And dont think i am going into this blindly. I do realize that Calumma boettgeri is something i would have more success with but either way both species are on my list of future species to work with. So i want to way all options first and get first hand experiences from people who have worked with them or have worked with them previously.
Furcifer campani
- Thread starter Etunes
- Start date
jpowell86
Chameleon Enthusiast
Awww, Calumma boettgeri is an awesome species!! I'm a little jealous that you have some available to you.
No need to justify yourself, I completely understand your dilemma and think it is great that you are being so discerning in how you are going about your decision. I personally cannot offer any great information out of personal experience with F. campani, but I do wish you luck with whatever you decide to do!
No need to justify yourself, I completely understand your dilemma and think it is great that you are being so discerning in how you are going about your decision. I personally cannot offer any great information out of personal experience with F. campani, but I do wish you luck with whatever you decide to do!
Motherlode Chameleon
Chameleon Enthusiast
The reports I have heard and the readings I have done the problems with Furcifer campani is that for the most part state there is difficulty locating food sources small enough for the neonates to eat. Other than that Furcifer campani babies are apparently just delicate until they are become juveniles.
Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich
Are fruitflies, pinheads, etc. too big for there babies? That seems like a small issue to be honest. There has to be more too it then that. I wonder if there would be more success putting them in a outside environment thats tropical such as FL? Just a thought.
JGuinan007
Avid Member
I would go with jeweled Carpets over blues nose
Motherlode Chameleon
Chameleon Enthusiast
You should research the topic some more. PM with Kevin and Nick if they want to converse. That is the report that neonates can not eat most of the small foods on the market (pinhead crickets and fruit flies). Spring tails is what I hear most people use for the babies. Good Luck.
Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich
NHenn
Avid Member
Jeremy,
Your statements are completely incorrect and I would love if you didn't speak for the breeders currently working with Furcifer campani as to my knowledge you have never worked with this species or had any "somewhat accomplished" results. Speaking on our behalf is just spreading misinformation and hurting others looking to work with his species. If you are going to post facts and not opinion as you are then I would highly suggest you speak with someone who actually has these facts then just making them up as you go based off your own assumptions.
I would love if you could show me all these regular hatchings of F. campani? When I first hatched them here in the US I was followed by Sam, Kevin and I believe one other breeder all of which passed within a week or so besides my female. Later, I hatch a brother and sister and raised both to breeding age along with Kevin hatching another female that now is the only remaining CB female in the US. I do not know of any other babies being born here in the US or in Europe during that time. So calling them regular couldn't be further from the truth.
As for the only problem being the raising of babies, again you are mistaken. The problems begin the day the wild caught animals arrive and they continue to develop into more and more issues as you progress with breeding, laying, incubating, hatching, raising babies and then raising mature cb animals. 90% of my clutches are from gravid wc females because breeding in captivity is very difficult and takes months to accomplish. During those months of waiting, most of if not all the females suddenly pass and you are left with no breeding, no clutches, no babies. If you are so fortunate to have successful breeding then you are left with the issues of laying as I have yet to have a female dig to lay her eggs and I have spent countless hours attempting different means in order to provide them the environment they need to trigger digging and laying. Prolapse during the laying process is another challenge and is what took the life of my cb female after her first clutch along with quite a few wc females. These are all major problems with this species and we haven't even spoken about the fertility rate of the eggs, the incubation process, the hatching process and the difficult task to raise weak babies that refuse to eat most of our standard feeders in the industry.
So if you want to say that "However breeding these species is being done (breeding, laying and hatching)", I would like to know who is doing this because if anyone would even be coming close it would be myself and I'm no where close to confirming that statement.
Dooley1
Avid Member
Everything Nick said above is true. I only hatched 3 total so far, and it was the 3rd individual that I have now. The other two did not survive beyond a few weeks. I have had a WC dig and lay eggs in a nest though. This did not happen with my CB female, who dropped the eggs. The babies can eat standard food...but the babies are incredibly tiny and delicate. People act as though baby pygmy (R. brevicaudatus) or lateralis are small, but they are not at all small when compared to a newly hatched F. campani. I raised this individual solely on crickets and have never fed it anything else. Nick and Amanda used aphids. Females have a VERY short window of receptivity to males in between laying, and if you miss it then you will likely end up with infertile eggs.
