I'm worried about my colleagues' chameleon that resides in our office.

[Silvermine]

Hello everyone,

I hope this is the correct subforum for this thread. As stated in the title, I'm not the primary carer for this chameleon, but I am very much concerned about his welfare and happiness. This chameleon lives in his terrarium in my office space. I help with his welfare and sometimes interact with him, but I feel very uncomfortable with this situation so I tend to keep my distance.

I will first answer the list of required information for help requests and then provide some additional context that I deem relevant. Two people are responsible for and invested in his care, so the answers relate to his overall care, not my contributions specifically. Apologies in advance for any wrong or confusing details, I have no experience with reptiles beyond a general idea of what (all) animals need to thrive. Some information may also be wrong as I haven't asked some of these questions explicitly and are based off of my observations.

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon- The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
  • Veiled chameleon, male, unknown. He was quite small when he was brought here approx. 18 months ago.
• Handling- How often do you handle your chameleon?
  • On average probably less than once a day, given that he is left alone in the weekends.
• Feeding- What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
  • He is fed live crickets, as far as I know the amount is only estimated and the schedule seems quite random. I don't know if the crickets are gut-loaded. He finds catching crickets difficult, so he is sometimes fed by placing a few crickets in a cup/mug so that he can easily bite and eat them.
• Supplements- What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
  • Unknown, I would guess no additional nutrients are provided.
• Watering- What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
  • There is a smal water "bowl" in the cage. I haven't really noticed chameleon drinking, but that may also just be because I don't typically face that side of the room when working.
• Fecal Description- Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
  • I have tried to observe his faeces but I haven't been able to identify any very recent droppings. He has never been to the vet to my knowledge.
• History- Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.
  • As you can see from the photos, he has an abrasion on his bottom lip that to me looks like a healed burn.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type- Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
  • Glass with a rocky backdrop. 75cm tall, 50cm wide, 50cm deep. Before this, he was living in a much smaller cage (probably 1/6th the volume of the new one) for 6+ months.
• Lighting- What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
  • Two lightbulbs, one is a Reptile UVB150, the other unknown. They are on constantly, and turn off automatically (based on what is shown on the timer, from 20:00 to 06:00).
• Temperature- What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
  • Temperature is not measured, there is no meter installed. I would guess the temperatures typically don't drop terribly low as the room is quite well insulated. In the winter the heating is turned off however, and outside temperatures drop below 0C often.
• Humidity- What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
  • Humidity is likewise not measured as far as I know. A spray bottle is used to increase humidity. I feel that this is also done randomly, and is done for a few minutes when the terrarium seems dry (or before the weekend/holidays).
• Plants- Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
  • There are live plants in the cage, unfortunately I don't know the species. I hope they're discernible from the photos.
• Placement- Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
  • The terrarium is on an office desk on a wooden surface. It is in a relatively calm location, close to two large windows that face west. The top of the cage is around 1.5m above the floor.
• Location- Where are you geographically located?
  • Central Europe.

Some other relevant information is that he was bought at a reptile fair from a breeder, and that (in my opinion) the level of interaction and involvement by the people responsible for his care is quite low. There is another plant in the office on the windowsill, so when it's sunny or he seems very agitated, someone will take him out of the cage and moved to that plant so he can bask or relax a bit. The office room is very tall and quite large, and he can climb quite quickly, so (maybe understandably) he is kept in the cage most of the day. It was implied above, but I feel I should re-state the fact that the chameleon is left completely alone in his cage for dozens of 24-hour periods per year (most weekends and many holidays). No matter what species the pet is, this seems to me to indicate a lack of effort and interest in the animal's wellbeing.

I want to raise this issue with the chameleon's carers, but given that I lack experience and knowledge, I thought I should find a digital space where I could get some expert opinions regarding this specific case so that I am more informed before saying anything. I will of course also consult with vets that specialise in exotic pets/reptiles.

