First chameleon, jacksons?

[MortiMarie]

Hi guys! I just made an account here after lurking on a million posts. As stated, I'm in the very beginning research stages of chameleon ownership. In fact, I probably won't even purchase the little guy/gal until the fall. I have my heart set on a Jacksons, but could be easily swayed in order to make a responsible and informed decision. It would be my first chameleon, however I own a few "easy" reptiles (a Russian tortoise, a leopard gecko, and two White's Tree Frogs). From my understanding, jacksons are less forgiving of mistakes and change. Do you think it would be irresponsible to get one as a first cham? I plan to get the cage set up and tested WAY far in advance, and I have some experience with building natural, arboreal terrariums with my tree frogs. I have sort of a "shopping list" going so far, what do you guys think?:

18"x18"x36" screen cage
Zoo med little dripper
The Mistking starter
Some sort of large ficus/umbrella plant
3-4 big Exo terra vines
A big piece of grape wood (thinking of adhering air plants to it)
A reptisun 5.0 CFL
60 watt basking light
Zoo med combo mini dome lamp
More foliage as needed (and of course food/supplements)

Sorry for the super long post! Anyways, any input, tips, or other comments are mega appreciated.

 

[Virgil1972]

I would not use the CFL UVB light. They do not put out much UVB. I would get an Arcadia brand light. Light Your Reptiles is a sight sponsor that sells a big variety and the owner will help you with choosing a light. Also the Arcadia bulbs put out UVB for about a year while the CFL will only put out UVB for about 6 months. Also the cage you choose is the minimum size for your cham most go with a 24x24x48 size.

 

[MortiMarie]

Thanks for the input! I've heard a lot about Arcadia bulbs being long lasting, I think I will just go for that set up. I've read that keepers sometimes start chams in smaller cages and then move up; would it be at all problematic to start straight with a 24x24x48? I will likely get a juvenile when the time comes.

 

[Carlton]

Well, jackson's are a montane species, so will want cooler more humid conditions, particularly at night. Depending on where you live and what your climate is like, they might take more attention than a veiled or a panther. They are more sensitive to fat soluable vitamins so the supplementation schedule is a little different than one for a veiled or panther. A few comments on your shopping list:

Add a very good humidity gauge (hygrometer)...not the little analog dial types at the typical pet shop. Get a good electronic one. I'd get it before hand and start testing what your room humidity range normally is at different seasons, especially if you need to use an AC in summer or lots of forced air heating in winter. How cool can you get the room at night in summer?
Consider a larger cage...an adult will definitely use the space and it will be easier to get a nice bushy live plant inside.
If you have the Mistking you probably don't need the dripper if there's enough foliage to hold water droplets. Not all chams use drippers reliably.
Sandblasted grape wood will mold in a humid setup...something with intact bark won't mold as fast. If you have trees or large bushes in your yard and don't apply insecticides you can use that instead of grape wood.
Some people use CFLs...I don't . I prefer tubular florescent lights for UV, not CFLs. I like the spread of the light better.

Thanks for the input! I've heard a lot about Arcadia bulbs being long lasting, I think I will just go for that set up. I've read that keepers sometimes start chams in smaller cages and then move up; would it be at all problematic to start straight with a 24x24x48? I will likely get a juvenile when the time comes.

Thanks for the input! I've heard a lot about Arcadia bulbs being long lasting, I think I will just go for that set up. I've read that keepers sometimes start chams in smaller cages and then move up; would it be at all problematic to start straight with a 24x24x48? I will likely get a juvenile when the time comes.

Arcadias are great lights for chams. You can subdivide the "adult" sized cage for your little one fairly easily.

 

[MortiMarie]

Thanks so much, Carlton. So I'm now for sure set on a larger cage. I figure that even if further research sways me towards a veiled or panther this will be suitable for that species. This is why I'm setting up so far in advance I'm in California so I will be using an AC in the summer, I'll definitely have everything temp and humidity tested, especially in the 100+ degree Summer's where I live.

Do you guys think a jacksons is a significantly more challenging first cham? Any cham will be difficult and put at risk in an improper set up; if I have everything tried and tested well in advance, am I still biting off more than I can chew? I'd never want to harm the little guy due to inexperience.

 

[KLowery88]

Getting the set up constructed and tested beforehand is a great idea. Then you can see what you need to adjust. Since Jackson's need higher humidity, you might have to cover the sides of the screen cage with plastic if you find that you can't keep the humidity up.

I think your biggest consideration is that many Jackson's are wild caught, which come with their own issues. The Chameleon Breeder Podcast has great episodes on Jackson's and acclimating WC animals. I'd recommend giving them a listen: http://www.chameleonbreeder.com/podcast/ep-18-wild-caught-chameleons-acclimation/

Dealing with a WC animal can be tricky, so if you are set on a Jackson's I would take your time and try to find a captive born animal, preferrably one that is over five months old since Jackson's babies apparently have a strange die off period around 3 - 5 months.

