How to feed

[jampen]

Greetings All!

New to cham ownership. Just bought an approx 1yr old, Mellers and I need info about how to feed.

We put finely chopped apples in small dish and orange slice into cage. Not interested.

Bought live superworms and crickets. Tried to hand feed with no success. Put some of each into cage to free range. So far it doesn't act interested in chasing em.

I put the small plastic container of superworms in the cage and the cham moved down and stared at em wiggling in the dish, but I never saw it take one. So...

What is the best way (details please) to feed these amazing animals?

 

[hallenhe]

Welcome!
While some chameleons will eat fruit and veggies, many won't, so the apples and oranges are not likely to be big hits.
Some chams are shy feeders; if he sees you watching, he may not eat. Mine is reasonably unshy, as it were, but if you make eye contact, he'll lock eyes with you and forget about the food.
Allowing crickets to free range in the cage, or putting them in a cup where he can access them generally is a viable option; leaving a superworm or two in a cup and walking away could easily work, too, especially if he notices the cup. An advantage to the cup is that you can easily know how many bugs you put in and see how many are there later on, while free ranging crix may be hard to keep track of.
If you've just gotten him, they may take a couple days to adjust to their new homes and start eating and drinking.
RE drinking, that's often more important than eating for chameleons. They have little or no understanding of standing water, so usually won't drink from a dish; spritzing them for several minutes with a fine mist of warm water (e.g. from a plant mister) is beneficial. A drip system that will drip out water throughout the day is also good; this can be as simple as a plastic bottle with a small hole in the bottom, or pet stores will sell more complex ones with valves to control the water flow.
Again, welcome; I don't have a Meller's, but what I've said here applies to pretty much all chameleons. The Meller's people should be ciming in with some more specific advice.

 

[Pure]

Welcome to the forum.

First and for most please take time and read the
Melleri Discovery Web Site. You will find it to be a valuable resource.

For your particular question, what Hellen has said is dead on. I personally prefer cup feeding and would only not use it if I had a problem feeder. The bugs being free range often will help entice them to eat. But I like to monitor my guys intake and since I keep them together in the same cage, this is very important.

At this point, food can wait. Water is more important. I'm guessing your guy is a wild caught, and there is no way to know how long he's been without a good drink. Melleri require more water than most other species and are usually very thirsty when first brought in from the wild. During acclimation you need to be showering this guy for 20 minutes at least 2-3 times a week. I personally watered mine for 20-30 minutes 2 times a day. You seriously can not provide too much water.

Also, and this part is vital. You need to get him to a vet for an over all check up and a fecal test for parasites. Parasites and dehydration are the number one killer of this species. They usually come in from the wild with a pretty heavy infestation of parasites and have to be treated with medication to rid them of them.I like this site as a resource for finding a good herp vet. But you still need to research the vet you choose. It can be hard to find a vet that is knowledgeable in chameleons. And just because they say they know them doesn't really mean much. Check references.

And finally..post pics! We all love seeing these animals and the eye of an experienced keeper can often tell you if there are any apparent problems.

 

[jampen]

Thx and more

Many thanks for the help!!

I have been thoroughly spritzing him/her/it for two days now, about 5 minutes per session and at least 4 times per day.

He/she/It - has begun opening its mouth and lapping water as it runs off it head. This is good, I think.

Still not sure if it is eating and it seems to be sleeping alot during the day, so I will search for a good vet in the area.

If anyone can recommend one in the Fort Worth/Dallas TX area I appreciate the help.

Thx

 

[Pure]

The sleeping would point me to dehydration and parasites. Serioulsy until he is acclimatd you should be misint until he won't trink anymor, and then I would keep it up for anout 10-15- and then another 5 mns or so after he stops drinkind

 

[jampen]

Mist water?

Thanks for the reply. I will follow your recommendations.

I am increasing the misting cycle to 20 min. every 2 hours.

Is there any need for concern when using city water to mist, re. chlorine, fluoride etc.?

He seems to be molting on his head. See pics

Do they get lethargic during this time? He just seems "tired".

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[Pure]

He actually looks to be in pretty good condition. Better than about 90% of the WC Melleri I've seen. Nice and fat and he doesn't appear to be dehydrated. People often report their chams getting a lil moody during a shed, but lethargic, no. And a shed would def not cause him to close his eye. A vet visit is in order..

I noticed the red lamp on the side of the cage. May I ask what's the purpose behind this? Melleri are a montane species and really don't like it hot. My guys basking temp is at 80-85 max ( I have more than one since there are 2 chams in one enclosure)

Do me a favor and fill out the information in this link That way we can spot any current or potential issues.

I can tell you for sure, remove that red light. The extra heat it provides isn't needed unless your night time temps are going below 50*F. And if it gets that cold, heating the room by use of a space heater is the best option for warming them up at night. And a screw in ceramic type heater would be second best. Chams can see red light and it will disturb their sleep patterns. They need it to be dark at night. This holds true for all species.

