Creating an "Adjustable UV Out-put" Light / Lighting System for the American Market... does anyone think it's a good idea?

[Venutus1]

Creating an "Adjustable UV Out-put" Light / Lighting System for the American Market... does anyone think it's a good idea?

For the last year I have toyed with the idea of creating a light / lighting system that the UV is adjustable / or "tune-able" in. Does anyone think this would be marketable?

Would anyone buy such a thing?

You could say I am doing a bit of market research on this.

Basically it would be a fixture that you can adjust the UVB out-put on to suit the needs of your set up.

It would cost a bundle to develop and market so I want to figure out if I should do it or not. ?

Cheers, Todd

 

[Beman]

Todd how do you mean adjustable? Like being able to raise the UVB section of the fixture higher off the screen? Or are you thinking being able to dim a UVB bulb to get the desired output?

 

[Venutus1]

Todd how do you mean adjustable? Like being able to raise the UVB section of the fixture higher off the screen? Or are you thinking being able to dim a UVB bulb to get the desired output?

By a few methods incorporated into the design... but nothing to do with raising or lowering it.
Wel, you could do that too.
But it would not be needed to tweak the UV.

I have to be a teensy bit vague,
Beman, as you may understand.
We don't need folks ripping of the design.

But it is suffice to say the UV can be adjusted by adjusting the UV out put of the bulbs in it,
as well as being able to easily UV "screen off" areas under the bulbs, to lower UV in certain areas or all over.

As well as adjust the number of bulbs lit and when throughout the day.
To simulate a UV day cycle.
IE. you could have low UV and light levels early morning and late afternoon and "Full UV" during mid-day for "mid day" sun.

It is best described as easily "UV Tune-able" in this 3 bulb design.

I have been playing with a few prototypes for the last year ....and you can have UV from 0.0 to 1.0 to up to 6.0 at like 12 - 14" inches.

The cost would probably be like 130.00 +/- for a 3 BULB unit for the average 24" x 24" x 48H" cage.

It would produce enough light for most plants.

A jungle dawn LED could be addedd if folks needed a REAL bright set up.
But for most set ups, it would suffice great for plants too.

I am just wondering if it were really good if folks would be interested.

 

[Beman]

By a few methods incorporated into the design... but nothing to do with raising or lowering it.
Wel, you could do that too.
But it would not be needed to tweak the UV.

I have to be a teensy bit vague,
Beman, as you may understand.
We don't need folks ripping of the design.

But it is suffice to say the UV can be adjusted by adjusting the UV out put of the bulbs in it,
as well as being able to easily UV "screen off" areas under the bulbs, to lower UV in certain areas or all over.

As well as adjust the number of bulbs lit and when throughout the day.
To simulate a UV day cycle.
IE. you could have low UV and light levels early morning and late afternoon and "Full UV" during mid-day for "mid day" sun.

It is best described as easily "UV Tune-able" in this 3 bulb design.

I have been playing with a few prototypes for the last year ....and you can have UV from 0.0 to 1.0 to up to 6.0 at like 12 - 14" inches.

The cost would probably be like 130.00 +/- for a 3 BULB unit for the average 24" x 24" x 48H" cage.

It would produce enough light for most plants.

A jungle dawn LED could be addedd if folks needed a REAL bright set up.
But for most set ups, it would suffice great for plants too.

I am just wondering if it were really good if folks would be interested.

I think it would be worth it if you actually had a way to ensure that the output was in fact the range of exposure you were wanting to achieve. However there are many variables to consider as you know. How heavily planted an enclosure is up to the screen top and what type of screen it is going through.

Right now without a solarmeter most are going on the typically recommended distances to a branch below the fixture. So for a 5.0 or 6% bulb in a single bulb T5HO fixture it needs a distance of 8-9 inches to the branch below it with a screen in between to get an approximate 3 UVI level where the chams body sits off the branch. Then for a 10.0 or 12% bulb in a single bulb T5HO fixture it needs a distance of 11-12 inches to the branch below it with a screen in between to get an approximate 3 UVI level where the chams body sits off the branch.

This still does not ensure the exact UVI as we know fixture type and reflector can make a big difference on output levels. Not to mention UVB reduction levels that happen naturally over the bulb "life". And again the screen type used that the fixture is going through.

What I will say is not many people are willing to spend money especially if they are new to the hobby. We recommend a solarmeter to be used to verify levels however many people do not buy one. When it comes to UVB most seem to just buy the cheapest they can get their hands on because of the expense of all the other items needed to provide correct husbandry.

