Meet James... and new chameleon keeper

[Asyaneo]

I'm that awful person who keeps buying chameleons from petshops... (( Went to PetSmart to buy some decor and passed a small enclosure (or even box) with baby chameleon in PetSmart. It has closed eyes - which I believe is a sign of illness, couldn't stop myself - I was thinking about him for several days and decided that I couldn't let him die... Also promised myself never to spend money in pet shops (at least PetSmart).

Luckily he seems to be doing ok (never saw him closing eyes afterward). He is currently in Large (18*18*36) enclosure, as I had it available, but will move him to XL in a couple of weeks. Heating lamp (60W), Arcadia T5 6% - raised from enclosure by ~2 inches. Couple of live plants, will add more. Small crickets, hornworms, silkworms with Calcium, will order multivitamin. Moistenland as a mister.

Several questions I haven't found an answer yet (& thanks a lot for your time):
1. How to rise UVB lamp above enclosure (currently have small metal blocks, but they are only 2 inches), what are the normal options for that?
2. How often and when to feed - currently feeding in the morning (about 9-10 am) & eve (~5 pm) & how critical to follow the exact schedule as sometimes I'm working from the office?
3. Is there an optimal way to put mister w/out making holes in an enclosure?
4. What are the benefits of MistKing - is it worth upgrading?
5. What are the best thermometer/ hydrometers, seems all of them giving different results, not sure how to ensure that it's 80 on basking spot

I also have another chameleon enclosure fully set up with an adult chameleon I am fostering - black lamp was for plants, I have already changed it for Arcadia Jungle:

 

[MissSkittles]

Hi and welcome! First off, there are several of us “awful people” who obtained their chameleons from chain pet stores for varied reasons. We won’t even get started on that as it’s been debated repeatedly and there is no answer. Let’s just say bless you for saving this poor baby.
It sounds as if you know what you’re doing. I will suggest buying Repashy Calcium Plus LoD for a combo multivitamin and D3. Then you give that one feeding every two weeks. I do have to double check though - is your current calcium with or without D3? Hopefully it’s without D3 and you’re lightly dusting every feeding with it. Some of the pet stores use only calcium with D3, which overdoses the poor animals. I’m not sure if PetSupermarket does or not, so I would be giving them a call and asking. That would be one of many reasons for baby to have eyes closed. And yes, eyes closed during the day is a sign of sickness. Before I go on any further, I do want to let you know that baby chameleons are fragile and too often by the time signs that anything is wrong is seen, it is often too late. I don’t want to discourage you…we still do all we can. Just be careful of your heart. It is very good that he’s perked up already with you. Now to answer your questions.

1. How to rise UVB lamp above enclosure (currently have small metal blocks, but they are only 2 inches), what are the normal options for that? The uvb doesn’t need to be more than a couple of inches off the screen. It’s the basking light that is the primary concern. Babies walk upside down on the screen top and can get burned from the heat from the basking light. I use wire baskets I’ve found at dollar stores. It’s a little trickier with the basking light. I’ll try to grab a pic of my crazy set up for that a bit later.
2. How often and when to feed - currently feeding in the morning (about 9-10 am) & eve (~5 pm) & how critical to follow the exact schedule as sometimes I'm working from the office? I’ve attached some graphics below for you. It’s vital that the feeders be small enough or baby can’t eat. The bugs need to be smaller than the space between the eyes. You may need to order on line. I’m not great at judging age, but baby looks to be maybe 2-3 months? You do want to feed twice a day and for now, I’m going to say give baby as much as it can eat in about 15-20 minutes. After about a month, cut back to once a day about 15-20 feeders. As baby gets older, it’s needs reduce and we feed less. It’s not an exact science though. It is important to know gender as around 5-6 months, girls will start needing a little different care. Males have a pronounced nub (tarsal spur) on the heels of their back feet. If you aren’t sure, post a pic of that area and we’ll tell you.
3. Is there an optimal way to put mister w/out making holes in an enclosure? Afraid not.
4. What are the benefits of MistKing - is it worth upgrading? I’ve known only hand misting and Mist King and I love my Mist King. When my needs outgrew it, I simply bought a second one. It’s just easy and convenient. Setting up the timer is a total pain but once you’re all set up, all you need to do is make sure to keep your water reservoir full. Basically set it and forget it. You can set it to mist for 2 seconds or 20 hours up to 9 times a day and one all or certain days of the week. Even if you don’t opt for the system, look into getting one of their screen wedges. It helps secure the mist head so it doesn’t rely upon the screen for support.
5. What are the best thermometer/ hydrometers, seems all of them giving different results, not sure how to ensure that it's 80 on basking spot I think we’d all probably give a different answer for this. I use a combination of things. I have a thermometer gun to read the surface temps. I use digital thermometers/hygrometers with a probe end and I also have a digital unit on the outside of the enclosure. Some really like the smart sensor units like Govee and other brands. I am tempted to try one as it reads constantly so you can for example see what your temp and humidity was at 4AM.
I’m so very glad that you found your way here. Don’t be shy about asking any other questions or sharing your sweet baby’s progress. Actually, please do share his/her progress. I’m not alone in always wondering how a cham has been and we all LOVE success stories.

