Four Horned Chameleon Care Sheet/Info/Guide

[andrewdurant]

So over the weekend I ordered some more fake vines, and vine plants, and also 2 more of the Ficus you see. I also ordered two 13 watt Jungle Dawn and a fixture for them, they are not the straight up and down mount like you have. I couldn't find those on amazon but they mount to the fixture horizontally and shoot the light down at a right angle. Are these strong enough, 13 watt? I bought an exo terra fixture to house them. One nice thing about these ones is you can rotate them 340 degrees in the fixture to aim them in the right place. I also ordered 4 30" sandblasted manzanita, the arcadia quad 24" with one plant, one 6% UVB and two daylilght bulbs. Should I mount the lights above the corner with the elevated mounting brackets they come with or rest on top of screen cage? Magnets and a shower curtain have been ordered as Janet suggested. River rock for covering plant soil arrived today along with weather station with extra sensor and fogger arrived yesterday. I ordered some dragon ledges too yesterday before I saw your post, must of been a psychic powers moment on our parts. Lol jk. I ordered the MistKing Nozzles and corner mounts as they will work with my tubing and Aquazamp pump. One question, I see from your pic of your enclosure you have the nozzles mounted in opposite corners. Is that better or could I mount them on the same side corners? like the frontside upper corners aiming to the back upper corners criss crossing pattern? Bee Pollen and LoD on its way. I will order a large schefflera and one or two golden pothos heart leaf philodendron as you have suggested. Where might I find plants like these? Online? Home Depot or Lowes? Last question, thank you for putting up with me, hehe. What is your cleaning method for cage clean? What do you clean? and How often?

Thank you so much @KRGEE21


Andrew

 

[andrewdurant]

That's awesome. You'll see a huge difference when you get them set up.

You can get the powdered bee pollen on Amazon, and yes the repashy LoD. Lightly once a week.

As far the vines/ plants go I would suggest a couple more live plants like a golden pothos, or heart leaf philodendron, and get a larger ficus or schefflera as a main central plant. Use the vines and branches you have to build around it. You want the bottom 2/3 of the enclosure to be pretty dense, and the top a little more open.

Dragonstrand.com

Order some dragon ledges. Soooooo much easier to hang plants and attach branches further up the cage. My enclosure attached.

Sorry forgot to attach the quote. I don't have a lot of forum experience. I found the plants on Amazon though, ordering now.

 

[KRGEE21]

So over the weekend I ordered some more fake vines, and vine plants, and also 2 more of the Ficus you see. I also ordered two 13 watt Jungle Dawn and a fixture for them, they are not the straight up and down mount like you have. I couldn't find those on amazon but they mount to the fixture horizontally and shoot the light down at a right angle. Are these strong enough, 13 watt? I bought an exo terra fixture to house them. One nice thing about these ones is you can rotate them 340 degrees in the fixture to aim them in the right place. I also ordered 4 30" sandblasted manzanita, the arcadia quad 24" with one plant, one 6% UVB and two daylilght bulbs. Should I mount the lights above the corner with the elevated mounting brackets they come with or rest on top of screen cage? Magnets and a shower curtain have been ordered as Janet suggested. River rock for covering plant soil arrived today along with weather station with extra sensor and fogger arrived yesterday. I ordered some dragon ledges too yesterday before I saw your post, must of been a psychic powers moment on our parts. Lol jk. I ordered the MistKing Nozzles and corner mounts as they will work with my tubing and Aquazamp pump. One question, I see from your pic of your enclosure you have the nozzles mounted in opposite corners. Is that better or could I mount them on the same side corners? like the frontside upper corners aiming to the back upper corners criss crossing pattern? Bee Pollen and LoD on its way. I will order a large schefflera and one or two golden pothos heart leaf philodendron as you have suggested. Where might I find plants like these? Online? Home Depot or Lowes? Last question, thank you for putting up with me, hehe. What is your cleaning method for cage clean? What do you clean? and How often?

