I fixed the enclosure!!

[AmandaS]

You can lower your branches, but that would take away from a lot of the space in your enclosure. If I were you I'd lift the lights and utilize the entire enclosure, especially since your enclosure is already smaller than recommended size.

 

[Klyde O'Scope]

i have a t5 10.0 with a silver reflector the only thing between my cham and the UVB is the screen.

Without a solar meter it is recommended to elevate the light 10-12 inches above the highest branch.
With a 10.0 you need lots of foliage, so you will need many many more plants.

Again, this is where a UV meter would help. I have a T5 6% with silver reflector and screen in-between, yet according to my UV meter (which is working properly) I still need 13" between bulb and basking perch.

If I were to raise my perch to the (suggested by some) 9" from bulb to perch, my cham would be getting a UVI of 5-6+ which is too strong.

I have a similar situation with my bearded dragon enclosure, which does use a 10.0 UVB.
Each installation may be different; there's no way to tell without a meter. Also, a meter helps tell when a bulb actually needs replacement. "Rule of thumb" says to replace after 12 months. My 10.0 bulb is over 13 months now, and is still at full strength. In the long run, having a meter will not only be more accurate, the more reptiles (and UVB bulbs) one has, the more money it will save and pay for itself.

 

[AmandaS]

Solar meters cost so much, not everyone can afford one. That's why there is "recommended" distance. I agree, it helps to be sure....but in the meantime.....

 

[Klyde O'Scope]

Solar meters cost so much, not everyone can afford one. That's why there is "recommended" distance. I agree, it helps to be sure....but in the meantime.....

I understand that, but keeping animals—and most hobbies—are known money pits. IME, the majority of cases were people get into trouble on this forum is due to their not being aware of—or prepared for—the expenses required.

Most often, it's because they don't account for vet costs, or somehow think they're going to be "lucky" or that bad things won't happen. But it happens with enclosures, feeders, humidity, lighting... which includes (or should) a UV meter—just as much as it includes getting a proper T5 UVB. IMO it's part & parcel the same thing.

I haven't perused the "costs of owning a chameleon" articles lately, but IMO if they don't include a UV meter, they should.

Why do people on this forum insist on a 2x2x4 enclosure, digital instrumentation, a T5 linear UVB, varied feeder diet, gut loading, fecal exams, live plants, etc. etc. but it's OK to forgo a UV meter?


Sorry about the rant. It's something I feel strongly about.

 

[Klyde O'Scope]

To draw an analogy, we insist on certain temperatures, and thermometers to monitor and maintain.
Likewise, we insist on certain humidity levels, and hygrometers to monitor and maintain.
Why should UVB levels be any different? Just because of the cost of the meter? IDTS. It's no different.

Some people don't like the cost of a proper enclosure, so they DIY.
Guess what? You can build a DIY UV meter for about $18!
https://www.instructables.com/DIY-UV-Meter-With-Arduino-and-a-Nokia-5110-Display/
There are others: diy uv meter

 

[Beman]

I understand that, but keeping animals—and most hobbies—are known money pits. IME, the majority of cases were people get into trouble on this forum is due to their not being aware of—or prepared for—the expenses required.

Most often, it's because they don't account for vet costs, or somehow think they're going to be "lucky" or that bad things won't happen. But it happens with enclosures, feeders, humidity, lighting... which includes (or should) a UV meter—just as much as it includes getting a proper T5 UVB. IMO it's part & parcel the same thing.

I haven't perused the "costs of owning a chameleon" articles lately, but IMO if they don't include a UV meter, they should.

Why do people on this forum insist on a 2x2x4 enclosure, digital instrumentation, a T5 linear UVB, varied feeder diet, gut loading, fecal exams, live plants, etc. etc. but it's OK to forgo a UV meter?


Sorry about the rant. It's something I feel strongly about.

She is not saying it is ok to forgo the UV meter... But when your new and you have to spend money fast just to get the basic essentials down the UV meter is not a have to. BECAUSE we can say you have this type of screen cage so your distance with this specific fixture and this UVB bulb strength is going to be approximately this.

$250 for a solarmeter 6.5 when you have to buy a misting system, proper lighting, live plants, hygrometer, etc... That is crazy when we can tell someone what it is approximately.

Do I feel it is an essential tool to own absolutely. I bought one my 3rd month of being in the hobby. BUT it was after I bought everything else I had to provide for the cham to be and stay healthy.

 

[Klyde O'Scope]

But when your new and you have to spend money fast just to get the basic essentials down the UV meter is not a have to.

I disagree. Why ISN'T a meter just as essential as a UVB? It SHOULD be.
It would not surprise me if there are folks who'll spend another $300-$600 on another chameleon (plus enclosure, etc.) before they'll get a meter. Now THAT is crazy, IMO.

That is crazy when we can tell someone what it is approximately.

But can you? I respectfully disagree with these "guidelines". They've proven wildly inaccurate every time I've tried them. The "approximates" have been WAAY off in both my enclosures, by factors of 100%. This was especially true when the Shenzen Sunlight Lighting Company was having manufacturing issues with its reflectors. This affected all the major sellers of these fixtures for several months. The reflectors weren't working properly, and reduced the effective UVI by HALF. If not for the efforts and diligence of Dr. Baines and the Facebook Reptile Lighting Group, this may never have been discovered (much less corrected) and who knows how many reptiles would have suffered because of it?