 

[Beman]

Welcome to the forum! You have already gotten some excellent info above.

 

[Beppo]

Hi and welcome! I’m so glad you found the forums!

 

[MissSkittles]

It’s hard to get a good pic of my contraption, but here it is. I clamped the light to a round wire basket, but it kept falling over, so I sat it in a square basket. It is wonky, but it works. It’s currently just a bit crooked, but I’m not messing with it…it’s not the most stable of things.

 

[Asyaneo]

Hi and welcome! First off, there are several of us “awful people” who obtained their chameleons from chain pet stores for varied reasons. We won’t even get started on that as it’s been debated repeatedly and there is no answer. Let’s just say bless you for saving this poor baby.
It sounds as if you know what you’re doing. I will suggest buying Repashy Calcium Plus LoD for a combo multivitamin and D3. Then you give that one feeding every two weeks. I do have to double check though - is your current calcium with or without D3? Hopefully it’s without D3 and you’re lightly dusting every feeding with it. Some of the pet stores use only calcium with D3, which overdoses the poor animals. I’m not sure if PetSupermarket does or not, so I would be giving them a call and asking. That would be one of many reasons for baby to have eyes closed. And yes, eyes closed during the day is a sign of sickness. Before I go on any further, I do want to let you know that baby chameleons are fragile and too often by the time signs that anything is wrong is seen, it is often too late. I don’t want to discourage you…we still do all we can. Just be careful of your heart. It is very good that he’s perked up already with you. Now to answer your questions.

1. How to rise UVB lamp above enclosure (currently have small metal blocks, but they are only 2 inches), what are the normal options for that? The uvb doesn’t need to be more than a couple of inches off the screen. It’s the basking light that is the primary concern. Babies walk upside down on the screen top and can get burned from the heat from the basking light. I use wire baskets I’ve found at dollar stores. It’s a little trickier with the basking light. I’ll try to grab a pic of my crazy set up for that a bit later.
2. How often and when to feed - currently feeding in the morning (about 9-10 am) & eve (~5 pm) & how critical to follow the exact schedule as sometimes I'm working from the office? I’ve attached some graphics below for you. It’s vital that the feeders be small enough or baby can’t eat. The bugs need to be smaller than the space between the eyes. You may need to order on line. I’m not great at judging age, but baby looks to be maybe 2-3 months? You do want to feed twice a day and for now, I’m going to say give baby as much as it can eat in about 15-20 minutes. After about a month, cut back to once a day about 15-20 feeders. As baby gets older, it’s needs reduce and we feed less. It’s not an exact science though. It is important to know gender as around 5-6 months, girls will start needing a little different care. Males have a pronounced nub (tarsal spur) on the heels of their back feet. If you aren’t sure, post a pic of that area and we’ll tell you.
3. Is there an optimal way to put mister w/out making holes in an enclosure? Afraid not.
4. What are the benefits of MistKing - is it worth upgrading? I’ve known only hand misting and Mist King and I love my Mist King. When my needs outgrew it, I simply bought a second one. It’s just easy and convenient. Setting up the timer is a total pain but once you’re all set up, all you need to do is make sure to keep your water reservoir full. Basically set it and forget it. You can set it to mist for 2 seconds or 20 hours up to 9 times a day and one all or certain days of the week. Even if you don’t opt for the system, look into getting one of their screen wedges. It helps secure the mist head so it doesn’t rely upon the screen for support.
5. What are the best thermometer/ hydrometers, seems all of them giving different results, not sure how to ensure that it's 80 on basking spot I think we’d all probably give a different answer for this. I use a combination of things. I have a thermometer gun to read the surface temps. I use digital thermometers/hygrometers with a probe end and I also have a digital unit on the outside of the enclosure. Some really like the smart sensor units like Govee and other brands. I am tempted to try one as it reads constantly so you can for example see what your temp and humidity was at 4AM.
I’m so very glad that you found your way here. Don’t be shy about asking any other questions or sharing your sweet baby’s progress. Actually, please do share his/her progress. I’m not alone in always wondering how a cham has been and we all LOVE success stories.