I have attached some photos; I've blacked out anything visible that is outside/surrounding the cage for privacy reasons. As I previously mentioned, I know nothing about keeping reptiles as pets, and have never had one myself. I've done some basic research to get better informed regarding this situation, and at this point my opinion is that the bare minimum is being done to keep the chameleon alive and functioning, but there seems to be a lot of things that are severely lacking in the care provided to this reptile. As someone that believes all animals under human care should be treated with respect and deserve a happy and full life, I find the bare minimum completely unacceptable. Would this be a fair assessment, or am I exaggerating?

EDIT: Improved some answers and fixed some typos.

 

[MissSkittles]

Hi and welcome. Wow! There’s a lot to digest here. From what I can see and what you say, this poor guy is most definitely lacking appropriate care. We can help and tell you what changes are needed to provide much better and correct care, but how are you going to enact those changes if he is not yours? Will the owners listen to you? Do they care enough about the animal to want him to be healthy and content? I’ll go thru all of your info and make suggestions - it will take me a bit of time.

 

[Silvermine]

Hi and welcome. Wow! There’s a lot to digest here. From what I can see and what you say, this poor guy is most definitely lacking appropriate care. We can help and tell you what changes are needed to provide much better and correct care, but how are you going to enact those changes if he is not yours? Will the owners listen to you? Do they care enough about the animal to want him to be healthy and content? I’ll go thru all of your info and make suggestions - it will take me a bit of time.

Hi, thanks for replying so quickly. I can't answer your questions regarding the owners with any degree of confidence, but I will definitely be showing them this thread, so any advice and information you are able to provide will not be a waste of time I hope. And it goes without saying that if there are any simple/easy changes that can be done that will improve the chameleon's wellbeing, I can make them myself.

 

[Gloriawood]

Hi, thanks for replying so quickly. I can't answer your questions regarding the owners with any degree of confidence, but I will definitely be showing them this thread, so any advice and information you are able to provide will not be a waste of time I hope. And it goes without saying that if there are any simple/easy changes that can be done that will improve the chameleon's wellbeing, I can make them myself.

You are in great hands here! Im somewhat new so I don’t want to really give any advice as I am still learning. I just wanted to say welcome what’s his name?

 

[MissSkittles]

My feedback will be in bold and I’m breaking this into two parts since I talk a lot.
Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon- The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
  • Veiled chameleon, male, unknown. He was quite small when he was brought here approx. 18 months ago.
• Handling- How often do you handle your chameleon?
  • On average probably less than once a day, given that he is left alone in the weekends.
• Feeding- What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
  • He is fed live crickets, as far as I know the amount is only estimated and the schedule seems quite random. I don't know if the crickets are gut-loaded. For a full grown adult veiled, he should be getting at least 3-4 feeders every other day. Like us, they need and appreciate variety in their diet. Just as important as what we feed them, it’s equally important what we feed to their feeder insects. A healthy insect is much more nutritious. Attaching some graphics below.
• Supplements- What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
  • Unknown, I would guess no additional nutrients are provided. Supplements are essential to health for a captive and indoor chameleon. He should be getting a phosphorus free calcium without D3 lightly dusted at every feeding. I’m not sure what is available to you, but the easiest for providing D3 and multivitamins is to use either Repashy calcium plus LoD or Reptivite with D3 lightly dusted at one feeding every other week. If you can’t obtain one of these products, the alternate is to alternate one feeding every week with a calcium with D3 and a multivitamin, so that each one is given once every other week.
• Watering- What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
  • A spray bottle is used. I feel that this is also quite random, and is done for a few minutes when the terrarrium seems dry (or before the weekend/holidays). I haven't noticed the chameleon drinking after misting. There are automatic misting systems which might be the best option for busy people. Using spray is correct and it should be done for at least 2 minutes, twice a day - right before lights go on and off. If needed, an additional minute of misting or using a dripper for 15-20 minutes at mid day is optional.
• Fecal Description- Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
  • I have tried to observe his feces but I haven't been able to identify any very recent droppings. He has never been to the vet to my knowledge. A veterinary wellness visit and having a fecal check should be done for all animals we bring into our care. Ideally, the urate (light part of the poo) isn’t dark or orange as that would indicate dehydration. A healthy urate is mostly white or cream colored with maybe a small bit of yellow or light orange at one end. Of course a healthy poo is a compact brown pellet or little log.
• History- Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.
  • As you can see from the photos, he has an abrasion on his bottom lip that to me looks like a healed burn, but could also be an abrasion. I’m not sure either what type of injury that is, but ideally a small dab of silver sulfadiazine (prescription only) or over the counter antibiotic cream (without pain relief) would be applied daily until healed. He finds catching crickets difficult, so he is sometimes fed by placing a few crickets in a cup/mug so that he can easily bite and eat them. A healthy chameleon shouldn’t have any difficulty catching food. With the lack of proper supplements and uvb (more to come on that), that is to be expected. I’m honestly surprised that he doesn’t have severe metabolic bone disease or at least it isn’t showing.
    More to come….
• 
  

