Handling Question: Jumping / Running / Falling Issues

artgecko

artgecko

Member
Hi guys,

Last week, I setup the outdoor screen cage for my veiled chameleon so that he can get some sun. This, unfortunately, means that I have to move him between cages. I have attempted this twice and on both occasions he totally freaks out and will deliberately run / jump / fall off the stick or my hand, etc. This often results in several minutes of me chasing him around the cage and then him attempting to fall / jump off my hands or the stick I'm using once out of the cage. Once he has been on my hands or the stick for a minute or so and can't reach anything, he settles down and will walk from hand to hand as I do with my geckos. However, before that point, he will hit the ground at least 1-2 times while attempting to escape. His jumping is very erratic and fast, so he is hard to block / catch.

I have tried to move him as gently as possible and do not grab him from above (I move the stick or hands below him and use a hand to "herd" him towards it) but his response has been the same going to and coming back from his outdoor enclosure each time. At this point, I'm wondering if the stress of moving him overshadows the benefit of natural UV...

I have 3 questions for you guys which I hope you can answer.
1. Will he eventually learn to not be fearful of me moving him if I continue as-is?
2. Is there a better way to move him so that he does not fall / jump constantly and get hurt?
3. If he was to hurt himself falling to the ground, what would be a sign of this to watch for?

Thank you for your time and help!
 
Let him come to the stick more on his own terms. It seems like he is scared of you and thinks you are a predator. Give him time, look up techniques for taming a cham.
 
Nursemaia said:
Why can't you leave him out 24/7. I have summer condos set up so I don't have to bring them in and out daily
Click to expand...
I wish that I could, but I live in GA and we get temps in the mid-high 90's... So I am afraid to leave him out in it all the time, I've been leaving him out for 2-4 hours during the day and checking his water supply (a simple dripper) every 45 minutes or so. Also, his outdoor setup is only a large reptibreeze on a tv table...So I am not 100% sure it would be sturdy enough to survive an attack.. We do have neighbors that let their cats free-roam the neighborhood, so it makes me uneasy.

etclement- He is afraid of me... I have tried hand-feeding, etc. but he hides as soon as he sees me looking at him and that was before I started taking him out. If I wait on him to "come around" it will probably be a year or more. I wish that I could get him to just climb onto the stick, but again, as soon as he sees me, he starts going down to hide in the plants where I can't maneuver the stick. He seems to calm down once he is on my hands or the stick for a while (and can't find anything to jump to to get away). I just wish this could be easier lol.
 
If he is afraid of you, don't go sticking a stick in his cage. It will only make things worse, trust me, I made that mistake. Let the cham come to you. Try hand feeding and everything. If you really want him out of the cage into the sun, try stringing a vine outside of his cage onto a plant so he climbs outside the cage onto the plant. Then let him come onto the plant, pick up the plant, then take him outside. It will be worth it in the long run. Like a lot of animals, chams will seem to calm down when they are very scared. Just let him trust you, its not worth it in the long run to keep taking him out of the cage like that. Hope this helps.
 
One lesson I learned from handling Chameleons (any animal, for that matter): You aren't as strong as they are. Hold him with 2 hands cupped over and under like a firefly if he is acting crazy. You will feel him bump your hand like he's dying, but, rest assured, he is fine. Animals are tough and sturdy. We are bigger and smarter. . .most of us. . .but they heal faster, fall harder, and can take a beating like we will never be able to. You aren't gonna hurt him unless you really tried; and if you are deliberately trying not to, you won't.

Chameleons are surprisingly fragile, yes, but they are surprisingly sturdy, too.

Don't be afraid of him. You care, you ask advice, so I know you won't hurt him. My baby panther jumped out of my hands onto our floor (just some carpet over a concrete slab with no padding) and made a run for it just fine. I tried what I call the "firefly" method and he now knows he can't run, so he quit altogether. He still makes a run at first, but once he's in my hand, he just walks around.

Good luck!