Thank you so much @KRGEE21


Andrew

Dude, you are a rock star. See way too many people asking for advice, and then either ignoring it or doing a half way job of following it. Nice work!

1. The JD's: As long as they are pointed down at the cage in some way. They don't put out much heat, so suspended above the top, or sitting directly on it are both options. I would get your plants set where you want them, and put the JD's where you need the most light. Honestly 1 one them might be enough for the 24"x24" you'll just have to play around with them a bit to see what works best.
2. MK nozzles: With the 24x24 you could put them at any corner. Swivel/move pretty much every angle so you'll get coverage.
3. Cleaning: Mine is bio active, so aside from knocking the occasional poo off leaves no cleaning necessary. When I had a bare bottom cage I would go in once a week, and clean up with paper towels. Then use a VERY diluted vinegar/water solution to rinse off. Lots of ways to do this.

Sorry forgot to attach the quote. I don't have a lot of forum experience. I found the plants on Amazon though, ordering now.

You are not alone. This is my first social media experience. Never got into the whole facebook/twitter thing.

 

[andrewdurant]

Dude, you are a rock star. See way too many people asking for advice, and then either ignoring it or doing a half way job of following it. Nice work!

1. The JD's: As long as they are pointed down at the cage in some way. They don't put out much heat, so suspended above the top, or sitting directly on it are both options. I would get your plants set where you want them, and put the JD's where you need the most light. Honestly 1 one them might be enough for the 24"x24" you'll just have to play around with them a bit to see what works best.
2. MK nozzles: With the 24x24 you could put them at any corner. Swivel/move pretty much every angle so you'll get coverage.
3. Cleaning: Mine is bio active, so aside from knocking the occasional poo off leaves no cleaning necessary. When I had a bare bottom cage I would go in once a week, and clean up with paper towels. Then use a VERY diluted vinegar/water solution to rinse off. Lots of ways to do this.



You are not alone. This is my first social media experience. Never got into the whole facebook/twitter thing.

Thank you for the compliment! Makes me feel like I'm doing it right. I owe it all to you and Janet though. I'll let you know the progress over the next couple of days. Everything I ordered will be here by Friday. You are the manager of a Rock Star! Haha.

 

[KRGEE21]

Looking forward to seeing the progress.

 

[Rst_Cham]

What a beautiful species! Good for you for getting everything setup first. I'll admit I'm jealous; I would love one of these guys so much. Enjoy!

 

[andrewdurant]

@KRGEE21
Quick question. I noticed that MistKing also offers a dual nozzle mister. Would it be over kill to use 2 of these dual nozzle misters for a total of 4 misters? I was thinking I could aim 2 towards the top part of cage and 2 towards the middle. I plan on returning the ones I'm not going to use. Just a thought.

 

[KRGEE21]

@KRGEE21
Quick question. I noticed that MistKing also offers a dual nozzle mister. Would it be over kill to use 2 of these dual nozzle misters for a total of 4 misters? I was thinking I could aim 2 towards the top part of cage and 2 towards the middle. I plan on returning the ones I'm not going to use. Just a thought.

I think you'll be fine with just the two singles. You're going to want a couple areas where he can get out of the mist if he feels like it.
I have 3 singles running in mine and it is about 22"×44"x44". Seems to be plenty of coverage. Have you decided on quad-quad, or quad-gracilior yet?

http://reptile-database.reptarium.cz/species?genus=Trioceros&species=quadricornis

https://www.iucnredlist.org/species/172571/1345774

 

[andrewdurant]

I think you'll be fine with just the two singles. You're going to want a couple areas where he can get out of the mist if he feels like it.
I have 3 singles running in mine and it is about 22"×44"x44". Seems to be plenty of coverage. Have you decided on quad-quad, or quad-gracilior yet?

