i'm a new owner, freaking out & scared!

[aCONCiOUSxMiND]

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - Veiled Chameleon, unaware of the sex, going on three months. it's been in my care for two days
Handling - handled it twice a day.
Feeding - super worms/ meal worms idk. fed it two yesterday. i don't really have a schedule. im unaware of what gut loading means.
Supplements - the original owner didn't give me such things?
Watering - i put ice-cubes at the top of the screen so they can drip onto the leaves inside the cage. i have not misted the cage yet? my chameleon is not drinking unless i can get it to hiss, to where it opens it mouth then i use a syringe to get it to take in some water.
Fecal Description - when i first picked it up, i guess it got scared a went on my finger. but it was somewhat a darkish green/brown. with just a few tiny little droppings. im 100% sure the previous owner didnt run any tests.
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - cube shaped cage, 3 sides are glass, top & front are screen.
Lighting - i just have two regular light bulbs. one is on top of the screen & the other is a lamp without shade.
Temperature - the owner has not given me the thermometer
Humidity - im sure there is no humidity what so ever.
Plants - no just artificial plants & broken tree limbs.
Placement - the cage is in the warmest room in the house, i didnt want to have it in the garage due to the fact that it gets way too hot and there, & without sun out, it gets way too cold.. the cage is about three and a half maybe four feet from the floor.
Location - beeville texas, south central.


I am freaking out, my cousin who has had the chameleon for three months
finally decides that he doesn't have time for it anymore & asked me if i could take care of it, i agreed & had great endeavors for this little one. he gave me his veiled chameleon two nights ago. when i saw the veiled, it was it in critical condition & realized that was the reason it was given to me.. He didnt want to go through with the death of it so he gave it to me.... i looked at plenty things around the web. i came across this page along with many others & came to a conclusion. This Veiled Chameleon has MBD, the previous owner, has the chameleon living throughout the months with no uv lights, fed it with no vitamins, at times, didnt feed it or give it anything to drink for weeks at a time. due to being in jail.. two of it's eyes are looking bad, one doesnt open at all, the other just has enough to where he can barely see.. yesterday, it fell, hissed & started to grab onto it's own legs. i just don't know what to do, i'm real emotional when it comes to things like this. i just feel helpless, i dont have a job & this chameleon needs alot of care that i just cant afford. i dont want it to die, this is so messed up. some one please just let me know that there's still hope, some way some how..

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

Welcome to the forums! Sounds like the little one is in a bad way. It was really good of you to take him or her in. Veileds can be easily sexed by looking at the back of their hind feet. If it's a male there's a little nubbin and it's a female there won't be anything. The first step to trying to save it is to get proper UVB lighting and read up on gutloading. You'll need a calcium powder that does not have d3 or phosphorus to use at every feeding. Can you post a picture? If it is as severe as you think then a vet visit might be needed for rehydration and possible calcium injections and/or antibiotics. You're in the right place now! We'll help you get on the right track.

Here is some more information on MBD: What Metabolic Bone Disease (MBD) looks like, how it happens, and how to fix it

Some info on gutloading:

Gutloading is the process of feeding the insects with the nutrition that your chameleon (or other insectivore pet) needs to use the bugs to deliver the good nutritional content. Supplementing with a calcium and multivitamin powder is important, but not sufficient alone for proper nutrition in any species. In the wild chameleons eat many types of insects that have being eating many types of plants to get a naturally well varied diet rich in vitamins and minerals. Gutloading ingredients should be chosen for being higher in calcium than phosphorus and low in oxalates and goitrogens. High phosphorus levels inhibits calcium absorption. While convenient, most commercially available gutloads (Fluker Farms Cricket Food, Nature Zone Cricket Total Bites, etc) are low in calcium, imbalanced and/or insufficient for good nutrition. Creating a well rounded gutload at home can seem daunting but it can actually be fairly inexpensive and easy to make! Use these brief guidelines to guide your choices of produce when you go to the store. Each time you go get two or three options, then rotate them for something else next time. Make sure you wash all produce to eliminate pesticide residues and cut off the peel of fruits and vegetables as they have waxes and pesticides you can't wash off.