Thanks for your reply. That's him today:

Yes, he has calcium w/out D3, and I was thinking of getting Repashy as a multivitamin. Is it critical to have lightly dusting? Seems I may be putting too much of it...

I know about how fragile they are and was prepared to have him dying, but hope that at least he will be happy & not stuck in small cage, but he is doing quite well by now, hopefully

Not sure about him drinking - does greens & hornworms help to ensure he is hydrated enough?

Got it about lights, I just saw on ChameleoAcademy that the best setup is to put UVB also higher & change for 12% then.

All bugs are small, definitely less than between his eyes. Expect silkworms & hornworms - but I read that's ok?

I actually tried Govee and didn't believe that I have 70% humidity in the room, but seems it's true...

 

[GrannyK]

Welcome to the forum!!! What a little love bug you have got there! looks much better than the first pic. he continues to thrive with you, thank you for rescuing him. I’m another one who loves lots of pics so keep ‘em coming lol and the experienced keepers here are amazing so ask as many questions as you like. I’ve been keeping for a year and a half and just when I think I got it, something cham crazy happens and I’m back here at the forum looking it up or asking for advice. Glad to have you here!

 

[MissSkittles]

Thanks for your reply. That's him today:
View attachment 344183

Yes, he has calcium w/out D3, and I was thinking of getting Repashy as a multivitamin. Is it critical to have lightly dusting? Seems I may be putting too much of it...

I know about how fragile they are and was prepared to have him dying, but hope that at least he will be happy & not stuck in small cage, but he is doing quite well by now, hopefully

Not sure about him drinking - does greens & hornworms help to ensure he is hydrated enough?

Got it about lights, I just saw on ChameleoAcademy that the best setup is to put UVB also higher & change for 12% then.

All bugs are small, definitely less than between his eyes. Expect silkworms & hornworms - but I read that's ok?

I actually tried Govee and didn't believe that I have 70% humidity in the room, but seems it's true...

It can be a challenge to get just the right amount of supplement on the feeders. Keep trying and you’ll eventually figure out the perfect amount of supplement. I put a very scant amount in a tall deli cup and then put the feeders in. As they move, they dust themselves. If I’ve put too much supplement, I won’t put any more in the cup next time(s) and just use up what’s already in it.
Repashy calcium with LoD has preformed vitamin A, which is good for eye health. Most other multivitamins have proformed vitamin A, which the jury is still out on whether chameleons can utilize that form.
I’m glad that you were/are aware of what you took on and possibility of a broken heart. I’m even more glad that the possibility of that has decreased with your good care. He looks great in this pic.
Many chameleons are very secretive about drinking so just go by the color of urate. If the urate is orange or dark, he’s dehydrated. Even though veileds will eat greens and other food plants, there’s no need for them and science says they lack the ability to digest plant material. You’ve provided safe yummy pothos and other plants that he can nibble if desired. Hornworms are basically bags of water and are great hydrating treats. Too many and you might see loose poos. Hornworms grow super fast, so only buy what you can feed in a day or two and get them smaller than you need. Silkworms are also hydrating and can be used as a staple feeder. They are one of my favorites and are perfect for hand feeding. They don’t grow as fast. With worms, you just kind of have to look at the diameter of the worm. However, I don’t think I’d ever feed a worm that had a diameter as big as the space between the eyes…that’s just too big imho.
I’d say to stick with the 6% uvb and not get a 12%. While you’ll be raising the uvb a couple of inches off the screen, you can just adjust your basking branch so the distance is still 8-9” below.
70% humidity is a bit high for a veiled. Ideal daytime range is between 30-50%. If you are having a problem getting it that low, you may need to invest in a dehumidifier. In the meantime, ensure that you have excellent airflow.

 

[elizaann2]

Welcome

 

[Asyaneo]

Thanks for all replies & welcome

That's him (maybe her?) today:

What do you think about color? He is very rarely bright green. Although eating well (crickets, silk/ hornworms, dubia, BSF), poo is also ok, quite active & never close his eyes.

Another thing that worries me - he starts sleeping at night on a mesh door - I believe it's not very nice for them to climb mesh? He has a lot of branches (probably not a lot of plants yet as I need to prepare then), but still second day he is sleeping on a mesh door instead of more than 10 different branches... Anything I can/ should do about it?

 

[Beppo]

Thanks for all replies & welcome

That's him (maybe her?) today:
View attachment 344359

What do you think about color? He is very rarely bright green. Although eating well, poo is also ok, quite active & never close his eyes.