http://reptile-database.reptarium.cz/species?genus=Trioceros&species=quadricornis

https://www.iucnredlist.org/species/172571/1345774

Yes that is what I thought after I purchased the dual misters which haven't arrived yet so I can send them back for a big refund as they were expensive. I also figured he would want to be able to get out of the mist if he wanted. So thank you for advising me. I have decided on a Gracilior born in December with blue coloring. Pretty excited to say the least. I just paid for him a few minutes ago and should expect him within approximately 2 weeks so plenty of time to dial everything in so long as I am diligent in my efforts. You have a very nice enclosure. I am very curious about the bio active. I used to have saltwater aquarium tanks with sumps containing nothing but live rock so I am familiar with the idea. I saw your tutorial/construction of your setup on another thread and it looks like you have quite the awesome setup indeed. You really do know what you are doing and I'm envious. Have a great day my friend!

Andrew

 

[KRGEE21]

Yes that is what I thought after I purchased the dual misters which haven't arrived yet so I can send them back for a big refund as they were expensive. I also figured he would want to be able to get out of the mist if he wanted. So thank you for advising me. I have decided on a Gracilior born in December with blue coloring. Pretty excited to say the least. I just paid for him a few minutes ago and should expect him within approximately 2 weeks so plenty of time to dial everything in so long as I am diligent in my efforts. You have a very nice enclosure. I am very curious about the bio active. I used to have saltwater aquarium tanks with sumps containing nothing but live rock so I am familiar with the idea. I saw your tutorial/construction of your setup on another thread and it looks like you have quite the awesome setup indeed. You really do know what you are doing and I'm envious. Have a great day my friend!

Andrew

Thank you for the compliments. I like to I have a decent handle on how to keep this species, but still consider myself a novice overall. There's always more to learn and new things to try.
I have been doing bio active for less than a year. Started with two smaller set ups for my carpet chams, and loved it, so decided to convert the big guys cage. Now I am hooked and will never set up another enclosure without it. Got some really good advice here, and there's plenty of posts for research purposes.
Here if you need me for any questions, and please post pics of your set up process/more importantly of the new guy when he arrives.

Have a great day

Kevin

 

[ldarmo]

I think you will be very glad to have bought from a reputable breeder.

 

[andrewdurant]

Thank you for the compliments. I like to I have a decent handle on how to keep this species, but still consider myself a novice overall. There's always more to learn and new things to try.
I have been doing bio active for less than a year. Started with two smaller set ups for my carpet chams, and loved it, so decided to convert the big guys cage. Now I am hooked and will never set up another enclosure without it. Got some really good advice here, and there's plenty of posts for research purposes.
Here if you need me for any questions, and please post pics of your set up process/more importantly of the new guy when he arrives.

Have a great day

Kevin

@KRGEE21
Kevin,
So I have it all set up and have been monitoring it the last few days. Getting good results. I will post pics soon. What is the highest temp I should get in the middle of the day when I am letting the little guy dry out with no mist for a while and lights still on? RIght now I am getting like 80.4 at basking site. I thought I read somewhere mid 80's is tolerable but no higher. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I am fogging in the morning and evening as I converted a cool mist humidifier to a fogger. It is really beneficial to the humidity, ie morning and evening dew they would experience in the wild. If my temp is too high I have some small fans I could put under the T5 to lower the temp. Also, how many inches away from the UVB bulb should the basking site be for optimal exposure? Thanks again for all your help.

 

[KRGEE21]

@KRGEE21
Kevin,
So I have it all set up and have been monitoring it the last few days. Getting good results. I will post pics soon. What is the highest temp I should get in the middle of the day when I am letting the little guy dry out with no mist for a while and lights still on? RIght now I am getting like 80.4 at basking site. I thought I read somewhere mid 80's is tolerable but no higher. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I am fogging in the morning and evening as I converted a cool mist humidifier to a fogger. It is really beneficial to the humidity, ie morning and evening dew they would experience in the wild. If my temp is too high I have some small fans I could put under the T5 to lower the temp. Also, how many inches away from the UVB bulb should the basking site be for optimal exposure? Thanks again for all your help.