 

[MissSkittles]

Sorry…had a small distraction.
Cage Info:

• Cage Type- Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
  • Glass with a rocky backdrop. 75cm tall, 50cm wide, 50cm deep. This is much too small. An adult should be in no smaller than 60x60x120 cm. I kept my males in double that and they used every bit of the space. Before this, he was living in a much smaller cage (probably 1/6th the volume of the new one) for 6+ months.
• Lighting- What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
  • Two lightbulbs, one is a Reptile UVB150, the other unknown. The other one is probably some sort of basking bulb and that is ok. The uvb is the problem. In order to get any uvb he needs to be within just a few cm of the light and that poses a high risk for burns. The standard is a linear T5HO with either a 5.0 or 6% uvb bulb. The Arcadia Pro T5 with a 6% bulb is perfect and I would think would be available in most of Europe. Then the basking branch and should be about 20-22 cm below the uvb light.They are on constantly, and turn off automatically (based on what is shown on the timer, from 20:00 to 06:00). Ideal is a 12 hour on/off schedule. Most of us use timers. Chameleons need total darkness at night.
• Temperature- What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
  • Temperature is not measured, there is no meter installed. I would guess the temperatures typically don't drop terribly low as the room is quite well insulated. In the winter the heating is turned off however, and outside temperatures drop below 0C often. Temperature is essential for reptiles as they are cold blooded and need heat provided to them. The ideal temperature at basking spot would be around 29c with natural gradients lower in the enclosure.
• Humidity- What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
  • Humidity is likewise not measured as far as I know. A spray bottle is used to increase humidity. I feel that this is also done randomly, and is done for a few minutes when the terrarium seems dry (or before the weekend/holidays). This too is important for hydration, shedding and general health. The ideal for a veiled during the daytime is between 30-50%. At night if the temperature drops to at least 20c, a cool mist humidifier can be used for a few hours during the night to simulate the natural hydration gotten in the wild thru fog. You do not want high humidity while the temperature is above 20 - heat plus high humidity increases the risks for respiratory infection. This is especially so with the poor air circulation of his current enclosure.
• Plants- Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
  • There are live plants in the cage, unfortunately I don't know the species. I hope they're discernible from the photos. Veiled chameleons like to nibble their plants, so it’s important that they be clean, safe and live. Pothos (devil’s ivy) is always one of the best and easiest plants for chameleons. There is a list here, but some will need a special plant grow light. https://chameleonacademy.com/plants/
• Placement- Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
  • The terrarium is on an office desk on a wooden surface. It is in a relatively calm location, close to two large windows that face west. The top of the cage is around 1.5m above the floor. This sounds ok as long as the sun doesn’t shine in on his enclosure and heat him up. They are curious and enjoy window views as much as we do. Being arboreal, height is safety for them.
• Location- Where are you geographically located?
  • Central Europe.
  • There’s so much bad information out there on how to keep chameleons and it’s hard to know what is right or wrong. The best source for correct and current care standards is https://chameleonacademy.com/chameleon-basics/ Of course we here are also a great source and are always happy to help out, answer questions and just share our love and passion for these beautiful and amazing animals and how to care for them.
    I don’t know what kind of office you have - if you have clients coming in or not, but the current set up your poor guy is in is very sad looking. Even if it is just employees, it is not a happy thing to look at. If you look around thru the forum, you’ll find some examples of beautiful enclosures. Mine aren’t so beautiful, but they do provide what my animals need. Here’s an example of one I set up a while ago. I’ve got the basking light, uvb and an additional plant light on the top. You can see the mist heads in the back of my automatic mister. The product I used to attach my branches and plants is not available in Europe, but some have made their own versions. This is what they are. https://dragonstrand.com/dragon-ledges/ I have lots of branches and vines for my chameleon to travel on. Lots of plants for him to drink from, hide in, sleep in and otherwise enjoy. I used empty plant pots turned upside down to raise some of the plants on the bottom. I did have a simple drainage system for excess water (hole in the bottom with a bucket beneath), but really with so many plants packed in there, drainage wasn’t much of a concern.
    I do hope you’ll be able to encourage the office chameleons people to make some positive changes as I’ve suggested. The reward will be not only a happy or content animal, but a healthy one that will live much longer. I’m not a veterinarian so I can’t diagnose anything, but I’d bet that the poor guy has some serious health problems.
    We are always here and willing to help. Ask as many questions as needed and if you can send the owners here, that would be great.
    
