Feeding Snails to Chams (video and general info)

[summoner12]

Cricket crack!

LOL my Mitsio was once in a "Dubia craze"... took him quite a while to try something different. I am thinking about trying the snails once I get into WC females.

I am gonna give steve a plug here..... He didn't like the Dubia till I was gut loading them with Cricket Crack

I will also try the snails. I have a jackson... I'll see if he goes for it like Nikki's does.

 

[Dave Weldon]

Howdy,

It sounds like snails would make a nice addition to the feeders that chameleon keepers could raise. A quick Googling about garden snails and parasites suggests that there is a strong possibility that the typical wild garden snail may carry various parasites, and some of which, might survive in a chameleon. I wonder if we could eliminate their potential for parasite issues by raising them from eggs? Maybe someone in the group will track down a "food grade" quality source for a starter colony? I know that the list of possible parasites that they could carry can be killed by cooking but that won't work for us . Maybe we need the help of an Entomologist or a French Chef . I'm glad to hear that Mike's Vet didn't find parasites, other than protozoa (some protozoa can be nasty parasites), in the sample that was tested. That's a great start.

Kenya: How about putting a sample of the egg liquid under your microscope?

I'll bet that we could eliminate most if not all of the parasites through clean eggs production. From a quick reading, it looked like most of the parasite issues were from the snail being exposed to things like rat feces and other wild animal poop etc.

Just open and serve : http://www.petdiscounters.com/c10/Exo-Terra-De-Shelled-Snails-p5119.html Too bad they removed the shell .

"A good food source" for protein etc:
http://www.springerlink.com/content/n661p138v7045371/

Vitamins and minerals etc:
http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/cgi-bin/list_nut_edit.pl
(Looks like the calcium to phosphorus ratio (1:27) is similar to superworms so we will need help with dusting. (Garlic and butter ?).
They have a little bit of Vitamin A which might be just right for a very light dose.

 

[Sepioteuthis]

Vitamins and minerals etc:
http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/foodcomp/cgi-bin/list_nut_edit.pl
(Looks like the calcium to phosphorus ratio (1:27) is similar to superworms so we will need help with dusting. (Garlic and butter ?).
They have a little bit of Vitamin A which might be just right for a very light dose.

Those values of course are without the shell. With the shell the Ca ratio is more like 32:1 (link in Dutch, scroll down to table, huisjesslakken=snails)

BTW I ordered some snails from Carolina biological supply (www.carolina.com). I'm thinking I'll sacrifice one and put it under the microscope to check for parasites.

 

[Dave Weldon]

Those values of course are without the shell. With the shell the Ca ratio is more like 32:1

Howdy Suzanne,

Good catch! I forgot that the government doesn't expect us to be using their tables for feeding our chameleons .

EDIT: Adding the Dutch website translation: http://translate.google.com/transla...eren/chemisch.php&sl=nl&tl=en&history_state0=

(Cute how snails without shells translates to "Nude Snails" and with shells is "Cottage Snails" .)

 

[Dave Weldon]

Howdy,

Want to become a snail farmer? Here's an interesting report that covers everything from how to rasie them to how much money to allocate for Marketing and Advertizing . http://www.rirdc.gov.au/reports/NAP/00-188.htm

A USA Document: http://www.nal.usda.gov/afsic/AFSIC_pubs/srb96-05.htm

 

[ColorCham427]

how are Decollate Snails ?

http://www.growquest.com/snail_destroyer.htm

 

[kenya]

Well, an interesting update and some speculation....


I took out some appropriately sized snails to feed off yesterday and offered them to my Jackson's and panthers. The panthers were mildly interested in the snails and tried shooting them a few times but their tongues wouldn't stick. They finally walked up and grabbed the snails. After they got a taste, they all seemed ready for more and eager, so snails must taste great. The Jackson's know to go straight up and pluck the snail off of the branch and don't even try to shoot. They have done this since day one and I know that my male had never seen a snail before I gave him one, so it must be instinctual to montanes that snails have to be plucked and not shot.

It makes sense that there are going to be more snails at higher, moist, cool elevations than warmer lowland regions.

I have read that snails and slugs are good sources of preformed vitamin A (retinol) as well, so this could partially explain how enough preformed A is found in the wild. Snails are also an excellent calcium source.

