How come nobody uses carnivorous plants?

[EvilLost]

Just a curiosity...

I was researching a few "exotic" plants to showcase my build as it nears completion and I originally went to orchids but I'm not a huge fan of them....I bought a bunch from Andy's, and having had them for a week now, I'm nowhere near satisfied the price I paid for most of them, esp in comparison to some other plants i've found.

In particular, I was curious about pitcher plants. Is there a reason nobody uses them? I've done some research and it seems that they are mildly toxic so I would avoid use with any "munchy" chameleon, but my panthers have never munched....a full grown panther would be fine with the smaller pitchers I imagine

just curious if more people have tried them or other experiences? I was doing research for some "showcase" plants for my build and have been mostly let down by orchids....but I love Nepenthes....

north american pithcer plants (sarracenia) and venus fly traps need a dormant period...but nepenthes and sundews dont....I also really like heliamphora but i need to find out if they have dormancy still...


anyway given my setup i can afford to house 1 highland nep and 3-5 lowland....so I just wanted to see what others had on this? Search didn't take me too far...only a few mentions. In general I'm surprised more people aren't interested in this ?



On another note, if anyone knows of a nice plant for my centerpiece, I'm open to ALL suggestions I don't know plants. I have a LOT OF ROOM, 6' height to grow and 2' diameter (if I need that much).....gimme what ya got!

 

[KarmaChameleon1337]

I don't know but I assume because they have acids to disolve the bugs.

 

[camimom]

Scheffelara can get big.
I have one thats 4 ft tall

 

[Fool2Think]

Nepenthes alata grows like a weed. If it has something to cling to it can get very sturdy. I have not put one into a chameleon cage, but now i'm thinking I might. They would probably do well if they are getting enough light.

 

[eriksorg]

Just to throw something else at you...most carnivorous plants are not " branchy"...not having any good areas to climb or even hold the weight of a full grown cham....just my opinion!

 

[EvilLost]

@camimom: i was looking for something....nicer o


@eriksorg: Yes I realize that, I'm not concerned about the branches. I have far more than enough climbing area, I'm just trying looking for a plant to highlihgt in the build in specific since right now it is, more or less, a ton of "leaves"

@karma: yes i believe they also have acid if the plant is eaten, I wouldn't use it with a jacksons or other munchers...but my panthers have never once munched so I wasn't too worried

 

[camimom]

my scheffelara are very pretty. Nice leaves for drinking, growing nice and strong.
If you want 'pretty' as in color, get hibiscus, but those are hard to take care of.

 

[eriksorg]

Are you the same " evillost" over on dendroboard????

 

[Carlton]

Just a curiosity...


In particular, I was curious about pitcher plants. Is there a reason nobody uses them? I've done some research and it seems that they are mildly toxic so I would avoid use with any "munchy" chameleon, but my panthers have never munched....a full grown panther would be fine with the smaller pitchers I imagine

On another note, if anyone knows of a nice plant for my centerpiece, I'm open to ALL suggestions I don't know plants. I have a LOT OF ROOM, 6' height to grow and 2' diameter (if I need that much).....gimme what ya got!

I suppose most of us aren't specialist plant people and may not know about pitcher plants. Don't most of them require a boggy wet substrate? Might be tough to offer in anything but a very large cage that has room for some sort of tub of bog soil with proper drainage, pH, etc. I don't think a pitcher would be a hazard for the cham, but it won't offer anything to climb on and the cham's claws could damage the plant if it does. With enough bright light a hibiscus can really grow and bloom indoors. Great red edible flowers.

I find a large happy Ficus alli to be a great centerpiece plant, especially in a cham free range. These trees can really get big, have a nice leaf shape, and you can often find them with their trunks braided or shaped. I had one that topped 7 feet and about 5 feet in diameter. Planted in a huge tub, it gave the whole room a mini forest feel. But, it also looked a little suspicious from outside the house...a couple of neighbors halfway jokingly asked if I was growing pot.

 

[Draco1702]

I used to keep several Nepenthes and think that the smaller varieties could probably work (I wonder if small chams could get out of a pitcher if they fell in it?). That said, I recall that most Nepenthes have sweet exhudates on their leaves and stems, likely to attract prey insects. I wonder if these secretions would be toxic to chameleons if ingested upon licking water off the leaves....

 

[Crewdogg15]

Carnivorous plants are toxic and some have sharp thorns. With all this said, what do chameleons do to hydrate themselves? Eat plants of course. The main question is "is it worth it when other plants have been highly succesfull?"

And the damn plants will eat my chameleons bugs!! Im not buying extra insects!!!!!!! lol

 

[DeremensisBlue]

Carnivorous plants are rarely used because they provide little benefit to the chameleons. Plants provide
1) a surface to lick water from
2) cover for security
3) branches to climb on
4) humidity
5) make the enclosure aesthetically pleasing

Nepenthes are the closest to being able to provide a function as their leaves are broad enough to provide a water surface and some cover.
Sarrecenia would be a decoration plant, though may have challenges looking good if a chameleon tries to use it as a climbing surface! (not a problem with purpurea or psitticina)
Sundews and butterworts you should stay away from because of the sticky leaves. Yeah, you could stick them in an area that is supposedly unaccessable by the chameleon, but there is no reason to risk some of that stuff getting in an eye.
Venus Fly Traps would be decoration only.
Terrestrial bladderworts could work too for show and flower interest.