P.S. I agree with you about leaving him out 24/7. Our neighbor has free-range cats, too, and I won't do it, no matter what kind of cage I had.
 
etclement said:
If he is afraid of you, don't go sticking a stick in his cage. It will only make things worse, trust me, I made that mistake. Let the cham come to you. Try hand feeding and everything. If you really want him out of the cage into the sun, try stringing a vine outside of his cage onto a plant so he climbs outside the cage onto the plant. Then let him come onto the plant, pick up the plant, then take him outside. It will be worth it in the long run. Like a lot of animals, chams will seem to calm down when they are very scared. Just let him trust you, its not worth it in the long run to keep taking him out of the cage like that. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

You should try this! I is an excellent idea! I have a fake tree, and I often just set it beside Gary's cage with 1 branch in near him. He climbs out on his own. When your guy does it, just transfer him that way. Leave the room, grab some coffee or something, come back, he'll be in there. Gary never takes too long to climb on in. At night, it would be a good idea to let him hang out in the tree or something while you watch TV or just hang out. They are creeps anyway, they love to watch everything you do. It will make him less scared of you.
 
GregJD said:
You should try this! I is an excellent idea! I have a fake tree, and I often just set it beside Gary's cage with 1 branch in near him. He climbs out on his own. When your guy does it, just transfer him that way. Leave the room, grab some coffee or something, come back, he'll be in there. Gary never takes too long to climb on in. At night, it would be a good idea to let him hang out in the tree or something while you watch TV or just hang out. They are creeps anyway, they love to watch everything you do. It will make him less scared of you.
Click to expand...
Yes I have a ficus alli that I used to get Clay out of his cage. It works great and he loves it.
 
Thanks for the advice guys. I will have to look for a suitable plant to try that method...I don't have any "trees" only short bush-like plants which are not tall enough to access from his cage.

I have tried hand-feeding, but he runs and hides whenever he sees me, so that is not working out very well. I have gotten him to eat out of a cup on 4 occasions, but only when I block his view of me and my hands with the cup.
 
Hey Art,

I don't think using a tree is the right way to go. I've been where you're at and I've tried the tree-transfer method. If your guy is as quick as you say and not afraid to take a leap to freedom, he's going to do so while you're standing there with a tree in your hands. If he jumps when you're outside, that could be a big problem.

I also agree with not sticking a stick in there. Or using gloves. You want to to be able to transfer him safely and calmly by hand, he's got to start feeling safe in your hands. Anything else you poke or come at him with is likely to be scarier than your bare fingers.

How long have you had him and how often do you hold him? And when you do go in there to get him, do you feel scared, nervous or jumpy?
 
Last edited:
artgecko said:
Thanks for the advice guys. I will have to look for a suitable plant to try that method...I don't have any "trees" only short bush-like plants which are not tall enough to access from his cage.

I have tried hand-feeding, but he runs and hides whenever he sees me, so that is not working out very well. I have gotten him to eat out of a cup on 4 occasions, but only when I block his view of me and my hands with the cup.
Click to expand...


perryny said:
Hey Art,

I don't think using a tree is the right way to go. I've been where you're at and I've tried the tree-transfer method. If your guy is as quick as you say and not afraid to take a leap to freedom, he's going to do so while you're standing there with a tree in your hands. If he jumps when your outside, that could be a big problem.

I also agree with not sticking a stick in there. Or using gloves. You want to to be able to transfer him safely and calmly by hand, he's got to start feeling safe in your hands. Anything else you poke or come at him with is likely to be scarier than your bare fingers.

How long have you had him and how often do you hold him? And when you do go in there to get him, do you feel scared, nervous or jumpy?
Click to expand...

I agree with this post. And if he takes a year he takes a year. Unless he is seriously sick then I wouldn't worry about rushing and would immediately slow down. You are only going to make him more distrustful otherwise. Rushing with chams never ever works.
 
perryny said:
Hey Art,

I don't think using a tree is the right way to go. I've been where you're at and I've tried the tree-transfer method. If your guy is as quick as you say and not afraid to take a leap to freedom, he's going to do so while you're standing there with a tree in your hands. If he jumps when you're outside, that could be a big problem.

I also agree with not sticking a stick in there. Or using gloves. You want to to be able to transfer him safely and calmly by hand, he's got to start feeling safe in your hands. Anything else you poke or come at him with is likely to be scarier than your bare fingers.