And just from what I can see of your enclosure, more cover is needed. Since you already have your enclosure set up adding large pothos would be the easiest fix. You can use the vines to wrap around his dowel perches, effectively turning them into a more tree branch like structure.

 

[jampen]

That light is actual a 65w standard pink bulb (not a "heat lamp" per se). There is also a flourescent fixture that sets on top.

I keep a thin blanket on top of the cage when the top is closed "not taking pictures".

His normal cage temp with lights on, during the day, ranges from 75 - 81F. At night with the lights off the cage temp can get as low as 70F. Humidity hovers between 50-60%.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Coated wire mesh approx 1/2" squares on sides and top w/solid metal bottom - 24x24x36"
Lighting - generic 18" fluorescent tube fixture from hardware store with full spectrum bulb and a 65W pink floodlight in clamp-on socket w/aluminum shroud. Lights stay on during day and are turned off at night. The cage is positioned near a corner with windows so natural day light comes in on two sides.
Temperature - normal cage temp with the lights on during the day ranges from 75 - 80F. At night with the lights off the cage temp can get as low as 70F. I use a digital temp/humidity monitor with a wired sensor dangling several inches into the cage from the top
Humidity - Humidity hovers between 50-60%.
Plants - One live, potted pothos
Placement - Sitting on the floor in the kitchen right now. Will be moved to bedroom. There are ceiling mounted a/c and heat vents. I closed the one closest to the cage
Location - North Central Texas, Lat: 32.343912 N, Lon: 97.405933 W

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - Melleri, not sure about age or sex. We have had him 4 days
Handling - I have two boys that initially held him alot. The last 2 days I asked them to let him rest and get settled. He doesn't seem to mind being held and does not exhibit aggressive behaviour.
Feeding - We are still trying to get him to eat. He has a choice of finely diced apples and oranges, several superworms and small crickets from the pet store are loose in the cage. I have not done any gut-loading of the feeders.
Supplements - No supplements yet.
Watering - Small water bowl in bottom of cage and regular misting. Today he starting lapping the water during misting.
Fecal Description - I have not seen any droppings. We have not taken him to the vet yet.
History - We bought him locally from an unknown seller at a flea market.
Current Problem - When we first brought him home he seemed normal. Eyes open wide, observant, crawling around. The last two days he seems tired, moving very little, eyes closed or nearly so most of the time, and I haven't seen him eat anything. I am pretty sure that he was dehydrated for the first 2 days.Since then I have increased the misting in both frequency and duration. "15-20 minutes every 2-3 hours". He has started sitting with eyes closed and his head "down", hanging below the level of his front feet alot.

He was in a cage with another cham when we bought him. The Discovery Melleri website talks about the particular social behavior and related sensitivity to social stress of WC Melleri. They seem to exhibit a high mortality rate that may be due to social anxiety or separation from their familiar surroundings and social group.

 

[jampen]

Update

This evening, the skin on his head around his eyes and on the circular "eyelid" part that moves when he looks around, is noticeably peeling up and off.

Hopefully this is why his eyes have been closed alot the last two days.

I think we will call this Chameleon "Mel". Its a unisex name and we don't know if it is an innie or an outie.

Thanks for all the help

 

[summoner12]

It looks like you have him low to the floor. Melleri do not like to be low at all. They want to be above other animals... and humans. One of my melleri has a huge complex about this. If he isn't higher than me he gets very fussy and displays it to let me know.

The closed eyes won't have much to do with the shedding. It is more of a lighting or sickness issue. What brand 'full spectrum' light are you using? You should be using a Zoo Med UVB 5.0 lamp. and for the heat lamp just use a normal household lamp. Don't go very high with the wattage, Melleri don't need high temp heating... but you do want to get his skin temp around 100*.

Have you had him checkd out for parasites? Where did you get him from? Have you ever cared for Melleri or other chameleons before?

 

[summoner12]

You should also be giving him lots of water... but 20 minutes every two hours is a lot.... I wouldn't mist that much. I would do maybe three 20-25 minute misting spread out over the day... giving a couple of hours to dry out and don't mist just before lights out... give another couple of hours after he last mist for him to bask and dry off.

As for feeding... If you have a bowl and some collard greens you can put lightly dusted crickets on the greens and he will shoot the crickets and get some greens with them.

If you put a super worm on the side of the screen that helps interest them. Try getting some silk or horn worms as well. You can check out Mulberry Farms for all kinds of feeder options.

 

[jampen]

I moved his cage up onto a desk/countertop, closer to the windows and he immediately moved up the side of the cage as high as he could. The top of the cage is around 7' from the floor.

He seems to be looking around more and more alert. He definitely likes being
up high.

The fluorescent bulb I am using is a standard aquarium/reptile bulb from our local hardware store. We are in a small town so I'll have to order the one you recommended.

