 2-4 minutes

 

[chamelisa]

Here is sancho and the eye he is now closing a lot during the day just 2 days ago

Awwww, what a cute little eye! Glad to hear about the fecal test.

 

[Dave Weldon]

...Also , repcal vits only has a beta carotene source of vit A. Have you givin him any type of preformed vit A? If it was me I would give him a dose. I dont think it would hurt. Just get a capsule and make a pin hole in it. Put the least amount of liquid possible on a feeder and give it to him.

Like I said, if it was me I would try it. Maybe Dave will chime in or consult with him to see if he thinks it would be a good idea

Howdy Tim,

What Cain mentioned about giving a tiny dose of vitamin A would ensure that he doesn't have a shortage of it. In the event that there was an actual shortage of vitamin A (hypovitaminosis A) a tiny dose would help turn things around. At least you could cross that off the list.

I thought I'd also mention that one of my chameleons would often close his left eye if I approached him with a feeder (roach) that he didn't want at that moment . It reminded me of a little kid who didn't want to eat his brussel sprouts.

I prefer flood over spot lights. I've been pretty happy with the 60W Philips Halogena (halogen) flood lights: http://www.lighting.philips.com/us_...g&parent=7593748565&id=us_en_products&lang=en. Places like Home Depot carry them, sometimes in a low-cost three-pack.

 

[Shaner]

Instead of hand misting, why don't you create a home made drip system?

Very easy and very cheap. All you need is:

1) a big enough container such as a big yogurt container
2) 1 control valve

drill a small hole at the bottom of the container, push the control valve in and your done.

fill the container with water, get a desired flow control going and run the water off some leaves. That way during the day he will be getting his water when you are not around to keep him hydrated.

Nice Cham by the way...very nice colours.

 

[Sancho]

Instead of hand misting, why don't you create a home made drip system?

Very easy and very cheap. All you need is:

1) a big enough container such as a big yogurt container
2) 1 control valve

drill a small hole at the bottom of the container, push the control valve in and your done.

fill the container with water, get a desired flow control going and run the water off some leaves. That way during the day he will be getting his water when you are not around to keep him hydrated.

Nice Cham by the way...very nice colours.

I have a mistking ultimate system coming this week.

 

[Sancho]

Howdy Tim,

What Cain mentioned about giving a tiny dose of vitamin A would ensure that he doesn't have a shortage of it. In the event that there was an actual shortage of vitamin A (hypovitaminosis A) a tiny dose would help turn things around. At least you could cross that off the list.

I thought I'd also mention that one of my chameleons would often close his left eye if I approached him with a feeder (roach) that he didn't want at that moment . It reminded me of a little kid who didn't want to eat his brussel sprouts.

I prefer flood over spot lights. I've been pretty happy with the 60W Philips Halogena (halogen) flood lights: http://www.lighting.philips.com/us_...g&parent=7593748565&id=us_en_products&lang=en. Places like Home Depot carry them, sometimes in a low-cost three-pack.

Dave, This is the current light I have for him http://www.reptilesupply.com/product.php?products_id=166 Should I just replace it with the philips you are talking about? Also how would I got about getting the vitamin A and giving it to him?

 

[Jason4045]

Dave, This is the current light I have for him http://www.reptilesupply.com/product.php?products_id=166 Should I just replace it with the philips you are talking about? Also how would I got about getting the vitamin A and giving it to him?

I think im going to switch to a flood aswell, Im using Exo Terra Sun Glo's, and the beam is tight. It looks like a dam laser beam. I think a flood would heat the basking area more evenly. The temps are there, just he he has a small spot to stand in to get it. Thanks for the info aswell Dave.

 

[Sancho]

I think im going to switch to a flood aswell, Im using Exo Terra Sun Glo's, and the beam is tight. It looks like a dam laser beam. I think a flood would heat the basking area more evenly. The temps are there, just he he has a small spot to stand in to get it. Thanks for the info aswell Dave.

Yeah I'm going over to home depot tonight and picking up one of the lights Dave talked about. Update on Sancho he is back to normal acting a fool! Mister and new light should be here by the end of the week

 

[Sancho]

Just a update! Sancho is 100% now he was just hydrated and has been taking showers like crazy and now with the mist king his urates are normal and he is eatting like a big boy again and not being picky at all.