I shoot for right around 80 at the warmest part of the cage, and have the branches about 6 inches below the uvb bulb.
Are you using the fogger at the same schedule as the morning and evening misting sessions? How are the humidity %'s morning, mid-day, evening, and over night?

 

[andrewdurant]

I shoot for right around 80 at the warmest part of the cage, and have the branches about 6 inches below the uvb bulb.
Are you using the fogger at the same schedule as the morning and evening misting sessions? How are the humidity %'s morning, mid-day, evening, and over night?

Perfect then I'm right in the game. Yes I use the fogger at the first misting session and last one. It starts right when the misting session begins. I read on here that is how you want it. To coincide with the misting that is, for it to be effective. I am getting morning humidity of right around 75% at basking, 85% at bottom of cage, mid day 50% at basking, 75% at bottom of cage, evening 75% at basking, 85% at bottom of cage, and overnight I will determine tonight. I originally bought the weather station for tracking temps/humidity but opted for a WiFi Govee model as it works with an iphone app and tracks continuouslty so I can see all points in time, especially overnight when I'm sleeping. Just set it up today, so will have a better handle on things in the next 24 hours. Thanks for the speedy reply, you have been extremely helpful.

 

[KRGEE21]

Perfect then I'm right in the game. Yes I use the fogger at the first misting session and last one. It starts right when the misting session begins. I read on here that is how you want it. To coincide with the misting that is, for it to be effective. I am getting morning humidity of right around 75% at basking, 85% at bottom of cage, mid day 50% at basking, 75% at bottom of cage, evening 75% at basking, 85% at bottom of cage, and overnight I will determine tonight. I originally bought the weather station for tracking temps/humidity but opted for a WiFi Govee model as it works with an iphone app and tracks continuouslty so I can see all points in time, especially overnight when I'm sleeping. Just set it up today, so will have a better handle on things in the next 24 hours. Thanks for the speedy reply, you have been extremely helpful.

Welcome. I had to look up that sensor. Pretty cool. I think I might give it a try.
% might be a touch high for daytime, but if the cage is having a chance to dry out between sessions I think you're good. Overnight should be higher, so curious what that number is. Also...r u fogging overnight?

 

[andrewdurant]

Welcome. I had to look up that sensor. Pretty cool. I think I might give it a try.
% might be a touch high for daytime, but if the cage is having a chance to dry out between sessions I think you're good. Overnight should be higher, so curious what that number is. Also...r u fogging overnight?

I actually found a thread on here about fogging which eventually led me to a podcast featuring a guy from the netherlands with extensive fogging experience along with over 2 decades of chameleon experience including breeding and listened to the whole thing to figure it all out.
Below is my schedule

Mist:
7am mist 1.5 minutes
9am mist 1.5 minutes
10am mist 1.5 minutes
7pm mist 1.5 minutes
830pm mist 1.5 minutes

Fog:
7am-11am fog
8pm-11pm fog

Fans:
7am-11am fans
8pm-11pm fans

Lights:
9am-9pm lights on

This is the fogging podcast:
https://www.chameleonbreeder.com/podcast/ep-110-fogging-and-airflow-with-mario-jungmann/

This is the thread which got me started on all this:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blo...s-through-the-fog-without-dispelling-it.2400/

I'm using the same cool mist humidifier as the above thread and it is simply awesome. It is the Taotronics TT-AH002

I paid a mere $33 bucks for mine on Amazon. It is a very good setup with a 3.5 Liter water tank that lasts 2+ days on a high setting for me. I dialed it back now since I didn't need it on full bore and it is lasting 3 days and still going. I simply superglued a plastic fitting to the top of the outlet and then sealed it up with clear silicone and it works like a dream. I'm also using (2) 120 mm AC Infinity fans from Amazon, one pointed into the cage right where the fog enters and another in the opposite corner sucking from the cage and blowing out. The fans have a high, medium, and low speed setting which is nice to dial it in. I only run the fans when the fog is on. I also am using the legs for my lightyourreptiles arcadia light so I can place the outlet fan beneath it.

