Gravid female question.

[Rwbjj]

Hi,

I’m a new Cham owner having bought a 6 month old female a few months ago. She shed shortly after we got her and has generally mooched around in the branches of her enclosure and feeds really well.

A few weeks ago, I started observing her coming out of the branches and onto the ground of her enclosure and having done research before buying her, I surmised that she might be gravid and provided her with an egg laying bin in the form of a large bucket in the bottom of her enclosure.

This was filled with a topsoil/peat mix, which was damp enough and capable of sustaining a tunnel. The bucket depth is about 12” and about 9” in diameter and she can get in and out of it with ease. She has been in the bucket but I haven’t seen her digging although i have seen her with dirty paws.

As I hadn’t seen her dig a hole, I bought some washed play sand yesterday with the intention to replace the topsoil/peat as research suggested that it would be a better option. When I went to swap it over this morning, I noticed a single small egg in the branches of her enclosure which had appeared overnight. I swapped in the sand this morning but she hasn’t shown much interest in it.

She is generally acting normally and has eaten today. She is slightly grey in colour as she is about to shed. I’ve covered the cage to give her some more privacy.

Anything else I should consider doing?

(Obviously, if she starts losing interest in food or behaving abnormally, I’ll take her to a vet)



Cheers,

Ben.

The pic is a month old, I don’t have a more recent one to hand and I’m not disturbing her until morning.

Cham details:

Female Veiled Cham
Age: 8 months
Owned: 2 months
Handling: Handled a couple of times/week. Encourage her to climb onto my hand with a cricket.
Feeding: generally a couple of small crickets or similar (roaches/hoppers etc), dusted in calcium and vitamin supplement.
Watering: misted 2-3 times a day.
Fecal Description: normal (based on the forums poo guide!)
Urates: normal
Enclosure - eco terra tall, 45x60x90cm
Lighting: UVB
Heat source: heat lamp
Temp: regulated. Minimum set to 20 deg c overnight, Max 35 deg c during the day (8am-8pm)
Humidity - 60+
Location: UK.

 

[The Wild One]

um I haven't experienced this (yet) but i believe your doing most of it right!

 

[Brodybreaux25]

If she’s dropping eggs she’s in trouble. I know you kind of answered the help form but to help you we need detailed responses. Specifically in the supplements, gutload, lighting sections.

Please fill out the “how to ask for help” form and post your answers back here. Quality pictures will help us help you.

Chameleon Info:

◦ Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?

◦ Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?

◦ Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?

◦ Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?

◦ Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?

◦ Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?

◦ History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.



Cage Info:

◦ Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?

◦ Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?

◦ Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?

◦ Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?

◦ Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?

◦ Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?

◦ Location - Where are you geographically located?



Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.



--------------



Please Note:

1 The more details you provide the better and more accurate help you will receive.

2 Photos can be very helpful.

 

[kinyonga]

How often do you feed her?
Do he supplements have phosphorous, calcium, D3, vitamin A in? What form of vitamin A ...beta carotene or a preformed source?
How big/deep is the laying container?

 

[Rwbjj]

In answer to the various questions, I think this fills the blanks.

I’ve also included a pic of the enclosure, heating/lighting arrangement and one of her taken a few minutes ago. I don’t normally feed her till lunchtime but I offered her a small cricket to coax her from the top corner where she sleeps and she raced down to get it allowing me to get a good pic.
There are some marks in the laybin this morning but no holes, although, she could have backfilled and covered it up.

Thanks,
Ben

◦ Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?

Female Veiled Cham
Age: 8 months
Owned: 2 months

◦ Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?

Handled a couple of times/week. I encourage her to climb onto my hand with a cricket, handle her for a few minutes and pop her back in.

◦ Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?

Generally a couple of small crickets or similar (roaches/hoppers etc) daily. dusted in calcium and vitamin supplement containing:

Per g
200mg calcium
150OIU D3
+ vitamins A E K B1 B2 B6 C Folic Nictonic & panthotgeric acids biotin choline niacin and minerals Na Fe Co I Mn Zn Se Cu

◦ Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?

As above. I dunk the feeder in the supplement before offering it to her.
◦ Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?

Long (1-2mins) misting 2-3 times a day.