Thanks for the help!

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[summoner12]

Have you heard of LLL Reptile? They are a site sponsor. They have everything you need... and the prices aren't bad.

The price on the lamps has gone up a bit since Zoo Med no longer makes T12 lamps...... Not really sure why this made the price of the 18" go up.......... seeing as it has always been T8.... (15" and 18" have always been T8. all the other sizes were T12 and are not also T8....) Can't bitch tooooo much because the price sure beats Petco and Petsmart (I think they are like 35 bucks).

18" 5.0 Reptisun

 

[Pure]

even still, thelight coming from the side isn't the best idea. It can stress him. Look around at other's cages for ideas, but at the very least provide more cover, and he will need a much larger cage.

As an example here is a pic of my Melleri enclosure.

It's an odd shaped corner cage but it measure 8 feet across the front a lil over 6 feet across the back wall and 4 feet on the left wall.

 

[jampen]

Hurray!! Mel is Eating

I admit that I am a little slow to figure things out but we finally got Mel to eat.

He simply wanted live crickets. No meal worms, no superworms, no shrubbery: only Live Crickets.

I suppose that is what he was accustomed to eating before we brought him home.

He has eaten 10 small to medium crickets at one feeding and he will take more if we give them.

Is this an appropriate amount for his size (approx 1-2 years old)? What is a proper feeding schedule and amount each week?





"PURE" - Thanks for the suggestion. I am working on a larger, permanent enclosure. The cage he is in is a temporary one that we had available.

I was thinking about a 24x24x60 screened cage, but after seeing yours I have to admit I felt a slight bit of "cage envy". We want to add another cham eventually so I think I'll make a bigger cage than originally planned so I won't have to expand it later.

 

[summoner12]

Shannen did a really nice job with his enclosure but my free range is way cooler! LOL JK!

But I am still going to post a link to the project. Link

I will say about the feeding... They all kinda go through stages and all have their own likes and dislikes. My fatty, Henry, eats anything... but he LOVES HWs. He can identify the cups they come in. If he sees me holding the cup he starts coming to me. I don't even have to show him what is in it, he just knows a clear cup with a green bottom and a white top means 'horn worms for lunch'.

Crickets, even large ones, are almost too small for henry because his mouth is so freakin huge. He nabs about three or four at a time when she shoots into a cup full of crickets.

Right now I have a picky eater, Ales, hes a new WC I got recently. He so far hasn't eaten anything I have offered him, except a few crickets.... Sometimes it is stress, sometimes food preference and other times illness. All you can do is give them space, variety and time.

 

[Pure]

Shannen did a really nice job with his enclosure but my free range is way cooler! LOL JK!:

I'll concede to that. Free ranges are really the best way to keep these big guys. I would love to free range. Unfortunately I have dogs. Both of them would love a Melleri squeak toy. lol


Wile he is acclimating feed him as much as he will eat. Don't dust with calcium. Melleri often don't do so well with supplementation. Proper gut load and UVB lighting is all he needs.

It's handy for you to get a weight on him in grams. And to monitor it. Once he is acclimated and you see him fill out some you can cut back on the feeding. 3-4 large pray items every other day is plenty. One of my guys gained weight only eating 1-2 super worms a week. His activity level was next to zero but he has always been alert. I had him and his cage mate checked over by a vet for parasites and he couldn't see anything visibly wrong with him, and both fecals were clean.

It's been over 4 months now and he has just this past week started going down to the cricket bin to eat every day. I was having to hand feed him what supers I could get him to eat before. Now my 2 guys are not fresh imports. They were acclimated and cared for, for 6 months prior to my purchasing them. His just now eating is a testament to just how long the acclimation process can be with these guys.

I was so proud of him yesterday. He went down and kicked the piglet female off of the feeding bin so he could eat. (they have separate bins but choose to use the same one). She was not happy, but he's bigger so all she could do is turn black and sulk.

Your assumption about him being stressed from lack of other cham interaction is a possibility. I would still take him to the vet for a check up before I went out and bought a new cham. He really should be seen by a vet any how.

 

[summoner12]

I would still supplement with some calcium as you are now keeping him inside and the calcium to phos. ratio of crickets is pretty bad. Just do light dusting. It is also good to give him calcium with D3 since you are keeping him inside. If you are able to sun him a couple of times a week in direct sunlight... no windows, or plastic between him and the light, you won't need to use D3.

Over dusting messes with melleri. Just keep it light.

 

[jampen]

Any particular brand. I looked at LLL and there are several different makers.

I'm considering this one. http://lllreptile.com/store/catalog/reptile-supplies/vitamins-medicines-and-cage-cleaners/-/carib-sea-calstron-reptile-calcium/

 

[summoner12]

This

Or this

Or this will do well. I like the middle option because it is a very very fine powder and sticks well. I have no used the third option... but I have used one of that brand's products and do like them, though.