I do think it being a 3 bulb unit and having daylight bulbs with it would make it more worth wild for people to buy. If you can make the price comparable to at least using 3 single T5HO fixtures. 2 with daylight bulbs and 1 with UVB. That alone would run someone about $150 cost of fixtures and UVB bulb.

 

[Tkrd69]

Not to get off topic but you 2 seem to know a lot about uvb. My question is I'm using a T8 reptisun 10.0 tube just noticed I don't have a reflecter in unit what distance to branch do i need, I can put tinfoil in till I can get a T5 set up. Any help appreciated. Thank you

 

[Venutus1]

Not to get off topic but you 2 seem to know a lot about uvb. My question is I'm using a T8 reptisun 10.0 tube just noticed I don't have a reflecter in unit what distance to branch do i need, I can put tinfoil in till I can get a T5 set up. Any help appreciated. Thank you

Yep.
I do.
Been using UV over reptiles since 1979.
I have yet to meet anyone doing it longer!
I am old as dirt, LOL.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


It is hard to say without testing it with a solarmeter to know 100% if you are in the UVB "sweet spot" or not.

Yes, you can use tinfoil as a reflector, but lets find out if you need it!
(Arcadia also makes add on mirror finished reflectors that go behind the light and add up to 40 - 50% more UV.)

BUT
First things first...
If you have your cham in a small 18 x 18 x 36 cage and it is a young one... you probably do NOT want more UVB w/ that 10% bulb as it is now.

If you have a large cage (24 x 24 x 48)
and the screen is dense on the top... and no reflector behind that T8 bulb...
Then you probably could use more UV !

No way to give answer unless I know more &
and a picture is worth 1000 words!

Can you post a pic of your set up so I can see what you are working with?
Or e/m it to me at: [email protected]?

Can better advise if I can eyeball what you are working with!

Cheers.
Todd

ps.
light reflectors at bottom of page 9 in the Arcadia catalogue if anyone is intertested...
they work GREAT.
https://www.arcadiareptile.com/catalogue/

 

[Tkrd69]

Repti breeze 24x 24x 48 black screen top. Sassy may be coming up to 1 year. Uvb branch 10 inch to 12 inch from light

 

[Beman]

Simply put a T8 with a reflector would need about 7 inches to branch roughly... At about 5 inches down through screen your getting a 3 UVI level approximately. But without the reflector it has nothing to bounce it down properly. Didn't you say in another thread that your cham has been screen climbing the top? I believe this was you. This is more than likely why he is doing this. Like I said in that thread... If something is off in husbandry they will react accordingly. In your case UVB is not optimal so he is trying to get as close as possible.

I would honestly switch to a T5HO fixture with a 5.0 or 6% and then do your branch 8-9 inches down. Should stop him screen climbing the top if the branch is the correct distance away.

Arcadia makes a great fixture.

 

[Tkrd69]

It was me, trying to save money up for T5 fixture last T8 bulb cost me $48 dollars. So I should put tinfoil behind the bulb.

 

[Beman]

It was me, trying to save money up for T5 fixture last T8 bulb cost me $48 dollars. So I should put tinfoil behind the bulb.

It will not reflect the same but it is better than nothing at all I suppose. Next time you order lighting run it by us. $48 for a T8 bulb is crazy.

 

[Tkrd69]

I get them at Petco, petsmart there almost 60

 

[Beman]

I get them at Petco, petsmart there almost 60

Yeah don't do that again lol. There are better sites to order from.

 

[Tkrd69]

Not the site at the store Petco 1 1\2 away petsmart 2 hours away

 

[Beman]

Not the site at the store Petco 1 1\2 away petsmart 2 hours away

Right they charge crazy prices at petco and petsmart and you do not even get what you need. There are other reptile online sites that sell fixtures for real prices. Some include free shipping and some do not.

 

[Tkrd69]

Thank you

 

[yoteango]

How long until UVB LED finally come out as long lasting and cheapish? Then any dimming is done the same as any other LED.

 

[Venutus1]

These work fantastic reflecting UVB, I have used them and tesetd them with solarmeters. They come in both t5 and t8 sizing. Can clip on bulb .... or can be used in standard "aquarium" style light fixture. Like one with white plastic backing above. In that kind of light...just pop in behind bulb, tension holds it securely in place. They are very reflective, mirror polished aluminium. They fit about 95% of every fixture that I have used them in... but they could be cut or trimmed if needed with some utility scissors (or even slightly bent) to fit any weird fixture. Cheers Todd

 

[nightanole]

Here is a dumb question to go along with the thread. Would a T5HO, installed in a T5 Non-HO fixture, still put out the correct spectrum/color temp, but just at half the lumen output?

If so this magic adjustable lightning system could have a highbeam/lowbeam setup using just a custom ballast .

