I think the little guy is sick

[el chamino]

Chameleon - Veiled, male, unsure of age, roughly 6-8 weeks (baby from LLLReptile). In my care 3 weeks.
Handling - Only a couple times by hand, and only when necessary. We have been showering him for the past week because of low humidity, and have taken him outside 3 or 4 times. We use a dowel to transfer from the enclosure to the shower/outdoor plant.
Feeding - Crickets( were 1/8'ish, now closer to 1/4) every day, avg. 15. have fed dubias a couple times, 2/day plus crickets. For the past several days have been feeding a few BSFL Currently cup feeding between first two mistings. Gut-loading with Romaine, carrots, with an alternating addition of zucchini, celery, or orange. Using Bug Burger as well.
Supplements - ZooMed calcium w/o D3(daily), alternating ZM cal w/ D3 and Reptivite w/o D3(every 2 weeks).
Watering - dripper, 5-6 hrs.
Spray bottle misting, roughly 5 min first misting, then three 2-4 min mistings. We have ordered a MistKing v4.0, which is supposed to arrive tomorrow.
Haven't seen him drink recently, even in the shower(unless he is drinking from the mist on him, he puts head up and acts like he is, but his mouth doesn't open perceptibly.
Fecal Description - It looks good, brown w/ white urate. He has not yet been tested for parasites. He had one poop a few days ago that hung on his vent for awhile.
History - He was very stressed for several days after we got him, so we left him alone as much as possible. He seemed less stressed as time went on, but since starting showers and outside time his stress level seems higher. we have stopped taking him outside until we have an outside enclosure for him, because the humidity is very low here and misting didn't seem to help much.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - ReptiBreeze, 18x18x36
Lighting - ReptiSun 5.0 18", ZM mini deep combo w/ 25w and 40w incandescent. 8am-8pm.
Temperature - Ambient ~72F, 80-85F basking( has gone a few degrees higher a few times), 65-70F overnight. Zilla therm/hygrometer. Getting IR gun soon.
Humidity - 40-50%, 70-80% after misting. 3 sides of enclosure wrapped w/ plastic. Zilla therm/hygrometer
Plants - 1 Ficus (benjamina I believe)
Placement - In the corner of my bedroom. No forced air in the house, so no vents, but we do have a fan outside/in the door( typically pointed at opposite corner of the same wall) of the room, to circulate cool air( window A.C. in other room) and maintain ambient temp. The top of the enclosure is roughly 6', but will be raised when I get a new stand built.
Location - Nebraska

Current Problem - Not eating as much, (perhaps because of cricket growth?) We haven't been able to find his Poop/urates for the past 2 days. This morning he acted like he was dry heaving for 2-3 seconds. We had noticed 2 days ago that it looked like he was eating some of the Ficus. So far today he has not eaten and is basking a lot. Just checked on him and he had his eyes closed while basking. Roused him and gave him a shower. Dehydration?? RI?? I dunno, but am thinking he needs to see a vet now. Any input is appreciated. Thanks, guys/girls.

will post pics later in the day

 

[Klaudiemo]

I think it might be caused by too much D3. D3 should not be fed to chams everyday. I give d3 to mine chameleons only 2-3 times a month (depending on how much time they spent outside on the sun). If your chameleon spends like 5 days out of 7 outside, you don't have to give D3 to him at all. Chameleons are able to make this vitamin from sun exposure.

 

[Klaudiemo]

Also, he is not dehydrated until you see a lot of orange instead of white on his fecals.

 

[el chamino]

some pics of Ferdinand and his enclosure

we elevated the lights because he loves to climb the ceiling



rare handling because he wanted out of the shower RIGHT NOW!!


Just happy in the sun



All input is welcome, critical or otherwise. He does not seem himself, and I'm not okay with that. Please let me know if any husbandry issues can be improved or changed for the better. If you feel he is sick, or have any questions I haven't answered, please speak up. The closest vet is ~3hrs from here, so I don't really want to take him unless you feel I should. We got him some pumpkin today, thinking he may be a little bound up. Just not real sure what to think right now.
Thank you

 

[Klaudiemo]

If he sleeps during day, something is not right. Chameleons never sleep during day. As I said already, it is likely caused by too much D3. The cage looks really nice though.

 

[el chamino]

I think it might be caused by too much D3. D3 should not be fed to chams everyday. I give d3 to mine chameleons only 2-3 times a month (depending on how much time they spent outside on the sun). If your chameleon spends like 5 days out of 7 outside, you don't have to give D3 to him at all. Chameleons are able to make this vitamin from sun exposure.

If he sleeps during day, something is not right. Chameleons never sleep during day. As I said already, it is likely caused by too much D3. The cage looks really nice though.

Thanks for your response Klaudiemo, but I think you misunderstood what I said:

Supplements - ZooMed calcium w/o D3(daily), alternating ZM cal w/ D3 and Reptivite w/o D3(every 2 weeks).

I give cal w/o D3 Mon-Sat, then Sun I alternate cal w/ D3 one week, Reptivite the next week.