Crickets are a readily available staple food source but need to be properly gutloaded with calcium rich vegetables several hours before being fed to your chameleon as they have minimal nutritional value by themselves. Superworms and dubia roaches can also be easily gutloaded.

Best gutloading ingredients to use because they are highest in calcium, low in phosphorus, oxalates and goitrogens. (These should be the primary components of your gutload): mustard greens, turnip greens, dandelion leaves, collard greens, escarole lettuce, papaya, watercress, alfalfa.

Good gutloading ingredients because they are moderately high in calcium and other vitamins/minerals. Should be used in addition to those from the previous category: sweet potato, carrots, oranges, mango, butternut squash, kale, apples, beet greens, blackberries, bok choy, green beans

These fresh fruits and vegetables can be combined with dry gutload mixes such as Cricket Crack, Dinofuel or home made mixes for optimal well-rounded nutrition. Dry ingredients can include: bee pollen, organic non-salted sunflower seeds, spirulina, dried seaweed, flax seed and organic non-salted almonds, among many others.

Gutloading ingredients to avoid because they are low in calcium, high in phosphorus, goitrogens or oxalates: Potatoes, cabbage, iceberg lettuce, romaine lettuce, spinach, broccoli, kale, tomatoes, corn, grains, beans, oats, bread, cereal, meat, eggs, dog food, cat food, fish food, canned or dead insects, vertebrates.

Vertebrates (pinkies, lizards, etc.) are not a notable part of chameleon's normal diet in the wild and too many animal proteins in the diet of an animal that's not a carnivore can wreak havoc on their kidneys leading to kidney damage and gout due the difference in protein breakdown. Everything your chameleon needs can be obtained through an all-insect diet with good gutloading and supplementation.

This site has nutritional info on many commonly available fruits and veggies to help guide you in choosing good gut loading ingredients: http://www.greenigsociety.org/foodchart.htm

You'll need to limit superworms and waxworms and feed mostly crickets that are gutloaded and calcium dusted for now to maximize nutritional intake. Feed at least 10 a day since it sounds like it's young. Butterworms, hornworms and silkworms are also good feeders.

It sounds like this cham is in need of a lot of new equipment, probable vet costs, and a lot of TLC. If that is going to be too much for you to handle, which would be understandable, then it might be best to find someone with experience you can give this little one to for rehabilitation. There are a lot of cham owners in Texas.

 

[lysinlight87]

I agree with ferritinmyshoes in that it may be better to try and find someone more experienced to help. It can be expensive to get them stuff they need and a baby who hasn't had the best start will most likely need special attention.

Here's a link that gives you a rough idea of everything they need.

https://www.chameleonforums.com/basic-husbandry-38769/

People on here will help where they can. Good luck

 

[aCONCiOUSxMiND]

in a very bad way, i'm no expert but even someone who's completely oblivious
to it's problem would know that it has one. It's a male ferret. as for the lighting, that's my downfall, i have insufficient funds. I've texted a few of my friends & called our local veterinarians; they don't handle anything in this category. i'd have to drive to distant city, which is out of my way.. how much does that calcium powder go for, do you think they would have it at walmart along with crickets?... i would feel a hundred times better if i knew someone, with the experience or knowledge so i could get it in better hands. i feel just as helpless as the cham. also as you will tell in the pics below, both eyes are now completely shut, but he still manages to get from spot to spot; this is so damn depressing:/

 

[aCONCiOUSxMiND]

& here is the last picture. as you can tell he changed his color immediately after
i rubbed him to see if he was still alive.

 

[lysinlight87]

o poorly boy I wouldn't know how to advise you on his care.