Then again this wanders into the fact lumens change as the bulbs are turned on and off. So you would need a LED base output as the main source of light, and the T5HO's as just a UVB source.

 

[BryanP]

Creating an "Adjustable UV Out-put" Light / Lighting System for the American Market... does anyone think it's a good idea?

For the last year I have toyed with the idea of creating a light / lighting system that the UV is adjustable / or "tune-able" in. Does anyone think this would be marketable?

Would anyone buy such a thing?

You could say I am doing a bit of market research on this.

Basically it would be a fixture that you can adjust the UVB out-put on to suit the needs of your set up.

It would cost a bundle to develop and market so I want to figure out if I should do it or not. ?

Cheers, Todd

I'll chime in here...

I really want an all in 1 fixture that will be able to ramp up LEDs for daylight and then (if I'm picking up what you're putting down) you could also ramp up the UVB output as well.

I'll also assume you're going to use LEDs for the UVB (I dont think these exist yet or are prohibitively expensive at the moment) or some sort of mask that will effect the UVB output of standard florescent tubes.

Back to what I think this hobby needs that does not yet exist; much like some more expensive reef tank lighting, the ability to schedule dawn/dusk cycles in the lighting profile in both color and intensity. If you made it so that it was wifi and matched the dawn/dusk cycle of your zip code that would be an added bonus but a simple 12hr on/off with like a 1hr ramp up/down on either end would be awesome.

 

[Venutus1]

Hi Bryan,

HOT BUTTON ALERT

UV LEDS aaarrrhhhhhhhhh

lol




It is a NO GO on UV emitting LED diodes right now.
And may be FOR A WHILE.
Because, in a nut-shell...
they still can not create the correct spectral curve needed to simulate natural sunlight. And folks that have tried to create this so far all have failed to one degree or another.
Possibly even creating some dangerous products.

I myself have been working with the LED "issues" for a L-O-nG time...
ever since 11 years ago I developed and trademarked the Jungle Dawn® line of LED lighting. I always wanted to add the UVB and UVA producing diodes into a Jungle Dawn® array to get EVEN CLOSER with LED to natural sunlight.
But IT HAS NEVER HAPPENED FOR A REASON.
The ANIMALS WELL BEING!!

I actually have a UV LED product from a large manufacturer >>> plugged in and going RIGH NOW
just feet from me as I type this.
haha
But I am seeing nothing very different (or any good!)
out of this unit than what could have been produced anytime in the past 8 or 9 years.

As of right now Bryan,
there is NOTHING that will work better than correctly applied
Arcadia T5 bulbs for UV
mixed in an array with 6 - 6.5k full spectrum daylight bulbs
AND/OR a real good Day Spectrum LED like Jungle Dawn® LED.

(Clarification:
LED added, IF NEEDED in a specific set up, to boost the lumen in the set up to grow plants better. LED not a "must" but very good if more light is needed.)

Repeat:
As of right now Brian,
there is NOTHING that will work better than a correctly set up Arcadia T5 bulb(s) mixed in an array with 6 - 6.5k full spectrum daylight bulbs
(or a proper full spectrum LED added in, IF NEEDED. to boost the lumen in the set up to grow plants.)

I actually like what Arcdaia did with this "all in one" product that would "plop" down nicely on any 24 x 24 x 36"H or 48"H - ish cage.
Advertising, shmadvertising...
It is a real good "all in one" product --
and the only one out there that I am aware of that incorporates enough *UMPH* as far as light,
heat and UV for like a 24 x 24 x 48 cham cage.

And I am plugging it >>>> even though it may compete with the product I am working on.
See pics of the new Arcadia THERMALZOO pro below.

As for ANY UV emitting LED product OUT NOW...
I would not use them.
Spectrally they are too messed up.

And they may well even
GIVE THE ANIMALS FALSE CUES on regulating their UV and basking*
RESULTING IN GREAT HARM that may take days, weeks or months to show up.
(ummm... think BLINDNESS )
Think:
in DIM light, pupils do not constrict, thus allowing too much UV light to enter and hit retna.


* in my personal opinion, this is what easily could happen if these UV LED products are used exclusivly on a cage.

I have the studies on them done by Francis Baines and Saina Wunderlich in Germany, if anyone wants these by request, (much too long to post, very detailed studies).
Please e/m me at [email protected] and request I send you copies. I am happy to e/m them back to anyone fot their reading pleasure! ( at least an hour++ of it, LOL, like I said, very detailed! )
In the subject line of your e/m, please put:
"Todd, please send me Francis & Sarinas UV led testing data." so I will see it and respond asap.

Cheers!
Todd