Occasionally see her drinking. Eyes are not sunken and Urates are white.
In the process of adding a dripper.

◦ Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
Dark brown/black. Firm/soft non runny.
White Urates.
◦ History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

None.


Cage Info:

◦ Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?

Exo terra tall, 45x60x90cm. Glass sided, mesh top.

Pic attached.

◦ Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?

UVB
22” Reptisun 10.0 UVB
F24T5 Rept
12 hours on. 7am-7pm.

Lifetime usage to date approx: 720hrs (2 months @12hrs/day)
◦ Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
Heating set at:

Minimum 20 deg C (naturally falls to around 22 deg C overnight)
Maximum: 35 degrees C. Measured at the top 20cm under the heat source.
Accurite at the bottom of the enclosure, 21-25 degrees C

◦ Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
Electronic measure towards the top of the enclosure reads around 60%

Digital stand alone temp/humidity accurite at the bottom reads 75-90%
Misting 2-3 times/day.
◦ Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?

Nope.
◦ Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?

Laying Bin:
Big bucket.
Swapped from topsoil/peat to washed plays sand. Damp enough to easily form tunnels.
Depth 12”
Diameter 9”
Easy to get in and out of.

Corner of the “dining” room. Located on a unit 1.3m above the ground. We don’t use that room for eating. Other animals in that area (not visible to her): ball python, corn snake, leopard gecko, Asian forest scorpion and an axolotl.
No fans/vents.
Limited traffic area.

◦ Location - Where are you geographically located?

Uk

 

[Rwbjj]

Any more thoughts anyone?

 

[Brodybreaux25]

If she’s dropping eggs she needs to go to the vet. She needs to be examined by a experienced exotic vet.

 

[Brodybreaux25]

Please post a photo of the supplements your using, think your overdosing on D3.

You need to switch to a 5.0 uvb, 10.0 is too much.
Your bin is plenty deep enough but much more narrow than I’d like to see. Shoot for 10-12” wide, 8” deep. Play-sand is good.

She will not lay in that viv as is because she feels completely exposed, that’s why she’s full term but still fighting to retrain her eggs and failing. You need to wrap at least the bottom half of her viv so she can not see any one or anything.

However none of the husbandry fixes I just mentioned will fix her, only a vet can save her at this point.

Vet first.
Husbandry fixes second.

 

[Rwbjj]

If she’s dropping eggs she needs to go to the vet. She needs to be examined by a experienced exotic vet.

Thanks for the replies. Much appreciated.

Couple of additional questions (as it’s midnight here)

Does she look gravid to you in the images taken this morning?

What about the comment re: marks in the lay bin? How well do they cover tunnels up?
The enclosure was completely covered with towels for about 20 hours from 10am sunday to 7am Monday. (Normal lighting cycle)

Btw The bin diameter is 12” (I estimated it in my previous email as the enclosure was covered and I didn’t want to disturb her)

Could she have laid them and covered?
Is there a good way to tell without disturbing her and emptying the whole thing?

What about the substrate she is on? Would a small Cham possibly lay in 5 inches of substrate? (It would kind of support a tunnel) ~ I’ll probably remove the substrate soon as I was advised to have it to help with humidity but have since read that it can harbour bacteria - I concentrated on getting the sand bucket in with minimum of fuss without and didn’t dig around in all of the substrate looking for eggs. It’s a coconut husk type substrate that came in a brick which needed water adding ~ I don’t have the packaging to elaborate. What substrate would you recommend?

I was under the impression that Chams went off food when they’re about to lay?

She practically runs to me when I offer her food, swiftly climbing through the enclosure and if coaxed, straight up my arm. She hasn’t ever gone off her food.
I was under the impression that Chams got lethargic when they were about to lay?
She certainly isn’t lethargic and has always been very active during feeding.

I’ll happily make an appointment with the vet but the way she is acting doesn’t fit in with what I was expecting based on research, which is why I am questioning if she has already laid them somewhere.

Thanks again,
Ben

Just seen your second reply.
Quick question ~ Why 5.0 vs 10.0uvb?
The lighting guide in the resources section on this site suggest either and I was advised on a 10.0 for the size of enclosure.

Sorry to bombard with questions and appreciate the advice.