 

[Andee]

If you set up your enclosure before hand and get a good environment and system going keeping jackson chameleons are necessarily complicated. It just takes a little bit more attention. You have to be aware certain individuals, even though the general populace of jacksons are sensitive to supplementation, certain individuals are very very sensitive and you have to keep your eye on them. If you get a wild caught, you will want them to settle in for a good long while before you even think about deworming unless it's an absolute necessity. I wouldn't deworm unless they've been in your care for at least 6 months. My jackson has severe MBD that she got from improper supplementation and care from a year of being in a pet store. She is definitely getting better with weekly natural sun and liquid calcium. But sadly she will always have bowed legs and never looks right because of her severe fractures in her forelimbs. Jacksons can be very calm but also very shy. They often want to be far more hands off in general compared to panthers and veileds. My female jackson will drink for 2 minutes straight every 4 mistings I have through out the day, and only starts drinking after 2 minutes so the mistings I have mine set to are 4 minutes long. Jacksons tend to drink for prolonged periods and very often so I would put in a drainage bucket for sure.

Edit: If your thinking about getting some type of drift wood or something from a pet store, get mopani wood. I would also look at getting wooden dowels. Exo-terra vines are hard to clean in high moisture enviroments and only come in one size. With only one size of perch and no variation to exercise their feet constantly chameleons can get infections known as bumble foot.

 

[JaxyGirl]

Thanks so much, Carlton. So I'm now for sure set on a larger cage. I figure that even if further research sways me towards a veiled or panther this will be suitable for that species. This is why I'm setting up so far in advance I'm in California so I will be using an AC in the summer, I'll definitely have everything temp and humidity tested, especially in the 100+ degree Summer's where I live.

Do you guys think a jacksons is a significantly more challenging first cham? Any cham will be difficult and put at risk in an improper set up; if I have everything tried and tested well in advance, am I still biting off more than I can chew? I'd never want to harm the little guy due to inexperience.

My first chameleon was a male Jacksons named Triton. He was Awesome!! You can see pics in my Album. He lived for almost 8 years.
I now have 2 panthers but to this day I miss my Triton.
I honestly didn't do anything much differently with my Jackson then my panthers I have now. Set up was very similar to my Panthers. However my Jacksons drank "a lot" more then my panthers. You need to make sure that he drinks his fill of water everyday with a good "long" misting daily 5-15 mins and a continuous dripper. Chances are you're going to have to set up a drainage system for your cage. A Mistking would be great.
Make sure you have a lot of live plants for him to hide in and get away from the lights when he needs to. A good variety of well fed feeders. Also vitamin supplementation is slightly less for Montane Chams then other Cham species.
They are great chams and the little dinosaur horns are the best!!!

 

[MortiMarie]

Thanks for the replies. I was going to ask about CB jacksons and their availability, as I haven't really found any in my limited searching. I'm more than willing to wait to find one, as it will be a really long time before I have the enclosure on lock. What to you all think? Are cb jacksons super hard to come by?

Wooden dowels are a great idea! That would probably be more cost efficient too. You've all been so helpful. I think I'm just going to continue planning for a jacksons in a 24x24x48 setup, so if I decide to pursue a veiled or panther there won't be too much to change (humidity/heat/supplements I would already have). I'll definitely post photos of the set up for your opinions once I get going.

One more thing-- I was planning on starting a dubia roach colony for my other reptiles. I know food variety is vital for chams (as most reptiles) but can they have more or less of a "staple" diet of roaches instead of crickets? I prefer roaches over crickets. Thanks again.

 

[KLowery88]

There aren't nearly as many CB Jackson's out there as there are Panther and Veiled. They're apparently harder to raise up healthy and there is a larger loss rate than with Veiled and Panther. Since you have the time, I would ask around maybe on some of the FB groups to see if any breeders will have babies in the coming months.

As for roaches, it seems like some chameleons take them readily and others don't. I also much prefer roaches, so I'm trying to get my guy to eat those instead of crickets. Crickets are much more active though, which seems to be why chameleons go for them more quickly. Apparently people have a lot of success with Green Banana Roaches, though they are a bit more difficult to keep than dubia or discoids since they climb very well.

 

[brownie64]

If you get a captive bred Jackson's make sure it is 5 to 6 months old so as to get out of the danger zone of sudden death syndrome. I'm glad to see you eagerly seeking preparedness saves a lot of heart ache in the future. Good luck

 

[MortiMarie]

Thanks for your replies. I'm still super far away from purchasing a cham of any species, but out of curiosity, are Mt. Kenyan jackson's any more difficult than the more common xanths? The only CB jacksons I've come across so far are adult jacksonii jacksonii on FL chams. To be honest, I think I'll probably end up with a panther. But I'll still be keeping my eyes peeled for CB jackson's, I've fallen pretty hard haha.

 

[brownie64]

Thanks for your replies. I'm still super far away from purchasing a cham of any species, but out of curiosity, are Mt. Kenyan jackson's any more difficult than the more common xanths? The only CB jacksons I've come across so far are adult jacksonii jacksonii on FL chams. To be honest, I think I'll probably end up with a panther. But I'll still be keeping my eyes peeled for CB jackson's, I've fallen pretty hard haha.

No their care is pretty much the same. They are more expensive, but also a lot more colorful, and harder to find.