Feeding my adult Veileds

[ZEROPILOT]

I did do a search on this and this is what I THINK I understand:
That juveniles actually eat more than adults.
Is this so?
My adults eat like hogs. Especially when it comes to a treat food, such as Superworms. They will each eat more than 10 at a single sitting. I've been giving them 4 (about once every week, ten days) and they just stare at the empty bowl. Looking for more.
Is four crickets, superworms or 2 hornworms enough for an adult?
And once a day?
Every two days?
This also seems up to debate.
Any first hand advise would be helpful. My chams are about 9 months old now. Three male Veiled.

 

[cruz.m]

I did do a search on this and this is what I THINK I understand:
That juveniles actually eat more than adults.
Is this so?
My adults eat like hogs. Especially when it comes to a treat food, such as Superworms. They will each eat more than 10 at a single sitting. I've been giving them 4 (about once every week, ten days) and they just stare at the empty bowl. Looking for more.
Is four crickets, superworms or 2 hornworms enough for an adult?
And once a day?
Every two days?
This also seems up to debate.
Any first hand advise would be helpful. My chams are about 9 months old now. Three male Veiled.

Depends babies eat more since they’re growing. Females start cutting back food at 4 months since that’s the age they may start producing eggs. Males as well but not as much (veiled chameleons). Once they’re adults they should only eat a couple bugs every two days or every other day. They’re not full adults yet until they’re 1 years old. This is a link to chameleon academy that talks about food and feeding schedules https://chameleonacademy.com/basics-feeding-chameleons/ I’ll tag a few people that helped me and know a lot more. @Beman @kinyonga

 

[ERKleRose]

Adult males should only have the amount/equivalent of 2-3 crickets every other day to three times a week. All feeders should be properly (and well) gutloaded and supplemented

 

[cruz.m]

I did do a search on this and this is what I THINK I understand:
That juveniles actually eat more than adults.
Is this so?
My adults eat like hogs. Especially when it comes to a treat food, such as Superworms. They will each eat more than 10 at a single sitting. I've been giving them 4 (about once every week, ten days) and they just stare at the empty bowl. Looking for more.
Is four crickets, superworms or 2 hornworms enough for an adult?
And once a day?
Every two days?
This also seems up to debate.
Any first hand advise would be helpful. My chams are about 9 months old now. Three male Veiled.

I also think you’re feeding too much but I’ll have others criticize you on that. Treats should be given twice a week and only 2 is what I’ve read and have been told.

 

[ERKleRose]

Adult males should only have the amount/equivalent of 2-3 crickets every other day to three times a week. All feeders should be properly (and well) gutloaded and supplemented

The amount of feeders depends on your veileds’ fat pads, and if they’re obese, fat, normal, or too skinny, etc.

 

[ERKleRose]

I did do a search on this and this is what I THINK I understand:
That juveniles actually eat more than adults.
Is this so?
My adults eat like hogs. Especially when it comes to a treat food, such as Superworms. They will each eat more than 10 at a single sitting. I've been giving them 4 (about once every week, ten days) and they just stare at the empty bowl. Looking for more.
Is four crickets, superworms or 2 hornworms enough for an adult?
And once a day?
Every two days?
This also seems up to debate.
Any first hand advise would be helpful. My chams are about 9 months old now. Three male Veiled.

Just because they’ll eat that many treats does not mean it’s good for them or is right. Treats are called “treats” for a reason, as they’re not as healthy as staple feeders (which should never be just one, rotate through multiple staple feeders all the time). @cruz.m is right, you’re feeding too much, including treats.

 

[cruz.m]

I really want to see your chams. I have a feeling at least one may have or start developing obesity with the amount you’re feeding. Can you post a picture and maybe fill this out so the people on here can help you? @ERKleRose is right just because they’ll eat it does not mean it’s good for them. I’m sure if I offered my cham that many treats and food she’d eat all of it.

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
• Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
• Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
• Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
• History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
• Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
• Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
• Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
• Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
• Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.

--------------

Please Note:

1. The more details you provide the better and more accurate help you will receive.
2. Photos can be very helpful

 

[ERKleRose]

The Chameleon Academy’s veiled care sheet has a quick guide for feeding amounts, among other info:
https://chameleonacademy.com/veiled-chameleon-care/
I’d also fill out the form for your panther, as well
Edit: The Chameleon Academy has the most up-to-date and accurate info, so read through all modules, and listen to them as much as possible!

 

[Fchamel]

So yes... juvenile chameleons do eat more than adults, but as they get older, you decrease the amount you feed them, and how often you feed them. You have to be very careful with females because food plays a big role in their egg-laying process. Bugs like superworms, wax worms... they are good to feed every so often. 10 is way too many because of their high-fat content.

 

[ZEROPILOT]

The Chameleon Academy’s veiled care sheet has a quick guide for feeding amounts, among other info:
https://chameleonacademy.com/veiled-chameleon-care/
I’d also fill out the form for your panther, as well
Edit: The Chameleon Academy has the most up-to-date and accurate info, so read through all modules, and listen to them as much as possible!