Another thing that worries me - he starts sleeping at night on a mesh door - I believe it's not very nice for them to climb mesh? He has a lot of branches (probably not a lot of plants yet as I need to prepare then), but still second day he is sleeping on a mesh door instead of more than 10 different branches... Anything I can/ should do about it?

what a little cutie if he’s brand new I would not worry too much about him sleeping on the mesh, he maybe just hasn’t found where he’s comfortable yet. I have a male panther chameleon and when I first brought him home , he slept basically everywhere I didn’t think he would for the first week. It looks Like @MissSkittles has helped you with your husbandry so I would assume if you’ve got everything up to par he’s just trying to find a comfy spot and is a bit nervous still.

 

[Asyaneo]

what a little cutie if he’s brand new I would not worry too much about him sleeping on the mesh, he maybe just hasn’t found where he’s comfortable yet. I have a male panther chameleon and when I first brought him home , he slept basically everywhere I didn’t think he would for the first week. It looks Like @MissSkittles has helped you with your husbandry so I would assume if you’ve got everything up to par he’s just trying to find a comfy spot and is a bit nervous still.

Thanks) He still needs more plants - only two in his enclosure & I plan to move him to a bigger enclosure in ~month (he is currently in L size, but I have XL waiting for him), but all lights, misting, a lot of branches are in place

One more question - I brought some sticks from outside, bleached them, then washed, dried & rewashed - but all sticks still have white color on them (quite evenly distributed) - is it just a change of color because of bleaching or may bleach still be on it?

 

[Beppo]

Thanks) He still needs more plants - only two in his enclosure & I plan to move him to a bigger enclosure in ~month (he is currently in L size, but I have XL waiting for him), but all lights, misting, a lot of branches are in place

One more question - I brought some sticks from outside, bleached them, then washed, dried & rewashed - but all sticks still have white color on them (quite evenly distributed) - is it just a change of color because of bleaching or may bleach still be on it?

Oh good! It sounds like you’ve got the tools for success! I’m not sure I’ve ever heard of bleaching the branches, and so I’m not sure how to advise. Don’t get me wrong it doesn’t sound abnormal to do this, I just don’t have any experience to say what affects that might have on anything. I used dawn dish soap on mine and gave them a little scrub and let then dry and they’re food to go. I think we better wait for someone else to chime in

 

[MissSkittles]

From your pic, his color looks fine. When chams are relaxed and all is right in their world, their colors aren’t so bold or bright. They save that for when they are emotionally fired up. To better absorb heat and uvb, they will darken up and that’s normal too.
While it makes no sense to us, some chams will sleep on their screen. Do provide lots of branches and vines with some plant cover that he can nestle and hide in. Usually they find a spot that they like and feel safe in and that is their sleep spot. Every now and then just to confuse our poor human brains, they move it.
I can’t tell much about bleaching branches. I do the same as @Beppo When you bleached them, how exactly did you do it? Did you submerge or soak the branches in bleach? My concern would be that since wood is so very porous, it could be retaining some bleach if the branches were soaked. The white spots are most likely from the bleaching and permanent. If you have concerns that your branches have retained bleach within them, either put them aside and use different ones (cleaned with dish soap) or rinse them very thoroughly again. Personally, I would get different branches. Chameleons have delicate lungs and I’d be more afraid of fumes than anything.

 

[MzLaurie11]

Hi and welcome! Since you just got him and he is so young, i would hold off more than a month on changing the cage. Its very stressful for them. However, everything you buy gear its size for the xl. the uvb can hang over the side with no issues. If you make holes in your screen, get the screen tape that needs to be applied with a blow dryer as its works so much better. also i would look into getting a dragon stand for your bigger cage as it hard to get plants up high and it makes it so much easier. When they are that young, sleeping on the screen is normal as their little nails can clamp it very well. As he gets bigger and you get more plants and vines, that will change. Flukers makes a good vine called bend a branch. I keep a small thermometer right at the basking branch then use digital to spot check other areas. I like the basking bulb holder to have a dimmer switch as its easier to dim it to right temp then rearrange the cage. You have the cage directly on the floor. you should rethink that. Remember, hot air rises and cold air sinks. Also make sure away from all ac/heat vents. If you cant get him away from the vents, then put something on the vent to block the air from hitting the cage. Could lead to RI. He should be doubling in size every two to three weeks. If he isnt, change feeding. i dont kniw what peysmart does, but pet co feeds their baby chams tiny mealworms only. This is bad for many reasons. The long term issue is they dont learn to huntand become malnutritioned. So ask petsmart what they do. BSFL are very good too. Mine wouldnt go near hornworms when they were young. Scared of them. Think it was the color! At about six months they started eating them. Best of luck to you and your little boy! Now he has a chance.

