Health of my Chameleon / Possible MBD? Not shooting tongue out.

[GinaFrus27]

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - Vailed chameleon, Male, 5 years old. I've had him since he was a baby.
• Handling - Only when cleaning the cage.
• Feeding - Crickets, super worms, wax worms, 5 to 8 of one of the feeders gut loaded daily, I switch up what i feed him between the three main feeders throughout the week. I gut load with lettuce, apples, orange cricket cubes.
• Supplements - Repti - Calcium without D3 daily, Repti- Vitamin once a week.
• Watering - I have a cool mist humidifier running throughout the day, misting by hand 2 to 3 times daily. I mist for about 2 minutes each time. I see him drinking almost always.
• Fecal Description - White urates, stool has been very runny which is a concern. He has never been tested for parasites.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Repti - Breeze screen cage. 2 feet wide by 4 feet tall.
• Lighting - Zoomed 10.0 UVB spot light, Zoomed 5.0 UVB strip light, 100 watt house bulb for basking. Lights are on from 8A.M. to 8P.M. daily.
• Temperature - Basking spot is 90 to 100 degrees. Lowest overnight temp is about 60 degrees, maybe a bit higher. I have a temp gauge near his basking spot.
• Humidity - Humidity ranges from 30 to 60 percent. I have a cool mist humidifier on the cage all day. I also have a shower curtain covering 3 sides of the cage to help maintain the humidity. I also have a gauge to measure humidity as well.
• Plants - I am using two large live plants at the moment. They are both Royal Cane tropical plants.
• Placement - My cage is on the floor in my bedroom. He is normally not bothered and it is quiet. I have a ceiling fan that i only will put on during the summer if it gets to hot in my room. His cage is next to a window also.
• Location - I am in New Jersey

Current Problem - I've noticed that now he is having trouble shooting his tongue out. He used to hunt throughout his cage for crickets and shoot his tongue out, now I have resorted to hand feeding him since I noticed he was having trouble recently. Also I just wanted to see if overall he seems healthy. Thank you all in advance. I've attached photos of him as well for reference.

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[kinyonga]

How often do you change the UVB light bulbs?
Could he have injuries the tongue shooting for an insect?
Does your vitamin powder have D3 in it? Or prEformed vitamin A?
I don't see any obvious signs of MBD.

 

[GinaFrus27]

I have been changing the bulbs once a year. Should I be changing them sooner?
I just realized that his calcium supplement has D3 in it. Is that ok to be giving him daily?
I just looked at his herptivite, and I couldn't find any vitamin A in it.
Honestly I dont think he would have injured his tounge going for an insect, but I'm not sure. Thanks for the reply.

 

[kinyonga]

It depends on the bulb how often you have to change it. I just have to start off asking questions to give me an idea of what's going on...eliminate things that are or aren't likely to be the problem.

The D3 in the calcium could be a problem depending on how much is in there or how heavily you dust...but have you been using the same product for his whole time with you?

My idea for years has been to dust lightly twice a month with a phos free calcium/D3 powder to make sure they get some D3 but not overdose it and let them produce the rest from their exposure to the UVB. I dust at almost every feeding with a phos free calcium powder too and twice a month with a vitamin powder with a beta carotene proformed source of vitamin A.
Preformed vitamin A and D3 from supplements can build up in the system and cause health issues so we need to be careful of them.

You said the stool has been runny...is that something that started at the same time as the tongue issue?

 

[GinaFrus27]

When he was a baby and though the time he was a juvenile I was giving him calcium without D3. I still have some of that actually. Ive been giving the calcium with D3 for awhile now. Would it be better to use the calcium without D3 at every feeding and use the calcium with D3 twice a month?

My vitamin has beta carotene, which I didnt realize was vitamin A so I'm good there. I will also cut back to when I give him the vitamin to only twice a month. I was giving that to him once a week. The tounge issue started a few weeks ago. The runny poop has been that way for the past couple days. It almost has no brown in it. It seems like it's mostly mucus which worries me.

 

[kinyonga]

I would only use D3 twice a month....but don't know if your old powder is still good.

As for the poop...might be a good idea to get a parasite test because it's runny.

 

[Ares05]

@kinyonga has already said all of the main things, but I just wanted to say..

Stop running your fogger during the day. You are going to give your chameleon an RI doing that. You should only run a fogger during the coolest parts of the night. Heat + excessive humidity = RI. Humidity only needs to be around 30-40 during the day, and then it needs to be around 80-100 during the night.

