Hi all - basking temps/egg-laying

[KimmieCham]

I posted a discussion yesterday about my new female veiled and everyone was helpful with giving me advice. I am new at this so I am a bit of a nervous wreck about what to do to make sure she's getting the proper husbandry.

So I unfortunately worked a long shift today, about 12 hours, and came home to Kimmie opening and closing her mouth while on her basking vine. I am concerned her basking temp is too hot and that she was not misted enough (I do not have an automatic mister, I mist manually 3-4 times daily). Normally, my boyfriend works from home and is home during the day so the misting frequency isn't an issue, however he's out of town for a few days. I misted her immediately after I noticed the gaping, which she hates. Then, she puffed out her body (throat and abdomen) to where she almost resembled a balloon! She has not done this before. Then she moved away from her basking spot and down to a lower vine. I fed her a waxworm as a treat and she ate it readily. She went down to the bottom of the cage and is currently still there, clutching to the foliage.

I have set up my security cam in my house to be able to view her when I am at work, and she doesn't seem to move as much as when I first got her. Here are my concerns:

• Does the mouth gaping behavior indicate that she is too hot? I was told she is around 3-4 mos old by a member here, as the people I got her from have no idea. Her basking temp is around 88, sometimes 90. I moved her vine down some but I am concerned it will not be enough. Any advice on how to situate the light? (Not basking light related, but sidenote - I will soon be purchasing a UVB tube instead of the coiled light I have now).
• What does the "puffiness" indicate? It was only momentarily, and she has not done it again. When I first got home and approached her after I noticed she was mouth-gaping, her throat began to enlarge also.
• She goes down to the bottom of the cage a lot to spend time and/or sleep. Does this just indicate she wants to be cooler? Or is it the process of becoming gravid? If she is really 3-4 mos. old, surely she is too young? I ordered a container for her egg-laying bin - it comes on Saturday. It was hard to find a container that would be large enough.
• What kind of play sand do y'all use in the bins? I am looking at this on Amazon ( http://a.co/dv6iKHn). Is this ok?

Thank you for viewing...I am just nervous :/
*I will copy the questionnaire that I filled out at my last thread to post as a reply.

 

[KimmieCham]

Cage Type – Zoo med ReptiBreeze Medium open-air aluminum cage. 16 x 16 x 30
Lighting – ReptiSun 5.0 UVB with a daylight 60w heat emitting bulb (this is what came with the ReptiBreeze kit). Lighting schedule is on at 6am, off at 7pm via a timer.
Temperature –Temp ranges from 70-90 degrees (70 towards bottom, 90 under basking light). Lowest overnight temp that I read was around 72, with the thermometer placed around 2/3 of the way down the cage. I have a digital thermometer (sits 2/3 of the way down) as well as a thermometer/hygrometer combo that sits on the top left corner of the cage, opposite the light set up. I just purchased an infrared thermometer today to hopefully get better readings.
Humidity – During the day, humidity stays between 45-50%. I am having a hard time getting it to go above 50% during the day. It reaches up to 65-75% after I mist, but will slowly decline. At night the humidity is between 60-70%. I use a hygrometer to measure the humidity level. To help maintain humidity, we have covered the back and left side of the cage with a thin plastic (it’s actually a used poncho that we had laying around). We use the Little Dripper at 1 drop every 1.5 to 2 seconds. I also have a live plant (Schefflara arboricola) in the cage.
Plants - Schefflara arboricola
Placement – We live in an open-concept apartment where the dining room flows in the living room (they are almost the same space). The cage is against the wall, away from any air vents or fans. It is placed next to our dining table, which we are not at a whole lot. However, across the room is our couch/tv where we spend a good amount of time. The cage is sitting on a cubicle storage square which is about 3 feet high (we are changing this soon for drainage purposes), and the cage probably reaches up to approx. 5.5 feet tall
Location – Tampa Bay, FL
Your Chameleon – Veiled Chamelon, Female. Unsure of age. Adopted her on 12/3 evening.
Handling – Seldomly; had to remove her from cage to take her to the vet. But that’s about it.
Feeding – Crickets, waxworm (treat), mealworm (treat), sweet potato. Have tried kale, apple and blueberry and she does not seem interested. Approx 8 small (½ to ¾ inch) crickets in AM w/ sweet potato. Looking into getting super worms.
Watering – The Little Dripper w/ misting 3-4 times a day for 1-2 mins. Kimmie drinks from the leaves and from the dripper.
Fecal Description – Initial fecal sample was orange with normal brown colors (she pooped right after we transferred her to her new cage). Now they are a normal brown poop, slightly moist but firm looking. There has been no parasite testing yet
Supplements - Calcium w/o D3 @ every feeding, Calcium w/o D3 2x a month, Reptivite 2x a month