 

[Asyaneo]

From your pic, his color looks fine. When chams are relaxed and all is right in their world, their colors aren’t so bold or bright. They save that for when they are emotionally fired up. To better absorb heat and uvb, they will darken up and that’s normal too.
While it makes no sense to us, some chams will sleep on their screen. Do provide lots of branches and vines with some plant cover that he can nestle and hide in. Usually they find a spot that they like and feel safe in and that is their sleep spot. Every now and then just to confuse our poor human brains, they move it.
I can’t tell much about bleaching branches. I do the same as @Beppo When you bleached them, how exactly did you do it? Did you submerge or soak the branches in bleach? My concern would be that since wood is so very porous, it could be retaining some bleach if the branches were soaked. The white spots are most likely from the bleaching and permanent. If you have concerns that your branches have retained bleach within them, either put them aside and use different ones (cleaned with dish soap) or rinse them very thoroughly again. Personally, I would get different branches. Chameleons have delicate lungs and I’d be more afraid of fumes than anything.

Ok, I actually did both - soak in bleach and then washed with soap, but will use another one to be on the safe side. Thanks!

Hi and welcome! Since you just got him and he is so young, i would hold off more than a month on changing the cage. Its very stressful for them. However, everything you buy gear its size for the xl. the uvb can hang over the side with no issues. If you make holes in your screen, get the screen tape that needs to be applied with a blow dryer as its works so much better. also i would look into getting a dragon stand for your bigger cage as it hard to get plants up high and it makes it so much easier. When they are that young, sleeping on the screen is normal as their little nails can clamp it very well. As he gets bigger and you get more plants and vines, that will change. Flukers makes a good vine called bend a branch. I keep a small thermometer right at the basking branch then use digital to spot check other areas. I like the basking bulb holder to have a dimmer switch as its easier to dim it to right temp then rearrange the cage. You have the cage directly on the floor. you should rethink that. Remember, hot air rises and cold air sinks. Also make sure away from all ac/heat vents. If you cant get him away from the vents, then put something on the vent to block the air from hitting the cage. Could lead to RI. He should be doubling in size every two to three weeks. If he isnt, change feeding. i dont kniw what peysmart does, but pet co feeds their baby chams tiny mealworms only. This is bad for many reasons. The long term issue is they dont learn to huntand become malnutritioned. So ask petsmart what they do. BSFL are very good too. Mine wouldnt go near hornworms when they were young. Scared of them. Think it was the color! At about six months they started eating them. Best of luck to you and your little boy! Now he has a chance.

Yeah, I was thinking about Dragon stand - still haven't decided yet...
And still can't decide for MisterKing as the one I currently use seems to have same functionality + a connection to Wi-Fi so I can always check from my phone how long does it run, if water level is ok and even start any time. Seems that MisterKing isn't connected to your phone?

Cool, will check basking bulb holders with dimmer - is Flukers' one ok?

Actually, his cage isn't on floor, it's on plastic drawer that also works like a drainage - cage is staying on it w/out actual floor:

I can add more drawers as they are stackable, is it needed?

He is actually quite good in hunting and quite a good eater

Got him new plants (one umbrella & one money) in Pike today, washed leaves & changed upper level for organic foil, will wait for a couple of days and then put in his enclosure:

They also have very quite chameleon-like watering can:

 

[Mrjamwin]

Welcome to the group! James is an excellent name.....

 

[MissSkittles]

Ok…but very important - did you get the watering can? I use mine to water the two houseplants that my chameleons allow me to have in my living room.

 

[Beppo]

Ok, I actually did both - soak in bleach and then washed with soap, but will use another one to be on the safe side. Thanks!



Yeah, I was thinking about Dragon stand - still haven't decided yet...
And still can't decide for MisterKing as the one I currently use seems to have same functionality + a connection to Wi-Fi so I can always check from my phone how long does it run, if water level is ok and even start any time. Seems that MisterKing isn't connected to your phone?

Cool, will check basking bulb holders with dimmer - is Flukers' one ok?

Actually, his cage isn't on floor, it's on plastic drawer that also works like a drainage - cage is staying on it w/out actual floor:

View attachment 344388

I can add more drawers as they are stackable, is it needed?

He is actually quite good in hunting and quite a good eater

Got him new plants (one umbrella & one money) in Pike today, washed leaves & changed upper level for organic foil, will wait for a couple of days and then put in his enclosure:
View attachment 344389

They also have very quite chameleon-like watering can:
View attachment 344390

Omg I need that watering can! How cute

 

[MissSkittles]

Omg I need that watering can! How cute

Here ya go! https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01AD1U302/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 The price has gone way up. It was only $9 when I bought it.