 

[GinaFrus27]

Okay, will do. Thank you.

 

[GinaFrus27]

Sometimes during the day my humidity level goes down to about 20 percent because I have the heat on in my home. Is that still okay, or should I run it a little bit through the day?

 

[Ares05]

What I do is I mist for 4 minutes in the morning, and then 4 minutes in the evening. This keeps my humidity up quite nicely.

I noticed your cage is a little bare. I would add some more live plants, and more branches.

 

[salty dog]

Humidity can be 100% during the day with no problem as long as there is fresh air...FRESH AIR with humidity is not a problem..... I'd turn off fogger during the day, linear uv light is critical to have

 

[Ares05]

Sources @salty dog ?

 

[cyberlocc]

Sources @salty dog ?

Im making a thread on this.

Edit: thread made.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/threads/heat-humidity-ri.173549/

 

[Tinytort]

@kinyonga has already said all of the main things, but I just wanted to say..

Stop running your fogger during the day. You are going to give your chameleon an RI doing that. You should only run a fogger during the coolest parts of the night. Heat + excessive humidity = RI. Humidity only needs to be around 30-40 during the day, and then it needs to be around 80-100 during the night.

It's cold and too much humidity that gives ri.

 

[skoram]

Heat doesn't cause RI
Cold doesn't cause RI
Humidity doesn't cause RI
Lack of humidity doesn't cause RI
Any combination of the above doesn't absolutely cause RI.

Bacteria causes RI

Bacteria multiplies best under warm and moist conditions, but those 2 alone won't cause a bacteria infestation. This is why I think a lot of the recent debate has arisen on these forums about about heat and humidity causing RI.

In fact, very dry conditions makes the lungs of most animals (including humans) more susceptible to contracting respiratory infections. But just the same, regardless of the conditions, if no bacteria is present, infection is impossible.

 

[skoram]

Humidity can be 100% during the day with no problem as long as there is fresh air...FRESH AIR with humidity is not a problem..... I'd turn off fogger during the day, linear uv light is critical to have

I don't know about 100% humidity ... it won't necessarily contribute to an infection but it might cause other issues and make chameleons a bit uncomfortable. With humans and many other animals there is an ideal range, more is not always necessarily better. This is purely conjecture on my part, however. Given these uncertainties that's why so many people advocate replicating natural conditions - at least we know those conditions are "safe."

I totally agree about fresh air/ventilation though. I like to use the analogy of a river vs. a stagnant pond. River water is usually (discounting the effects of human pollution) much cleaner and healthier than water from a stagnant source because bacteria and other toxic substances (ammonia, nitrites, etc.) don't have the chance to build up. In the aquarium hobby we compensate for this by using biological filtration which cultivates strong growth of beneficial aerobic bacteria and subsequently out-compete harmful anaerobic bacteria for resources.

 

[cyberlocc]

I don't know about 100% humidity ... it won't necessarily contribute to an infection but it might cause other issues and make chameleons a bit uncomfortable. With humans and many other animals there is an ideal range, more is not always necessarily better. This is purely conjecture on my part, however. Given these uncertainties that's why so many people advocate replicating natural conditions - at least we know those conditions are "safe."

I totally agree about fresh air/ventilation though. I like to use the analogy of a river vs. a stagnant pond. River water is usually (discounting the effects of human pollution) much cleaner and healthier than water from a stagnant source because bacteria and other toxic substances (ammonia, nitrites, etc.) don't have the chance to build up. In the aquarium hobby we compensate for this by using biological filtration which cultivates strong growth of beneficial aerobic bacteria and subsequently out-compete harmful anaerobic bacteria for resources.

Completely not sure about velieds. Can't say I study them much.

Panthers and Malagasy Montanes, are quite frequently exposed to 80-98% humidity, even during the day, even the really hot days. Hottest time of the year is the wet Season, hottest days are often the most humid.

That even applies to areas that are more outskirts of Rainforest, or coastal areas like Ambilobe. Is even more so the case with the Humid Forests of Montanes.

Petr was saying the other day, he feels that Ambilobe ect, were more a secondary biotype for Panthers as well. With humid forests being the primary. So even more humidity.

The 50-70% we shoot for, is more akin to to the dry season. Not that that is that bad, as that still accounts for 6 months of the year.

 

[kinyonga]

@GinaFrus27 ...how is your chameleon now?
What changes have you made?
Is he able to,shoot out his tongue now?