Some people start a new thread appealing to anyone local to them who could help, you could try that? but yea, he's in a bad way

 

[Djturna4thakidz]

Yeah he is in bad shape. Looks like he has MBD and is very dehydrated. Getting him to drink something is probably a high priority. I will let someone like ferret get back in here to help you out tho. Sorry you had to deal with such a sick little guy. The forums will help immensly.

 

[aCONCiOUSxMiND]

lysinlight, i don't know where to begin with that or what to say. where should i post that at? i'm still new to all of this, sorry.

Djturna, i know it's very bad & he looks very dehydrated. im just scared about everything. doesn't tap water have fluoride in it? won't that do more harm? i know there's plenty of hazardous chemicals in the water

 

[carol5208]

poor little fellow or girl. How sad this is for someone to let him get like this. Tap water is ok, but really depends on where you live. I use tap. Try taking an eye dripper and keep dripping it on his nose. That will hopefully stimulate him to drink. Check back of back heels for little nub. If no nub, then you have a female.

 

[lysinlight87]

lysinlight, i don't know where to begin with that or what to say. where should i post that at? i'm still new to all of this, sorry.

I'd post it in 'general discussions' and state the situation as you have here- that essentially you've rescued a sick baby cham, you're inexperienced & can anyone in your particular area help & maybe include your general area in the title of the thread. *You could include a link to this thread to save repeating yourself.

It's a long shot to be honest, cos he is in such a bad way & so tiny...but at least you will know you've tried. I had a sick tree snake & appealed for someone experienced to take him, unfortunately he died before that could happened, but I felt better for trying, know what I mean?

I hope I'm giving you some sort of helpful advice, but I still relatively new myself, so just throwing suggestions out there.

 

[Djturna4thakidz]

I use tap water too! drip some water on the nose and see if he will drink. good luck

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

The first thing I would do for him is a shower session.

Place a plant on a stool or even on the bottom of the shower. Turn on the shower so that it is warm water, not hot. Angle the shower head to aim it at the wall, not the plant. This should create a fine mist that hits the plant gently, rather than the high power water stream. This will also cause water to form droplets on the plant's leaves. Try to leave a small area of the plant outside the fine mist radius so it stays more dry. Once you have the fine mist falling over most of the plant you can place your chameleon on the edge of the mist area. The falling mist, high humidity and beading of the water on the plants is often very successful at stimulating chameleons to start drinking. They may drink by lapping up the droplets or licking at the mist in the air for 30 minutes or more!

Always supervise your chameleon closely during shower sessions because if they fall they could hurt themselves or drown. But try to stay out of their line of sight if possible so that they are not stressed by your appearance and stop drinking prematurely. Shower sessions can be done regularly (once or twice daily) to rehydrate particularly dried out or stubborn chameleons.

Right now in Texas temperatures are pretty good so you can get him in real sunshine. He needs UVB and real unfiltered sunlight is the best for stimulating vitamin D synthesis and improving attitude and appetite. But unless you can have him outside (not in a glass cage) for 5-8 hours every day you must have a UVB bulb. These are available at pet stores like petco, or petsmart for around $20. You need a Reptiglo 5.0 or Reptisun 5.0 (avoid Zilla brand). They won't be at walmart, and neither will calcium powder. These are essentials, especially right now when he is in desperate need of them. If you are unable to provide them then unfortunately he is only going to continue to waste away and eventually die. He is also going to be in need of a new cage ($80 easily) in just a few months. You obviously want what is best for the poor little guy, and it sounds like anything would be an improvement over his last home, but if you won't be able to provide what he needs I would strongly encourage trying to find him a new home now before he gets any worse. Not everyone can provide the complicated needs of a reptile like a chameleon, and sometimes you just can't help that. We understand how that goes. If you think you can get him what he needs though, we'll be happy to help you further.

At the very least, until you figure out if you can keep him or not, you can give him a shower session for hydration, and get him some crickets from a petstore or bait store and start feeding them high calcium greens like collard greens, mustard greens, turnip greens, or dandelions.