Dooley1
Avid Member
Something to add that I think helped with this last baby was downsizing its environment dramatically. I placed it in an 8" Exo Terra cube terrarium, and kept it very basic. It had a paper towel bottom and only enough silk plants to keep it within an inch of the ground level and always close to food. No supplemental heating was used other than T5HO UVB and 6500K linear bulbs over the terrarium. After it got some size it was the same as lateralis going forward. If we could hatch a significant amount of F. campani and start from there we may have a better chance at getting them going.
Motherlode Chameleon
Chameleon Enthusiast
Nick you and a couple other just wish I did not speak. That is not going to happen.
There are some others that have hatched them Furcifer campani around the 2012-2014 time period. I have this note written down however it is not in my regular chameleon note book. Some off the top of my head of other keepers to hatch eggs were Vegas Chad, Jim Flaherty and I think Masked Gecko. When I locate my notebook with my note I can post who the produced eggs and hatchlings.
Other than that Nick and Kevin posted good issues. I have talked about this species well before the new quotas. Mario Vermunt gave me permission to state his issues however he has progressed a bit further when he was breeding this species, he was at the point where his main problem was coxing captive bred males to mate with females. This conversation was from before the 2012 Furcifer campani quotas. Whether you can handle talking about Furcifer campani or not good luck with your breeding programs Nick and Kevin and other Furcifer campani keepers.
Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich
There are some others that have hatched them Furcifer campani around the 2012-2014 time period. I have this note written down however it is not in my regular chameleon note book. Some off the top of my head of other keepers to hatch eggs were Vegas Chad, Jim Flaherty and I think Masked Gecko. When I locate my notebook with my note I can post who the produced eggs and hatchlings.
Other than that Nick and Kevin posted good issues. I have talked about this species well before the new quotas. Mario Vermunt gave me permission to state his issues however he has progressed a bit further when he was breeding this species, he was at the point where his main problem was coxing captive bred males to mate with females. This conversation was from before the 2012 Furcifer campani quotas. Whether you can handle talking about Furcifer campani or not good luck with your breeding programs Nick and Kevin and other Furcifer campani keepers.
Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich
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JGuinan007
Avid Member
Hey here is a discussion from back in 2009 about a guy that breeds a group in his back yard oh and it's guest starring Chris Anderson https://www.chameleonforums.com/threads/furcifer-campani.28142/
NHenn
Avid Member
Jeremy, I don't mind at all that you post/speak about them but please don't give information that isn't factual. It leads others to believe in this information as there isn't much else out there on campani. They then go and spend $250 plus for each animal to later find out oh difficult they are and the animals die within a few short months. That isn't good for the keeper, the chameleons, or the community. I'm not saying that you haven't spoken to people like Mario as I have too and actually got his information from you. I don't disagree with these findings or that raising babies is a major problem but you are making the species out to be much easier than they really are and I don't want to see other keepers jumping into this species just to be let down like so many have in the past 3-4 years.
You are correct with Jim as I know he hatched 2-3 eggs that a wc female dropped from the import but again they didn't survive and he quickly sold all the animals after as he knows how difficult they are and if he was to keep them they would most likely just die on him too. That situation only shows the difficulty of raising the babies as he never had to keep and breed the adults, but those problems still exist so they can't be swept under the rug. Vegas Chad might have but I'm not positive and Masked Gecko didn't hatch any, not sure if he even had eggs. These were all from the first imports though so I haven't seen anything since that point from anyone. Dec - Jan 2014 where all of us hatched some was the first and pretty much last of what we have seen hatch here in the US.
When you have a chance post what you have in your book as I would love to have a record of everyone who hatched them.
JGuinan007
Avid Member
What about Gaylord and his campani?
Motherlode Chameleon
Chameleon Enthusiast
Somewhat accomplished results (does not mean easy) then a conversation about the difficulties and the positives is not factual enough?
I am done debating about this for now. I think breeders who are in it for the long haul with this species in North America are eventually going to establish their breeding colonies with or without difficulties.
I wrote a blog on this site warning keepers about how difficult the new Madagascar (2014) quota species are to breed. This was well know knowledge from before the 1995 ban.
Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich
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