    

 

[Beman]

Just my two cents... There is a lot lacking with the environment. But I am also seeing health issues. Little man has prior thermal burn on the top of his casque which is why it is miss shaped and not shedding easily. Also there looks to be an abscess or wound at the front of the mouth below the lower lip. This requires vet treatment from a vet that knows reptiles. It may be due to him rubbing on the glass or even a small thermal burn that has now become infected. With the lighting being inside like that thermal burns will continue to happen. And the UVB lighting is incorrect.

I would have your office colleague take a look at this thread. @MissSkittles has already given you great information.

This is another trusted site for learning correct husbandry https://chameleonacademy.com/chameleon-husbandry-program-getting-started-with-chameleons/ The owner can read through that and ask questions here.

 

[MissSkittles]

Your story reminds me of one of the forum members who has really been an inspiration to me. They are a young person who was temporarily caring for their class chameleon and were very concerned about it’s poor care and came here to learn how they could help it. It took a while but they were eventually able to be given the chameleon and it has totally thrived in their care and has become a healthy and beautiful animal.

 

[Ghostbirb]

Your story reminds me of one of the forum members who has really been an inspiration to me. They are a young person who was temporarily caring for their class chameleon and were very concerned about it’s poor care and came here to learn how they could help it. It took a while but they were eventually able to be given the chameleon and it has totally thrived in their care and has become a healthy and beautiful animal.

Aw don’t make me blush .

Hi, thanks for replying so quickly. I can't answer your questions regarding the owners with any degree of confidence, but I will definitely be showing them this thread, so any advice and information you are able to provide will not be a waste of time I hope. And it goes without saying that if there are any simple/easy changes that can be done that will improve the chameleon's wellbeing, I can make them myself.

I with you luck with your colleagues chameleon! No matter what way this goes with care, remember u did your best by reaching out and trying to help the little guys situation.

 

[Multivitamins]

I just want to echo the lighting issue. Thermal burns are very possible and likely since the bulbs are directly inside of the enclosure. Hope that this is taken as help and that the office / co workers don't take it personally that there is a lot of room for improvement

 

[Silvermine]

My feedback will be in bold and I’m breaking this into two parts since I talk a lot.

Thanks a lot of breaking it down in so much detail and adding links. I will definitely pass along all this information, your writeup won't go to waste. I'm also worried about his health. I guess the easiest thing to do at the moment would be to improve the living environment by adding branches and the appropriate plants.