Things are ostensibly better now, but still—stuff happens.

There are differences in bulbs as well. I bought 3 T5 bulbs together, and all three register different UVIs at the same distances.

IME, the "guidelines" are not reliable.

 

[Beman]

I disagree. Why ISN'T a meter just as essential as a UVB? It SHOULD be.
It would not surprise me if there are folks who'll spend another $300-$600 on another chameleon (plus enclosure, etc.) before they'll get a meter. Now THAT is crazy, IMO.


But can you? I respectfully disagree with these "guidelines". They've proven wildly inaccurate every time I've tried them. The "approximates" have been WAAY off in both my enclosures, by factors of 100%. This was especially true when the Shenzen Sunlight Lighting Company was having manufacturing issues with its reflectors. This affected all the major sellers of these fixtures for several months. The reflectors weren't working properly, and reduced the effective UVI by HALF. If not for the efforts and diligence of Dr. Baines and the Facebook Reptile Lighting Group, this may never have been discovered (much less corrected) and who knows how many reptiles would have suffered because of it?

Things are ostensibly better now, but still—stuff happens.

There are differences in bulbs as well. I bought 3 T5 bulbs together, and all three register different UVIs at the same distances.

IME, the "guidelines" are not reliable.

I choose not to argue with you. Honestly it is a waste of my time. In the two years I have been here and compared UVI levels with other keepers never have I seen anyone get the levels you do. Never... Take that as you wish.

You seem to preach a lot about what someone should do with their chameleon. It is easy to do when you have the funds to do whatever you want. It is easy to do when you do not have the hands on experience with them. The truth is they are not easy animals. They are not cheap animals.

The truth is people will continue to buy them without having all the info to care for them properly. Which is why this forum exists to help keepers. To be supportive of one another. Not to constantly try to be right.

Now this thread has been derailed enough. That is very very frustrating as an OP. To come for answers and then have their thread taken over.

 

[Beman]

i have a t5 10.0 with a silver reflector the only thing between my cham and the UVB is the screen.

Hi there you want to change the distance for the UVB and I would lift the heat up off the cage top to reduce thermal burn risk.

The 10.0 bulb is quite strong. So to compensate for the levels you want a full 11-12 inch distance between it and the branch below it. The easiest way with your enclosure size is going to be to lift the fixture up off the top of the cage. So measure what the distance is you have from the screen top to the branch. Then take that and subtract it from the 11-12 inch to get the distance you need to raise the fixture. This is going to give an approximate 3 UVI level at the branch.

 

[AmandaS]

Hi there you want to change the distance for the UVB and I would lift the heat up off the cage top to reduce thermal burn risk.

The 10.0 bulb is quite strong. So to compensate for the levels you want a full 11-12 inch distance between it and the branch below it. The easiest way with your enclosure size is going to be to lift the fixture up off the top of the cage. So measure what the distance is you have from the screen top to the branch. Then take that and subtract it from the 11-12 inch to get the distance you need to raise the fixture. This is going to give an approximate 3 UVI level at the branch.

I have PM'd with OP and they have light elevated 9 inches above enclosure and their highest branch 2 inches below.

 

[Klyde O'Scope]

They are not cheap animals.

That's exactly my point; we are in complete agreement about that.

The truth is people will continue to buy them without having all the info to care for them properly. Which is why this forum exists to help keepers. To be supportive of one another. Not to constantly try to be right.

This has nothing to do with being right. It has everything to do with helping others care for these animals properly in one of the few areas that can be free of guesswork.

I don't preach a lot. I state my opinions just as you and others do.

 

[ebarrychameleon]

how you can add more structure.

Hi there @angelinave12 ! These look like awesome ways to improve it but I figured I'd share how I suspended my cham's 2 big pothos in her cage because it is super cheap and also effective. Basically, I took a thick dowel and put it across the top (it has to be longer than the width of the roof). Then I put wire through the screen on top and created a loop inside the cage at the two heights I wanted the plants. Then you can just twist the wire above the dowel and the weight is carried by the dowel and not the screen. I don't know if this makes sense, so lmk if you want a picture, but it was a super cheap and simple way to hang the plants.

 

[angelinave12]

Hi there @angelinave12 ! These look like awesome ways to improve it but I figured I'd share how I suspended my cham's 2 big pothos in her cage because it is super cheap and also effective. Basically, I took a thick dowel and put it across the top (it has to be longer than the width of the roof). Then I put wire through the screen on top and created a loop inside the cage at the two heights I wanted the plants. Then you can just twist the wire above the dowel and the weight is carried by the dowel and not the screen. I don't know if this makes sense, so lmk if you want a picture, but it was a super cheap and simple way to hang the plants.

i somewhat understand but can you please post a photo it would be super helpful

 

[ebarrychameleon]

i somewhat understand but can you please post a photo it would be super helpful

Hope this helps!

 

[angelinave12]

Hope this helps!

ohhh okay thank you!!