I apologize, I'm not a great communicator, worse when it's text-based, and then it's compounded because I'm worried about the little guy. So I really appreciate you trying to help.

 

[Klaudiemo]

Oh, I'm sorry my fault! I'm not native speaker, so I miss understood what w/o meant. Anyway, I can't seem to find anything else, that would be wrong with the way you care about this little guy. He is really small. It may be parasites. But only vet can confirm that. Are both of his eyes closed or just one? I'm sorry, I can't be more helpful.

 

[kinyonga]

Has he done any more gagging? Did he eat today?
Are the plants at the top all fake?

 

[el chamino]

The top plants are all fake, 1-72 Inch Vine, 2-Exo Terra Large Amapallo Jungle Plant.
I Wasn't able to be around him as much today, but I did see him gagging once( with mouth mostly closed, head down) and tried to get video but I was too slow.He didn't eat anything today, and I caught him with eyes closed a couple times. I took him out for some real sun for 10-15 min, and that seemed to perk him up. We got our MistKing today, hope to have it functional tomorrow.

 

[kinyonga]

Is he able to shoot his tongue out completely?

 

[el chamino]

The last time I saw him eat (yesterday) he was shooting beautifully.
The other day he ate 3-4 little green flies while outside.

 

[kinyonga]

What kind of flies? I wonder if that could be the problem?

 

[el chamino]

I hadn't thought about it until you asked about his shooting, but I think that's around the time he started acting funky. The same day we noticed that it looked like he had eaten some of the Ficus also. I am going to try to ID the flies.

 

[kinyonga]

I hope he will be OK.

 

[el chamino]

Pretty sure they were Long Legged Fly (Dolichopodidae). They eat aphids, mosquito larvae and such.
Eating the Ficus shouldn't be a problem, should it?
Thank you, kinyonga

 

[kinyonga]

I don't know if those flies would be a problem or not.

 

[jajeanpierre]

Also, he is not dehydrated until you see a lot of orange instead of white on his fecals.

You are incorrect. They can be dehydrated well before the urates change color. I've dealt with plenty of dehydrated new imports and have rarely seen an orange urate.

 

[jajeanpierre]

Pretty sure they were Long Legged Fly (Dolichopodidae). They eat aphids, mosquito larvae and such.
Eating the Ficus shouldn't be a problem, should it?
Thank you, kinyonga

Odds are the flies are not the problem.

I've had a few wild caughts that gagged in the way you described. It really bothered me and I was never able to find the reason and all seemed to go on to live normal lives.

Eating the ficus leaf could be a problem. They are very tough and of course, indigestible. They can cause an intestinal blockage.

I would think 1/4" crickets would be a good size for him but if the prey is too big, they won't eat it. I have found dubia to be much heavier than crickets the same size, so he probably won't eat the same number of dubia as crickets. Your cage is so densely planted, it is possible that there are a lot of stool hanging from the branches that you haven't seen.

Last but not least, are you sure you have a male?

 

[el chamino]

Odds are the flies are not the problem.

I've had a few wild caughts that gagged in the way you described. It really bothered me and I was never able to find the reason and all seemed to go on to live normal lives.

Eating the ficus leaf could be a problem. They are very tough and of course, indigestible. They can cause an intestinal blockage.

I would think 1/4" crickets would be a good size for him but if the prey is too big, they won't eat it. I have found dubia to be much heavier than crickets the same size, so he probably won't eat the same number of dubia as crickets. Your cage is so densely planted, it is possible that there are a lot of stool hanging from the branches that you haven't seen.

Last but not least, are you sure you have a male?

I hope the flies are no problem, he sees them and shoots before I know whats going on. I would also hate to keep him from the hunt and variety it adds to his diet.
The gagging is terrible to watch him go through, but thankfully I haven't seen any since yesterday late morning.
Would it be best to remove the Ficus and only use it for outside/showering, where I can try to keep him from munching it?
Most of the dubias we ordered ended up being too large, so we aren't feeding anymore at the moment.
We did find some poo hiding in the foliage, urates are still white, but haven't gone in to get a better look at the poo. Trying to disturb him as little as possible.
He has spurs, just can't get a good pic of them.
Thanks jajeanpierre.

He seems to be keeping his eyes closed more often, and he is not nearly as active as he usually is.
Is it possible that the temp gauge is messed up and he is not getting enough heat? It will vary from 80-85 throughout the day, and I just realized he spends most of his time in the upper part of the enclosure.
I gut loaded some BSFL with pumpkin and am going to see if he will eat some today.
It sucks not knowing whats going on with him, or what to do to help him.

I am trying to get a vet appointment for him with @ferretinmyshoes. I failed to get their office info in a convo several days ago, and I am sure they are busy and haven't been able to respond since I messaged them yesterday. If anyone can reach them by email or something and have them message me, I would greatly appreciate.

 

[el chamino]

He ate 5 BFSL.
Spending more time with eyes closed.



through screen to get his position


opened screen



more and more time like this


what do I need to do/can I do until i can get him to the vet?