I believe that they may be a larger part of wild montanes diets than we think because there are species of snails that stay off of the ground and hang out in trees. It is not a far leap to think that your average wild Jackson's would encounter snails more often than baby birds or small mammals. Panthers and veileds probably see less snails and more birds and mammals. I wonder if there is a large difference in diet that we are missing by keeping them in captivity and feeding such different species similar diets? Maybe Jackson's females really go after snails while gravid and the extra calcium and vitamin A helps develop stronger babies, meaning the lack of the extra viatmins and minerals could be a reason that CB Jackson's babies have such a high mortality. As an example, my gravid female Jackson's has been snubbing most food recently but really went for the snails yesterday. I hadn't gotten a strong feeding response like that from her in at least 3 months.

Any input?

 

[chamelisa]

I would love to hear from anyone else who has fed snails to chams and detailed accounts of your chameleon's reactions.

I saw the same thing when I kept a female Jackson's that was a rescue. She ate them just like your male. I noticed he opened his mouth really wide to get that whole thing in there. Funny(gross)!

The female I had was found in Santa Barbara in a resident's driveway. The woman who found her tried setting her up but quickly decided it wasn't for her. So when I ended up with her, she came with a shefflera which was packed with snails.

I'm sure these were just WC snails from Santa Barbara. Before the Jackson's was adopted out, she had fecal testing done and my vet didn't find anything. I think that was pure luck!

You know how I am about snails... er slugs... well all those slimey things. Ick! But I'd definitely do it for Jackson's.

 

[kenya]

The female I had was found in Santa Barbara in a resident's driveway. The woman who found her tried setting her up but quickly decided it wasn't for her. So when I ended up with her, she came with a shefflera which was packed with snails.

You know how I am about snails... er slugs... well all those slimey things. Ick! But I'd definitely do it for Jackson's.

I wonder if she was an escaped/released pet or a feral Jackson's? I know that there are feral Jackson's in the San Luis Obispo area.

As to the slimy things, I like 'em. We originally got the snail as a pet...and then she exploded babies and they stopped being so cute. I am turning it into a serious project to breed clean feeder snails. It is going great so far. They make a fantastic treat.

 

[blackbetty]

Kenya, Thank you for linking this thread up. I will def. look into farm raising them myself as I knew nothing about the possibility of parasites. I do know she enjoyed the one snail I fed immensely so hopefully this will all go well and I can have them as a staple in her diet. Thank you for taking the time to post the information.

 

[kenya]

Kenya, Thank you for linking this thread up. I will def. look into farm raising them myself as I knew nothing about the possibility of parasites. I do know she enjoyed the one snail I fed immensely so hopefully this will all go well and I can have them as a staple in her diet. Thank you for taking the time to post the information.

No problem- just be sure to identify what kind of snails you catch and then be patient. You will get babies eventually!

And yes, as you saw, the Jackson's LOVE snails. They go batty when they see me coming with one.

 

[Eric Adrignola]

I might try to culture some snails. i know veileds eat them - Mike said they found ground snails in the things gut. Ground snails. Ground snails don't climb, so the tree lizards must be looking for them. Veileds and panthers are vry very adaptable - I would not be surprised if they went digging for snails... hehe

 

[jojackson]

Do you think my large 4 mnth veiled might try very small soft snails? I thought the shell might be a problem (indigestion/impaction) in jacksons atleast it must beabsorbed as usual for calcium?

 

[kenya]

Do you think my large 4 mnth veiled might try very small soft snails? I thought the shell might be a problem (indigestion/impaction) in jacksons atleast it must beabsorbed as usual for calcium?

It is surely possible (and no, the shells are not dangerous-just use common sense and moderation) but I have noticed that my veileds don't go for snails quite like the Jackson's do. It is worth a try.

 

[Chameleon Caretaker]

How often do you offer snails and would you give them only 1 at a time?

 

[kenya]

How often do you offer snails and would you give them only 1 at a time?

I only offer snails occasionally...probably about once every other month. I only feed off one snail at a time, generally, though I will sometimes give my bigger chams two medium snails.

 

[blackbetty]

What snails are good? Is there a site that distinguishes? I was thinking about just purchasing some and breeding from there but am coming across a ton and dont know which are to be avoided...

Think the cham would eat these?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtM0Y3YihAU

Holy Moly!

 

[eisentrauti]

Very interesting thread !
One of my deremensis (very big male) likes to eat snails which doesn't have caves (is slugs the right term ?)