 

[aCONCiOUSxMiND]

carol, you could imagine how i feel about it. i mean it's alive, it must be able to feel just like us. it's just so damn stressing.

i took him out for a bit, tried to get him to open his mouth for some water and nothing. i figured since he's cold blooded i could run some warm water on him, that was a success. i read on a forum somewhere else that chameleons have vents somewhere amongst their body. he seemed to enjoy that, he turned bright green immediately. i ran some water over his eyes, one opened up slightly but still small. i noticed that behind it's right eye, around the area that there was a goo or some sort of release. it was coming from under it's eyelid. hard to explain. but i took a few more pics, hopefully to put you all in a better mood as well

 

[aCONCiOUSxMiND]

ferret, that's almost impossible. he's pretty much blind, when he walks he reaches around everywhere. he also does not open his mouth unless i touch him on his back a certain way, then he hisses, inflates then deflates his stomach & thing under his mouth. but that's within 3 seconds, its hard to drop water into his mouth. he hasn't eaten today either, i try to hand feed him with a super worm (that's the only meal i have for him). as for the 5-8 hours a day, i can do that. i mean im unemployed so i have plenty of time on my hands. it's been kind of breezy these past few days, is that a problem?

im trying everything as you can see, this chameleon didn't deserve this & i'm grateful for every bit of advice. thank you all.

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

Even though he can't see he can still benefit from a shower session. The humidity and moisture will also help flush out his eyes, which it sounds like he needs. If there is pus coming from his eye then he will definitely need to go to a vet and most likely be on antibiotics. I would still shower him for sure with a nice wide plant on the floor and just keep a close eye on him to make sure he doesn't fall.

 

[justjumpit621]

ferret, that's almost impossible. he's pretty much blind, when he walks he reaches around everywhere. he also does not open his mouth unless i touch him on his back a certain way, then he hisses, inflates then deflates his stomach & thing under his mouth. but that's within 3 seconds, its hard to drop water into his mouth. he hasn't eaten today either, i try to hand feed him with a super worm (that's the only meal i have for him). as for the 5-8 hours a day, i can do that. i mean im unemployed so i have plenty of time on my hands. it's been kind of breezy these past few days, is that a problem?

im trying everything as you can see, this chameleon didn't deserve this & i'm grateful for every bit of advice. thank you all.

It is possible for you to shower him. If he is on plant he should feel more comfortable and relax. I had one a lot Like this before. Also try to get a feeder in his mouth when he hisses at you becau he is very skinny. This way until you find someone experienced to take Jim you can try to keep him alive. If you can, get some Phoenix worms, also called calciworms, to give him.

 

[lisagr07]

Where are you located? Is there no one in hour area that can help you and him?????
Poor, poor soul..... .

 

[aCONCiOUSxMiND]

i tried that ferret & he seems to like it. he tried to open his mouth for some, but he closed it almost immediately after. i also tried to feed him, first by hand then i let the worm roam around in front of him; nothing.

Lisa, i'm in beeville texas & i've called both of the vets,
both of them referred me to a vet in another city but it's out of my way.
im just so full of mixed emotions! my friends were over & only one seemed to care while the other laughed at it. says i might as well just put it out of it's misery since there's only so much i can do. but i can't that isn't right, i want to believe that there's still hope. i mean it's been this long, but then again just knowing that just doesn't justify a thing.

 

[SarahcoadunatioZac]

Well I'd let a vet decide that, and let it go out humanely (being put to sleep).

Definitely find someone to rescue him, if you can't give it the proper care.

 

[PenelopeLove]

Find a vet who can help you - quickly!
I am in a similar situation (although luckily, no signs of MDB as yet) and I took my little girl to the vet... honestly, she looks very similar weight wise, but she is a few months older and was not looked after properly at all before I got her..
For the next week she's on 2 types of injections and 2 oral meds, but it's not as scary as it sounds and the vet can show you how to do it or they can give her the shots if you take her to them each day

This is the right place for you! Everyone one here can help you out.. they've been life savers for me!!!