 

[CJ's Exotics]

If she is 3 to 4 months old, that temp might be too ho. Maybe low to mid 80s will be okay. She is sleeping during the day? Does she have a cooler spot at the top like 80 ish degrees to be in when she is not basking? Please provide pictures. I would not be handling either, if you hold her seldomly, if what you mean by that like 1 time a day or less.

 

[KimmieCham]

If she is 3 to 4 months old, that temp might be too ho. Maybe low to mid 80s will be okay. She is sleeping during the day? Does she have a cooler spot at the top like 80 ish degrees to be in when she is not basking? Please provide pictures.

Hi there - she does not seem to be sleeping during the day, although I am not home to see if her eyes are closed. But when I check on my camera, it looks like she moves from 1-2 places and not much else. The past two days (I've only had her for about 72 hours) she seemed to like to move around a bit more. She does have a cooler spot to be - temps get all the way down to the low 70's towards the bottom of the enclosure.
The first picture is her today, when I first got home after I noticed her mouth opening. Second pic is at the vet on Saturday. Third pic is of her enclosure.

 

[CJ's Exotics]

What did the vet say on examination? Did you get a fecal?

 

[KimmieCham]

What did the vet say on examination? Did you get a fecal?

Have not done any fecal testing yet. I actually work in a veterinary hospital, and will be able to bring in a fecal sample with me on Saturday. The vet said overall she looks healthy, although a little thin. I was not able to really get an approx. age on her.

 

[CJ's Exotics]

Have not done any fecal testing yet. I actually work in a veterinary hospital, and will be able to bring in a fecal sample with me on Saturday. The vet said overall she looks healthy, although a little thin. I was not able to really get an approx. age on her.

I did Think she was thin, but I was not sure if she was exhaling. Her setup looks great, and with good feeding, she should get nice and plump, LOL!!!

 

[kinyonga]

She's not showing her big girl colors so she shouldn't be gravid. When you mist her I hope you don't spray her in such a way that the water is sprayed into her mouth or sprayed hard on anything less than a very very fine mist. You don't want her to aspirate the water. I agree that the basking temperature should be in the low to mid 80's for a female. Also if you overfeed her constantly (not saying you do...just warning you not to) once she's an adult she can end up producing a huge clutch and can even develop MBD or prolapse, and have difficulty laying the eggs.

 

[CJ's Exotics]

She's not showing her big girl colors so she shouldn't be gravid. When you mist her I hope you don't spray her in such a way that the water is sprayed into her mouth or sprayed hard on anything less than a very very fine mist. You don't want her to aspirate the water. I agree that the basking temperature should be in the low to mid 80's for a female. Also if you overfeed her constantly (not saying you do...just warning you not to) she can end up producing a huge clutch and can even develop MBD or prolapse, and have difficulty laying the eggs.

Sorry, I did not specify on overfeeding when I said she was thun.

 

[kinyonga]

No problem....it's all good!

 

[CJ's Exotics]

No problem....it's all good!