According to that, I've been overfeeding my adults. (Way overfeeding)
And yes, looking at the crests, cheek pads and legs, they are a little fat.
(With YOUTUBE as a guide)
Obesity is something I never considered. And I truly learn something new all of the time.
I'll be feeding 2 or 3 dusted, gutloaded food items every 2 days in the future. Maybe every 3 days for a few weeks.
I'll weigh them for a baseline and stop the Hornworms until I see some reduction in weight.
Thanks again.
You may have once again stopped a potentially serious situation for my chams.
(You also saw the MBD in my newly acquired little Panther)

 

[ERKleRose]

According to that, I've been overfeeding my adults. (Way overfeeding)
And yes, looking at the crests, cheek pads and legs, they are a little fat.
(With YOUTUBE as a guide)
Obesity is something I never considered. And I truly learn something new all of the time.
I'll be feeding 2 or 3 dusted, gutloaded food items every 2 days in the future. Maybe every 3 days for a few weeks.
I'll weigh them for a baseline and stop the Hornworms until I see some reduction in weight.
Thanks again.
You may have once again stopped a potentially serious situation for my chams.
(You also saw the MBD in my newly acquired little Panther)

Stop the superworms, too. Only use healthy staple feeders!

 

[cruz.m]

Here are foods and gutloading

 

[ERKleRose]

And here’s the updated gutload chart

 

[ERKleRose]

@ZEROPILOT I would also recommend filling out the ask for help form with your panther to make sure everything is good, especially since he has MBD!

 

[CasqueAbove]

Veilds are like fish. They do not know if there is a next meal so they eat all the can. They can and will eat themselves to death. The quantity of food can vary by temp, season, age, and sex. I have a make that only eats the equivalent of 6 to 8 large crickets a week. This is on the low end, and there are reasons for it so it is not a recommendation, but a comparison.
Obesity is a big problem in chams. They need far less than we often feed. Cooler temps lo to mid 70 ambient, with 80 basking. They are active and thriving.
Don't over feed. Treats are ok, but know they tend to be more for us than the cham. At least the things we feed. Not bad, but not completely natural either. In the wild we can assume they eat things like beetles and tree dwelling grubs, but these would be very seasonal and only available for a month or two.

Petr just did some work on this.

 

[ZEROPILOT]

As far as staples readily available in south Florida...
It's a short list.
Many feeders are illegal to import here.
I feed dusted, loadef Banded Crickets each feeding.
Im breeding Superworms. They are a treat food.
I can also get Hornworms.
I'm attempting to set up a horseshoe crab roach colony because my wife refuses to let Discoids or any other "Roach like "roaches in the house.
I'd like to offer more variety in general. But insects that:
A) I can obtain
And
B) That are suitable staples
Are a real issue. Especially for my fully grown 15 month old male Veileds.
The Panther is so small that things like soldier fly larvae and other small feeders still appeal to him.
But my larger chams don't even consider small insects.
Today is the very first no feed day for the Veileds. And they are sure looking for food!

 

[ERKleRose]

You can also get silkworms. And hatch the BSFL into flies, along with other larvae/worms/spikes, like blue/green bottle spikes, hornworms, silkworms, wax worms, etc. Definitely get the horseshoe crab roaches, and try to convince your wife on discoids, as well! Look at other FL-legal Roaches, too, there are TONS! Even if Florida is restrictive, there are still plenty of options!

 

[ERKleRose]

Also, I’m not sure if you just worded it wrong or what, but all feeders need be dusted, not just crickets! And every feeder needs to be properly gutloaded (silkworms and hornworms have specialized food), too, not just crickets!

 

[ZEROPILOT]

Also, I’m not sure if you just worded it wrong or what, but all feeders need be dusted, not just crickets! And every feeder needs to be properly gutloaded (silkworms and hornworms have specialized food), too, not just crickets!

Yes, I do dust all of them
☆Calcium every day
☆Calcium with D3 less than once a week
☆Calcium and vitamin dust about the same. A week to 10 days apart.
I'm also rotating BEE POLLEN into my vitamin dust.
I've started a new post about that, actually

 

[ERKleRose]

Yes, I do dust all of them
☆Calcium every day
☆Calcium with D3 less than once a week
☆Calcium and vitamin dust about the same. A week to 10 days apart.
I'm also rotating BEE POLLEN into my vitamin dust.
I've started a new post about that, actually

Okay, so that is incorrect. You need a quality phosphorus-free calcium without D3 every feeding, a quality phosphorus-free calcium with D3 once every two weeks (this is only if they don’t go outside for natural UVB for long enough), and a quality multivitamin without D3 once every two weeks. Do not use the calcium with D3 and the multivitamin without D3 on the same day, rotate through so one day every week is one of them, and then the next week will be the other, and repeat. Does your multivitamin have preformed Vitamin A in it? What brands do you use? You can always add a little bit of bee pollen to every dusting.