How long have you had him and how often do you hold him? And when you do go in there to get him, do you feel scared, nervous or jumpy?
Click to expand...
The tree method only involves a tree outside the cage to make the cham feel safer. Picking them up is something that takes time. I recommend just putting a tree outside and not bothering the cham for now, because as perryny said, it could end the same way.
 
I'm a newer owner for sure, but I live in the country with all sorts of predators that would love to snack on my Cham. I built a cage out of 1/2 inch chicken wire mesh, nailed some 1x1s together and all around it only cost about 30 bucks. He loves it and his feet are old and sturdy enough to not hurt on the wire, so he gets to crawl over it too! As for handling, Yoyo used to /hate/ me. He'd hiss when I walked by his cage, flared out etc whenever he saw me. After awhile I tried feeding him a hornworm, which he instantly loved. The next time I fed him a horn worm I held it in my hand, and he didn't even care, because he loves them. So feed your guy a delicious treat, and then hold your hand still and let him munch it off you.
 
Thanks guys for the input!
Perryny- I am not afraid when handling him in terms of him causing injury to me. I am using a pair of light gardening gloves, so if he does bite, it doesn't hurt. That said, I am nervous of him injuring himself by running/ jumping / falling. I've had him take a dive to the floor once and outside to the grass once as well.

I have had him about 3 weeks now. I had tried leaving him alone with minimal interactions and don't mess with him unless I am taking him to his outside cage. His only other contact with me is me changing his water catchment bowl, putting feeders in his cage, trying to feed him from a cup, etc. He was a little over 5 months old when I got him and the breeder said she had handled him and recommended I keep up with handling so that he did not become cage defensive as an adult. I did not handle him because I wanted to let him settle in before trying it and waited until I had his outdoor setup ready (about 1 week ago).

Andee- It was my understanding that outdoor sunlight / time was very important for these guys. Are you saying that I should not even attempt to take him outdoors until he will transfer unstressed / willingly walk onto my hand, etc.? I do have a UVB bulb and supplements, etc. but thought real sunlight was necessary when possible. At this point, he already runs from me and hid from me before I started this, so I don't know if he will ever not be afraid of me..or at least nervous.

etclement- I am not sure I have the time to set a tree outdoors for him and supervise for a long period of time. I know that these guys can be fast and I'd feel uneasy thinking that he would make a run for it when I happened to look away, etc. I may just end up needing to build a sturdy outdoor enclosure that he can stay in longer periods of time, so that he will be safe and not have to be moved as often.

Orangejuice- Thanks. I have tried hornworms and he does like them, but at best, I've gotten him to take one out of a plastic cup but only when I use the cup to block him seeing me or my hands. I will have to try taking baby steps with this I think.

Overall, I think I am going to take a break with attempting to take him outside. I think you guys are right, and as long as I don't have to worry about him lacking the natural sunlight (supplements / UV bulb) then I think it will be less stressful for both of us. I will have a busy schedule this next couple weeks (having flooring installed and going on vacation) so will not really have time to work with him. I may try again closer to the middle or end of July and see how things go. I am also thinking about getting another pair of gloves to use.. The ones I have now are a peach / orange color and I think that might be freaking him out also...maybe a pair of green or brown ones would be less stressful to him.

This whole experience has been less...easy than I thought it would be. I've seen tutorials on how to handle chameleons, etc. but things just don't seem to work that well in person with these guys if they aren't cooperating lol.
 
You don't have to take the tree outside, what I was saying was put it outside of his cage so he can climb onto it.
 
Only having him for three weeks I think you are moving way too fast for him. He likely needs more time to settle in especially with how he is acting. Leave him alone other than necessities for a couple more weeks. And the sun is great etc. But not necessary to a lot of chams. And he won't show any issues with it at this age while he settles in. Usually if the sun is going to affect him and lack of it, it's going to be months+ of not having it etc. And then you have to look at changing you supplements depending on how much uvb he is getting regularly.
 
artgecko said:
Thanks guys for the input!
Perryny- I am not afraid when handling him in terms of him causing injury to me. I am using a pair of light gardening gloves, so if he does bite, it doesn't hurt. That said, I am nervous of him injuring himself by running/ jumping / falling. I've had him take a dive to the floor once and outside to the grass once as well.