Just my two cents... There is a lot lacking with the environment. But I am also seeing health issues. Little man has prior thermal burn on the top of his casque which is why it is miss shaped and not shedding easily. Also there looks to be an abscess or wound at the front of the mouth below the lower lip. This requires vet treatment from a vet that knows reptiles. It may be due to him rubbing on the glass or even a small thermal burn that has now become infected. With the lighting being inside like that thermal burns will continue to happen. And the UVB lighting is incorrect.

I would have your office colleague take a look at this thread. @MissSkittles has already given you great information.

This is another trusted site for learning correct husbandry https://chameleonacademy.com/chameleon-husbandry-program-getting-started-with-chameleons/ The owner can read through that and ask questions here.

Thanks, that is a great resource that I can also pass on.

Hope that this is taken as help and that the office / co workers don't take it personally that there is a lot of room for improvement

That is my hope as well.



Sorry for replying so late everyone, and I really appreciate all the information and comments! Unfortunately, it seems like a lot of my concerns were justified. I will try to pass on this information as constructive critisim.

 

[MissSkittles]

It’s always my pleasure to be of some assistance to others. I hope your colleagues will see that your concerns come from a positive place of caring and take your information to heart. Do keep us posted on how things work out.

 

[nightanole]

My opinion:

Technically that CFL could work, if its lowered into the cage more so that he can get within a few inches of it for UVB. But those bulbs are meant for short fishtank style cages for anoles and geckos, not several foot tall chameleon cages. Odds are the only reason he looks good now is due to the D3 in his powder.

As for the cage setup, since he is in the office, you should not be able to see him from two sides. So you need much more plants so he can hide in them. They can be real or fake. Also keep in mind that he may much on leaves. So a big plant may end up very tasty.

 

[Gloriawood]

It’s always my pleasure to be of some assistance to others. I hope your colleagues will see that your concerns come from a positive place of caring and take your information to heart. Do keep us posted on how things work out.

@MissSkittles i know it was mentioned with Spaghetti that the warp in his casque was from MBD. I noticed this guys casque is a bit wonky too….is this something they should be concerned about?

 

[MissSkittles]

@MissSkittles i know it was mentioned with Spaghetti that the warp in his casque was from MBD. I noticed this guys casque is a bit wonky too….is this something they should be concerned about?

Could be some mbd since he hasn’t had correct lighting or care.

 

[Gingero]

I think it’s wonderful you are reaching out and making an effort for this chameleon. That takes a lot of courage to do that. You’ve gotten some amazing advice and resources. I know some people learn better from videos so I thought it’d be worthwhile to share this veiled chameleon care guide video that covers the basics in case you and your colleague find it helpful.

 

[Matt_W]

 

[Silvermine]

It’s always my pleasure to be of some assistance to others. I hope your colleagues will see that your concerns come from a positive place of caring and take your information to heart. Do keep us posted on how things work out.

Thanks again, I definitely will!

My opinion:

Technically that CFL could work, if its lowered into the cage more so that he can get within a few inches of it for UVB. But those bulbs are meant for short fishtank style cages for anoles and geckos, not several foot tall chameleon cages. Odds are the only reason he looks good now is due to the D3 in his powder.

As for the cage setup, since he is in the office, you should not be able to see him from two sides. So you need much more plants so he can hide in them. They can be real or fake. Also keep in mind that he may much on leaves. So a big plant may end up very tasty.

I see, that makes sense. Thanks.

 

[Autisticlee]

Sorry…had a small distraction.
Cage Info:

• Cage Type- Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
  • Glass with a rocky backdrop. 75cm tall, 50cm wide, 50cm deep. This is much too small. An adult should be in no smaller than 60x60x120 cm. I kept my males in double that and they used every bit of the space. Before this, he was living in a much smaller cage (probably 1/6th the volume of the new one) for 6+ months.
• Lighting- What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
  • Two lightbulbs, one is a Reptile UVB150, the other unknown. The other one is probably some sort of basking bulb and that is ok. The uvb is the problem. In order to get any uvb he needs to be within just a few cm of the light and that poses a high risk for burns. The standard is a linear T5HO with either a 5.0 or 6% uvb bulb. The Arcadia Pro T5 with a 6% bulb is perfect and I would think would be available in most of Europe. Then the basking branch and should be about 20-22 cm below the uvb light.They are on constantly, and turn off automatically (based on what is shown on the timer, from 20:00 to 06:00). Ideal is a 12 hour on/off schedule. Most of us use timers. Chameleons need total darkness at night.
• Temperature- What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
  • Temperature is not measured, there is no meter installed. I would guess the temperatures typically don't drop terribly low as the room is quite well insulated. In the winter the heating is turned off however, and outside temperatures drop below 0C often. Temperature is essential for reptiles as they are cold blooded and need heat provided to them. The ideal temperature at basking spot would be around 29c with natural gradients lower in the enclosure.
• Humidity- What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
  • Humidity is likewise not measured as far as I know. A spray bottle is used to increase humidity. I feel that this is also done randomly, and is done for a few minutes when the terrarium seems dry (or before the weekend/holidays). This too is important for hydration, shedding and general health. The ideal for a veiled during the daytime is between 30-50%. At night if the temperature drops to at least 20c, a cool mist humidifier can be used for a few hours during the night to simulate the natural hydration gotten in the wild thru fog. You do not want high humidity while the temperature is above 20 - heat plus high humidity increases the risks for respiratory infection. This is especially so with the poor air circulation of his current enclosure.
• Plants- Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
  • There are live plants in the cage, unfortunately I don't know the species. I hope they're discernible from the photos. Veiled chameleons like to nibble their plants, so it’s important that they be clean, safe and live. Pothos (devil’s ivy) is always one of the best and easiest plants for chameleons. There is a list here, but some will need a special plant grow light. https://chameleonacademy.com/plants/
• Placement- Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
  • The terrarium is on an office desk on a wooden surface. It is in a relatively calm location, close to two large windows that face west. The top of the cage is around 1.5m above the floor. This sounds ok as long as the sun doesn’t shine in on his enclosure and heat him up. They are curious and enjoy window views as much as we do. Being arboreal, height is safety for them.
• Location- Where are you geographically located?
  • Central Europe.
  • There’s so much bad information out there on how to keep chameleons and it’s hard to know what is right or wrong. The best source for correct and current care standards is https://chameleonacademy.com/chameleon-basics/ Of course we here are also a great source and are always happy to help out, answer questions and just share our love and passion for these beautiful and amazing animals and how to care for them.
    I don’t know what kind of office you have - if you have clients coming in or not, but the current set up your poor guy is in is very sad looking. Even if it is just employees, it is not a happy thing to look at. If you look around thru the forum, you’ll find some examples of beautiful enclosures. Mine aren’t so beautiful, but they do provide what my animals need. Here’s an example of one I set up a while ago. I’ve got the basking light, uvb and an additional plant light on the top. You can see the mist heads in the back of my automatic mister. The product I used to attach my branches and plants is not available in Europe, but some have made their own versions. This is what they are. https://dragonstrand.com/dragon-ledges/ I have lots of branches and vines for my chameleon to travel on. Lots of plants for him to drink from, hide in, sleep in and otherwise enjoy. I used empty plant pots turned upside down to raise some of the plants on the bottom. I did have a simple drainage system for excess water (hole in the bottom with a bucket beneath), but really with so many plants packed in there, drainage wasn’t much of a concern.
    I do hope you’ll be able to encourage the office chameleons people to make some positive changes as I’ve suggested. The reward will be not only a happy or content animal, but a healthy one that will live much longer. I’m not a veterinarian so I can’t diagnose anything, but I’d bet that the poor guy has some serious health problems.
    We are always here and willing to help. Ask as many questions as needed and if you can send the owners here, that would be great.
    View attachment 338953

Thank you for giving your time to this post miss skittles

 

[MissSkittles]

Thank you for giving your time to this post miss skittles

You’re very welcome. How is the chameleon doing?