Here is the link for the fans:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MZ6VNII/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Here is the link for the Govee Temp/Humidity WiFi sensor which I snagged a $10 off coupon on Amazon for it that they are still offering. It comes with 2 sensors and the WiFi Gateway.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07KKGQDQ1/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Let me know what you think.

 

[KRGEE21]

I actually found a thread on here about fogging which eventually led me to a podcast featuring a guy from the netherlands with extensive fogging experience along with over 2 decades of chameleon experience including breeding and listened to the whole thing to figure it all out.
Below is my schedule

Mist:
7am mist 1.5 minutes
9am mist 1.5 minutes
10am mist 1.5 minutes
7pm mist 1.5 minutes
830pm mist 1.5 minutes

Fog:
7am-11am fog
8pm-11pm fog

Fans:
7am-11am fans
8pm-11pm fans

Lights:
9am-9pm lights on

This is the fogging podcast:
https://www.chameleonbreeder.com/podcast/ep-110-fogging-and-airflow-with-mario-jungmann/

This is the thread which got me started on all this:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blo...s-through-the-fog-without-dispelling-it.2400/

I'm using the same cool mist humidifier as the above thread and it is simply awesome. It is the Taotronics TT-AH002

I paid a mere $33 bucks for mine on Amazon. It is a very good setup with a 3.5 Liter water tank that lasts 2+ days on a high setting for me. I dialed it back now since I didn't need it on full bore and it is lasting 3 days and still going. I simply superglued a plastic fitting to the top of the outlet and then sealed it up with clear silicone and it works like a dream. I'm also using (2) 120 mm AC Infinity fans from Amazon, one pointed into the cage right where the fog enters and another in the opposite corner sucking from the cage and blowing out. The fans have a high, medium, and low speed setting which is nice to dial it in. I only run the fans when the fog is on. I also am using the legs for my lightyourreptiles arcadia light so I can place the outlet fan beneath it.

Here is the link for the fans:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01MZ6VNII/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Here is the link for the Govee Temp/Humidity WiFi sensor which I snagged a $10 off coupon on Amazon for it that they are still offering. It comes with 2 sensors and the WiFi Gateway.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07KKGQDQ1/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Let me know what you think.

Great podcast I had not listened to that one yet. set up certainly seems like it's going to work really well for you. Thanks for the links. . I am gonna order one of the govee systems.
Post a couple photos when you get time. I am curious how the fogger /fan set up looks in action.

 

[andrewdurant]

Great podcast I had not listened to that one yet. set up certainly seems like it's going to work really well for you. Thanks for the links. . I am gonna order one of the govee systems.
Post a couple photos when you get time. I am curious how the fogger /fan set up looks in action.

I think you'll be happy with the Govee. I am still trying to fully figure out the potential of the app, I believe you can set temp/humidity alarms but haven't figured that part out yet. It's really helpful, especially the graphs you can view for temp/humidity over the range you want to view. I will take photos of the entire setup most especially the fans/fogger tonight once it comes on.

 

[andrewdurant]

@KRGEE21
Here are some pics. I originally bought the dual 80mm fans then switched to the 120mm dual now back to the 80mm dual. The 120 was overkill so sending it back with some other stuff.

 

[andrewdurant]

Great podcast I had not listened to that one yet. set up certainly seems like it's going to work really well for you. Thanks for the links. . I am gonna order one of the govee systems.
Post a couple photos when you get time. I am curious how the fogger /fan set up looks in action.

So, one thing to note on the Govee is that you have to be sure where the sensor read spot (the holes on bottom front and bottom don't get any water in them otherwise you will get fault readings on the app. It is rather sensitive to that. Just wanted to let you know. Proper placement solves these issues.