So you end up with most CPs fulfilling #4 and #5 only. There are so many plants that fulfill all 5 that it falls to the horticultural and vivarium enthusiast who are willing to put in the extra effort they require to devise a way to merge chameleons and CPs. But it can be done if that is an interest of yours!

 

[EvilLost]

Carnivorous plants are toxic and some have sharp thorns. With all this said, what do chameleons do to hydrate themselves? Eat plants of course. The main question is "is it worth it when other plants have been highly succesfull?"

And the damn plants will eat my chameleons bugs!! Im not buying extra insects!!!!!!! lol

uhhhh WHAT? Gotta love the "of course"....


@Everyone: I always forget that there isn't a very big "display build" mentality on these boards. Me personally, all my setups have to be appropriate for the animals and aesthetically pleasing.

@Carlton: you are right about the soil issue. but since our plants are generally potted individually anyway, it is not very difficult to adjust the plant appropriately...I will of course be limited to where I can place it, but I have appropriate locations already

@Draco: good observation; I will look a little more into that later...I'm not sure but I think the only harmful substances are in the pitchers or physically inside the plants (ie has to break the skin) but drinking water off the skin...very good point....

@DeremensisBlue: Most folk are giving me that same response....but you don't need every single plant to perform all 5 functions you listed, as long as you have sufficient plants in appropriate places to achieve an aggregate conclusion.

@eriksorg: yes, I'm EvilLost pretty much everywhere...though recently someone has hijacked my name in some games -.-

I'm just trying to find some nice plants to spruce things up ^^

 

[Carlton]

With all this said, what do chameleons do to hydrate themselves? Eat plants of course.

Umm, nope, not true!

 

[Olimpia]

I agree with you Evillost, I think if you already have enough plants in the cage for climbing, why not spruce it up a little for your own aesthetic enjoyment? I haven't done something more elaborate just because I move so often. Otherwise I'd custom order a huge glass cage and deck it out with a fake rock wall, lots of tropical plants and flowers, moss, etc. But right now I have a huge cage but it's easy to tear apart and move.

If you can find one that doesn't have sticky/toxic leaf surfaces, I think you can do whatever you want. I don't see it as a big risk, and if your chameleon can't climb that one plant then he'll survive, I assume you'll provide lots of other climbable plants and branches/vines.

I did want to find a fast growing flowering vine though to add some interest to the cage. I just have to look around and see if I see any available at nurseries, but I'd also like some plants in there for my own selfish enjoyment, if I can. Although I do like their silver cloud ficus plants, I think they're very pretty.

 

[pssh]

I wouldn't want to put a plant like that into a cage with a panther. While the plant is a neat and great centerpiece, I feel that it would be much more suited to a nicer enclosure of its own. If it was in its own vivarium, it would be much more easily noticed/appreciated and natural looking. Then you can really focus on the specific species you want to keep and provide the best conditions for the plant and not the chameleon.

I was looking into them a few months ago and ultimately decided not to add any to a cage/enclosure with a chameleon in it. Chameleons are so unique and panthers in particular are incredibly eye-catching. I felt that the chameleons would really take away from the uniqueness of the plants. If I were to show someone a panther enclosure with a carnivorous plant in it, they would skip the plant and look at the googly-eyed, color changing lizard. I want people to really appreciate both the plant and the chameleon, but ultimately, a living breathing lizard is more popular.

 

[DeremensisBlue]

@Everyone: I always forget that there isn't a very big "display build" mentality on these boards. Me personally, all my setups have to be appropriate for the animals and aesthetically pleasing.

ouch. A little bit of a dig from left field to start the new year?

CPs will do fine with chameleons. I have done it before and have enjoyed the combination of passions. There are some challenges. Match your lowland or highland nepenthes with the appropriate chameleon species for a compatible environment and you are fine.

With flytraps or Sarrecenia you have to set up the RO watering system and make sure that the lighting is such that they get sufficient light. I have run into the challenge that low lying plants don't get enough light in a cage designed for a high climbing chameleon or else the plants are very high up.

But all of these things can be overcome if you decide you want to have CPs and chameleons together. For example, you could create an outcropping at chest level that hides a plant light and have a CP grotto beneath it. That way the CPs have their light and they are at a level where you can enjoy them.

I would not recommend the combo to the standard chameleon keeper because CPs have their own, sometimes special, requirements just like chameleons and there is an extra challenge in coordinating the two. Nepenthes are the most compatible. It is just a function of how much work you want to put into every detail of the vivarium.

Just go easy on poor @everyone. Combining CPs and chameleons so both are healthy adds a respectable complexity.

As for eating plants for getting their moisture. I think that guy thought he was on the desert tortoise forum...honest mistake, I am sure.

 

[VeiledChams]

Scheffelara can get big.
I have one thats 4 ft tall

I got a 6 footer out back and a 4 foot one thats going in my melleri enclosure.. I love scheffleras