I have a very hard decision to make and need advice

[torizazu]

URGENT: vet appt today. I have a very hard decision to make and need advice

Hey all, I have a male panther cham (locale unknown) who is approaching about 10 months of age. Since the time we rescued him from someone who wasn't caring for him about 7 months ago, he has been battling a serious case of mbd. We have done everything in our power to help him live a normal life, he has 2 linear 5.0 UVB lights, gets dusted prey daily and receives calcium and vitamin injections every three weeks in his hind legs since our vet thinks he has some type of enzyme deficiency that doesn't allow him to absorb calcium orally.
Although we have taken these measures to save him, he continues to decline. The last few days he has not even been able to get his tongue out of his mouth to eat and I have to drop dusted crickets and superworms into his mouth which he can barely open. The shots have become less and less Effective even though we have upped the dosage he has been losing weight too. My question is, is he in pain and should he be euthanized? I am an absolute mess with this issue. Today after his hand feeding session I called the vet and we are taking him in tonight to see what she recommends. He has always been the sweetest chameleon (weird for sure) and actually lunges as best he can towards you when you open his door to his cage so he can crawl up your arm. I love this little guy to death but I dont want him to suffer. He doesn't understand why he can't eat and I cant understand why nothing has helped him. Very distressing and upsetting. Please help with your advice. His appointment is at 5:15.

 

[Ethen44]

Well I know digesting/metabolizing calcium is an issue if there is a lack of D3 in the diet. If your vet believes that there is a problem with him orally injesting it, perhaps you should move his cage to where he will get direct sunlight? This is just a thought, but I hate to see a good chameleon die due to negligence (not on your part). I hope all works out for you and your lil guy, good luck.

 

[torizazu]

His shots have D3 in them (vitamin part) and so does his diet he gets natural sun when its not too hot or cold but I'm in Kansas and our weather is not outside basking friendly. It seems nothing has helped him

 

[torizazu]

Ps filtered light (ie through a window) doesn't benefit them to my knowledge so has more UVB lights than my other Cham/than what's necessary. He has coils too

 

[Olimpia]

Wow what a tough call. It seems like if he can no longer eat on his own and will need force feeding every day, it might be better to let him go. MBD is awful and so painful, and if he's continuing to decline despite your best efforts, then there might not be anything left to do. I can completely understand the love part, I'm sorry you're in such a position.

 

[laurie]

I hate to be the one to say the bad news, but it sounds like it is time to put him down. I hate to do that to any cham but I hate have any chams suffer more. When a cham or anything else, has no quality of life left, it is wrong in my terms to force them to live. I have sat and cried my eyes out as I had a couple put down, but it was the right thing for the chams and I would do it again.

 

[Hoj]

i am very sorry for your situation, my decision is based on the will to live of the cham, if you feel as though he has givin up and or in just too much pain than i believe the right thing to do is let them go.
i hope your vet has some good ideas, and kudos for you in doing whats needed

 

[torizazu]

This is so awful. He's like my little baby and he's so trusting and nice which makes this even harder. But if he's in pain I can't keep him here for my sake,

 

[torizazu]

I'll let you guys know if she thinks there are any other options for him.

 

[laurie]

This is so awful. He's like my little baby and he's so trusting and nice which makes this even harder. But if he's in pain I can't keep him here for my sake,

Hang in there Tori, as much as it hurts you, you are ending his pain.

 

[moses904]

very sorry to hear that I just lost my carpet cham recently I know it's hard.

 

[jannb]

This is so awful. He's like my little baby and he's so trusting and nice which makes this even harder. But if he's in pain I can't keep him here for my sake,

This is a decesion that you have to make for yourself and do not let anyone else sway you. My friend let her chameleon go three months ago due to someone telling her it was the right thing to do and she is still in agony over it.

 

[kinyonga]

I'm not a vet so you should confirm this with a vet, but I was told that with the urinary system they have if injections are given in the lower half of the body (including the legs) the "stuff" injected will go straight to the kidneys and may harm the chameleon.

Also...if he's getting too much D3 from supplements and injections that won't help the MBD either. Its important that the calcium, D3, vitamin A and phos. are brought back into balance for good bone health.

 

[Riven]

I'm curious that you said every three weeks for currently active MBD? We've been doing shots daily... the improvement is out of this world and amazing. I personally would not give up yet if you've only been doing shots every 3 weeks for a severe case of MBD.

In the end, no matter what you chose, none of us have to sleep with that decision. I'm sure you've been to the vet by now...


Kinyonga, I don't know if it makes a difference but we've been doing Pascal's injections subq in the belly for lack of anywhere else to do them on her tiny body, and he was worried about her spongey bones with doing them in her legs. From a circulation standpoint, if chams are like humans, it shouldn't matter, the kidneys filter the blood off the renal artery, which comes from the arota, directly from the heart prior to moving on. I understand chams aren't people, so it might be different.

 

[kinyonga]

When things are injected caudally, they hit the kidneys in a less dilute form than if they are injected cranially (in the upper, or forward, half of the body, as from the ribs to the neck). I don't know if it will matter with the D3 or not.

 

[sandrachameleon]

I feel for you. Not easy choices you are facing.

Bones and muscle need more than calcium and D3. are you providing Magnesium ? Retinol (vitamin A)? Vitamin K?

I hope things improve - wishing you luck

 

[Elizadolots]

I resisted reading this thread because I'm prone to weeping....

I don't envy you this choice, but I do trust you to know when the time is right to put the animal down.

I've taken animals far past the point others were telling me to put them down because I knew the animal still wanted to fight. You'll know. And when you know, it's the right thing to do.

 

[houseofchameleons]

Response to putting a cham down

I do believe I was the one in the discussion about putting my cham down & I just want to clear things up so there is no hard feelings. My cham was very ill will irreversable kidney & liver problems & was not swayed by anyone to put him down it was a decision I made for myself due to how ill he was & I miss him very much but I am not agonizing about the decision made. Yhe only one that told me I need to let him go was him. I know that I did the right thing but it is an agonizing thing to do in general so please note that I was not swayed by anyone but him & I am sorry if someone was hurt as a result of this

 

[brooklynelizabeth]

May the wind always be at his back and the sun upon his face, And may the wings of destiny carry him aloft to dance with the stars...

Im sorry for your loss imho, this applies to you-

Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change; courage to change the things I can; and wisdom to know the difference.

 

[SilverDragoness]

I'm so sorry for your loss. When they are having more bad days than good then it's time to think about what is best for them not just what we want. You did the right thing for him.