I have had him about 3 weeks now. I had tried leaving him alone with minimal interactions and don't mess with him unless I am taking him to his outside cage. His only other contact with me is me changing his water catchment bowl, putting feeders in his cage, trying to feed him from a cup, etc. He was a little over 5 months old when I got him and the breeder said she had handled him and recommended I keep up with handling so that he did not become cage defensive as an adult. I did not handle him because I wanted to let him settle in before trying it and waited until I had his outdoor setup ready (about 1 week ago).

Andee- It was my understanding that outdoor sunlight / time was very important for these guys. Are you saying that I should not even attempt to take him outdoors until he will transfer unstressed / willingly walk onto my hand, etc.? I do have a UVB bulb and supplements, etc. but thought real sunlight was necessary when possible. At this point, he already runs from me and hid from me before I started this, so I don't know if he will ever not be afraid of me..or at least nervous.

etclement- I am not sure I have the time to set a tree outdoors for him and supervise for a long period of time. I know that these guys can be fast and I'd feel uneasy thinking that he would make a run for it when I happened to look away, etc. I may just end up needing to build a sturdy outdoor enclosure that he can stay in longer periods of time, so that he will be safe and not have to be moved as often.

Orangejuice- Thanks. I have tried hornworms and he does like them, but at best, I've gotten him to take one out of a plastic cup but only when I use the cup to block him seeing me or my hands. I will have to try taking baby steps with this I think.

Overall, I think I am going to take a break with attempting to take him outside. I think you guys are right, and as long as I don't have to worry about him lacking the natural sunlight (supplements / UV bulb) then I think it will be less stressful for both of us. I will have a busy schedule this next couple weeks (having flooring installed and going on vacation) so will not really have time to work with him. I may try again closer to the middle or end of July and see how things go. I am also thinking about getting another pair of gloves to use.. The ones I have now are a peach / orange color and I think that might be freaking him out also...maybe a pair of green or brown ones would be less stressful to him.

This whole experience has been less...easy than I thought it would be. I've seen tutorials on how to handle chameleons, etc. but things just don't seem to work that well in person with these guys if they aren't cooperating lol.
Click to expand...

Hi There, just wanted to give you some encouragement, too. I'm a first time cham mom, and it felt like my little guy was never going to come to me easily, or eat out of my hand. I've had him for 6 months now, since he was 3 months old.

Things I changed that I suspect helped: I reduced my handling (from twice a day initially, which was too much for him, down to leaving him be for a few days between outings), and kept the handling sessions short and sweet. I don't know if this bit had anything to do with the success, but when holding him and he went into the "prayer" position, showing stress, I'd gently offer my finger under his front paws so he'd translate that into climbing (my sister said I was trying to cham whisper him ;)). Then I'd let him go back into his viv. As he grew to trust me more, I'd put my finger in to help him reach something he was stretching for, just to be a boost to him, making no demands. I always moved slow and calm.

As for him feeding out of my hand...that took agonizing weeks to even get him to take from a cup!! Like maybe 6 weeks for the cup, then many more weeks before he would take from my actual fingers. I just continued to offer. First the cup, then after a few weeks from my palm open flat, then finally from my fingers. With the cup, I'd often hold the cup in one hand & the worm in the other to show him the worm, then drop it from a bit of a height so he'd see the worm go into the cup. It seemed he was most receptive to taking these treats from me when he was out in his first "jungle gym" (I'd pieced together that one with dowels & duct taped them to the window & side table). He's only really been open to eating from my hand inside his viv once he moved into his big home.

He's 9 months old now, and for the first time just the other day, chose himself to climb out on my hand. I'd just made a new "jungle gym" out of dowels and and old wooden clothes drying rack that he really likes climbing around on. I placed it in front of his cage with one of the dowels going in, then just gave a bit of watchful distance. and now out he trucks. The other day, he all but jumped onto my hand so I would take him out. He gets really excited now when I set that up, but I think he might be cruising for chicks at this stage!! :rolleyes:
 
The funny thing is it can take a lot of time just to get them to eat from your hand, but that is often the sign of ultimate trust from these guys. Because I think they feel vulnerable during eating. So it is just something that makes me feel warm and fuzzy XD
 
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