Keeping panther with burmese star tortoises?

[44937]

Hello I have a question for the experienced members on this forum.
I'm a newbie to this forum and chams but not a stranger to reptiles. I currently keeping hermanns tortoises and burmese star tortoises.
The two species are in separate enclosures as their requirements are quite different.
My burmese stars are in a 6 long x 4 wide x 3.5 high. The substrate is 6 inches of bark mulch that has a lively variety of superworms, adult beetles, centipedes, pull bugs as my eco balancing system. I have 3 burmese torts wondering around this enclosure and obviously only on the ground. There are boston ferns, hibiscus and few other Tropical plants in the enclosure. One reptisun 10.0 and another 6500k hot5 for lights. Sprinklers turn on for 1 min 3x per day keeping humidity around 80-90%. Heat is supplied by oil filled radiant heater at 89F during the day and 80F at nights.
So I think you can guess where I'm going with this in the purpose of this thread. Is this compatible with chameleons? I'm leaning towards Panthers but open to other suggestions based on the temps. I was getting an excess number of beetles from the superworms which got me thinking of a compatible pet that could help control the beetles.
I would have to modify the setup slightly by enclosing the heater with mesh and covering the t5 bulbs and fans with mesh as well.
For those unfamiliar with burmese star tortoises, they are peaceful and not aggressive at all.
Thoughts? Suggestions? Chameleons species recommendations bases on my temp? Is that environment too warm for chameleons?
Here's a picture of my enclosure when I first built it. It has grown in quite a bit with more plants inside now.

 

[Carlton]

Hello I have a question for the experienced members on this forum.
I'm a newbie to this forum and chams but not a stranger to reptiles. I currently keeping hermanns tortoises and burmese star tortoises.
The two species are in separate enclosures as their requirements are quite different.
My burmese stars are in a 6 long x 4 wide x 3.5 high. The substrate is 6 inches of bark mulch that has a lively variety of superworms, adult beetles, centipedes, pull bugs as my eco balancing system. I have 3 burmese torts wondering around this enclosure and obviously only on the ground. There are boston ferns, hibiscus and few other Tropical plants in the enclosure. One reptisun 10.0 and another 6500k hot5 for lights. Sprinklers turn on for 1 min 3x per day keeping humidity around 80-90%. Heat is supplied by oil filled radiant heater at 89F during the day and 80F at nights.
So I think you can guess where I'm going with this in the purpose of this thread. Is this compatible with chameleons? I'm leaning towards Panthers but open to other suggestions based on the temps. I was getting an excess number of beetles from the superworms which got me thinking of a compatible pet that could help control the beetles.
I would have to modify the setup slightly by enclosing the heater with mesh and covering the t5 bulbs and fans with mesh as well.
For those unfamiliar with burmese star tortoises, they are peaceful and not aggressive at all.
Thoughts? Suggestions? Chameleons species recommendations bases on my temp? Is that environment too warm for chameleons?
Here's a picture of my enclosure when I first built it. It has grown in quite a bit with more plants inside now.

There are several concerns with this setup:

Humidity is quite high for most cham species; chams do better with a fluctuating humidity. Arboreal habitats they use don't have a constantly high humidity situation. Your nighttime temps would be too high and I suspect the daytime temps as well. Again, a matter of not varying enough day to day through a 24 hour cycle. The cham would need a cooler place to retreat to at night, a minimum of 10-15 degree drops. Not enough vertical space. Chams want height to feel secure. One might not feel as if it could stay far enough away from the tortoise activity and there may not be enough of a temp/humidity stratification for one to do well. The substrate may be a problem. If the cham is hunting prey down at the substrate level it could easily pick up bits of bark on it's tongue and ingest it. A known possibility of intestinal impaction. A diet of beetles may make them more prone to impaction too. Too much tough chitin. Then there are the more classic concerns with mixing species that don't normally encounter each other's bacteria or parasites (not saying your torts have them, but both species can introduce types that the other may not have resistance to.)

 

[Remkon]

Years ago I've read up about combining turtles with lizards as I wanted to use the ground space of my iguana enclosure.
Conclusion of my research was that most turtles can carry parasites (Entamoeba invadens) which could be harmful to your lizards.
Only red-footed turtles and boxturtles would be a safe combination.
(Keep in mind I researched this over 10years ago. )

I don't think it would be stressful for the chameleon to share habitat with turtles as they don't usually invade eachother's space but you should be prepared to split em up if it doesn't work out.

By the way, I didn't get those turtles as they could take a nibble out of the iguanas tail.

 

[JapSolum]

I wouldn't put a cham in that enclosure. that humidity is pretty high (might be ok for some species). but main problems would come from height, and from what I can tell ventilation. chams like to be higher up and for most adults you would want at least 4 foot if not more. especially if they're sharing an enclosure (which I dont know how much they would like that anyway) you would want to give him more vertical space to hang out by himself. also they need a very ventilated cage. your setup might be hiding something I'm not seeing, but if it's glass and wood on all sides, with no way for fresh air to circulate your cham would probably end up with a respiratory infection.

 

[jamest0o0]

IMO for mixing species to even be considered, they should come from the same region. John courtney smith on CBP gave an example of possibly mixing a Madagascan burrowing toad with a chameleon of that region, given a lot of space, substrate, etc is provided.

 

[44937]

Ok good to know and hear from you all. Sounds like the environment will be too warm and humid for chameleons.
Are there any rainforest chameleons species that will trive in that environment? That tropical environment is common in many parts of the world.

In addition I could turn down the temps and humidity slightly if needed. What should the max day and night temps be ?
For ventilation there are fans with air circulation and live plants for o2 production.
As far as the height concerns raised, I assume the 6 inches difference between 42 and 48 inches is significant enough to stress the chameleons?
The substrate getting ingested with the foods is definitely an issue. So is the issue of introducing diseases of two species from different parts of the world.
Thanks for all your inputs

 

[JapSolum]

even if temps and humidity were changed, or found a breed capable of withstanding it. I wouldn't mix them. 4' is usually a minimum and if you add a tortoise moving around the bottom they would probably want at least another foot on top of that to make them feel safe. and with the fact that you have a heater in there I would guess it's a pretty even temp throughout the enclosure. chams like warmer on top created by lights, and cooler towards the bottom. which would be a problem for the tortoise. that on top of the other issues like parasites and substrate. I would not suggest putting a chameleon in there. if you're interested in one, it seems like you're very dedicated to your animals and it could be very rewarding. but i would get a separate set up.

 

[jamest0o0]

Most rainforest species are from cool, humid, Montane regions.