 

[KimmieCham]

She's not showing her big girl colors so she shouldn't be gravid. When you mist her I hope you don't spray her in such a way that the water is sprayed into her mouth or sprayed hard on anything less than a very very fine mist. You don't want her to aspirate the water. I agree that the basking temperature should be in the low to mid 80's for a female. Also if you overfeed her constantly (not saying you do...just warning you not to) she can end up producing a huge clutch and can even develop MBD or prolapse, and have difficulty laying the eggs.

I definitely don't spray the water in an aggressive way...if anything the only part of her I let the mister touch is her tail. She just always seems to hate when I mist and starts to move away. I'm not sure if I'm overfeeding her, initially I was doing twice daily and now I'm doing once a day (in the morning) and with a snack when I get home from work. She seems super hungry each time. Is this normal? Should it be safe to say that she's 3-4 mos old? I had thought younger chams need more frequent feedings.

 

[CJ's Exotics]

I definitely don't spray the water in an aggressive way...if anything the only part of her I let the mister touch is her tail. She just always seems to hate when I mist and starts to move away. I'm not sure if I'm overfeeding her, initially I was doing twice daily and now I'm doing once a day (in the morning) and with a snack when I get home from work. She seems super hungry each time. Is this normal? Should it be safe to say that she's 3-4 mos old? I had thought younger chams need more frequent feedings.

How much is she eating?

 

[KimmieCham]

How much is she eating?

I feed her about 8 small crickets (probably 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch) in the morning with some sweet potato. I have tried apple, blueberries, kale and collards and she doesn't like any of that - just the sweet potatoes. The crickets are gutloaded/dusted. And like I said, when I get home from work I give a small snack - today it was a waxworm. Most of the time it's sweet potato.

 

[CJ's Exotics]

I feed her about 8 small crickets (probably 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch) in the morning with some sweet potato. I have tried apple, blueberries, kale and collards and she doesn't like any of that - just the sweet potatoes. The crickets are gutloaded/dusted. And like I said, when I get home from work I give a small snack - today it was a waxworm. Most of the time it's sweet potato.

Ok, maybe she should eat more. I don' know much about Veiled's, so I think I will just leave it to others like kinyonga and respond to general information.

 

[kinyonga]

Oops I made a correction to my post above...the overfeeding is a concern once she's full grown. You don't want her to be fat even as a youth but you do want to feed her enough to make sure she grows to her full size. I usually say feed young ones as much as they will eat in a couple of minutes per feeding. A small snack should be fine too.

You said..."She seems super hungry each time. Is this normal?" ....female veileds are always hungry!

You said..."Should it be safe to say that she's 3-4 mos old?"...it's hard to tell...some grow faster than others.

You said..." I had thought younger chams need more frequent feedings"...true...we feed them every day and once they are a few months old cut it back to every other day.

 

[KimmieCham]

Oops I made a correction to my post above...the overfeeding is a concern once she's full grown. You don't want her to be fat even as a youth but you do want to feed her enough to make sure she grows tomher full size. I usually say feed young ones as much as they will eat in a couple of minutes per feeding. A small snack should be fine too.

You said..."She seems super hungry each time. Is this normal?" ....female veileds are always hungry!

You said..."Should it be safe to say that she's 3-4 mos old?"...it's hard to tell...some grow faster than others.

You said..." I had thought younger chams need more frequent feedings"...true...we feed them every day and once they are a few months old cut it back to every other day.

Okay, so I will keep feeding her once a day at the current amount. I guess in a month or so I'll cut it back to every other day. I just feel so bad...she always wants to eat! I am used to my furbabies who look at me with puppy dog eyes and get spoiled with treats
Some of this feels like guess work until I find out what works...mainly I am concerned with her being too hot and possibly starting to lay eggs soon. I appreciate all of the info!

 

[kinyonga]

As I said..." I usually say feed young ones as much as they will eat in a couple of minutes per feeding. A small snack should be fine too.".

 

[KimmieCham]

As I said..." I usually say feed young ones as much as they will eat in a couple of minutes per feeding. A small snack should be fine too.".

I gotcha