Mold Concerns with Screen Cages for Chameleons - Advice Needed

[AlexH1]

Hey everyone,

I'm looking for some advice about mold issues with screen/mesh enclosures for chameleons and if you have experienced the same issue. I had a veiled chameleon for close to 8 years (he sadly passed away last year). During that time, I was battling a serious mold problem in the same room where his enclosure was kept, there was never any mold in the cage, just in the room.

I had moved into that rented property not long before getting him, so I'm unsure whether the humidity from the mist king and mesh viv contributed to the mold or if the property already had mold issues that were just covered up by the landlord. Mold did appear in other parts of the house but was far worse in his room. (Living in the UK)

I've recently moved to a new apartment and I'm thinking about getting a panther chameleon soon. I'm trying to decide whether to reuse the mesh cage or switch to a wood/glass vivarium in my new apartment to avoid any mold problems. I initially went with a mesh setup because I heard glass can stress chameleons out, but I'm willing to switch if it helps prevent mold or if any of you have experienced mold issues within the same room as your chameleon, can you tell me how you resolved it.

Has anyone had similar experiences with mold and screen cages, or am I overthinking this? I'd really appreciate any advice or experiences you guys could share!

Here's some photo's of my old friend. He's was very cool and very tame. He was the best!

 

[Beman]

So if you live in an already high natural humidity then this will be something that is worse with adding any form of chameleon enclosure to the room. I dealt with this and hybrid enclosures. Granted I had to run a dehumidifier to not only keep my ambient humidity at 50% but to help reduce the mold issues that would happen in the windows. It unfortunately will not matter what type of enclosure set up you do because the moisture we put into the cages still increases moisture in the room. I would say look into room dehumidifiers to help reduce the humidity in the room.

Now if your ambient room humidity was low then I would say this was not due to the chameleon enclosure. We are not pumping moisture non stop into their cages most do a misting in the morning and evening and if they use a fogger it is run at night only when temps are low.

Sometimes the cooling or heating system of the house can help pull down ambient humidity and dry stuff out as well. The one thing you can check is get a humidity gauge and place it in the room where you would set up a cage. See where your ambient levels sit.

 

[MissSkittles]

If you reuse the screen enclosure, do make sure to clean it well with vinegar to kill any mold spores. Or you could steam clean it too. Your chameleon was beautiful btw and to have him for 8 years is quite the achievement.

 

[AlexH1]

So if you live in an already high natural humidity then this will be something that is worse with adding any form of chameleon enclosure to the room. I dealt with this and hybrid enclosures. Granted I had to run a dehumidifier to not only keep my ambient humidity at 50% but to help reduce the mold issues that would happen in the windows. It unfortunately will not matter what type of enclosure set up you do because the moisture we put into the cages still increases moisture in the room. I would say look into room dehumidifiers to help reduce the humidity in the room.

Now if your ambient room humidity was low then I would say this was not due to the chameleon enclosure. We are not pumping moisture non stop into their cages most do a misting in the morning and evening and if they use a fogger it is run at night only when temps are low.

Sometimes the cooling or heating system of the house can help pull down ambient humidity and dry stuff out as well. The one thing you can check is get a humidity gauge and place it in the room where you would set up a cage. See where your ambient levels sit.

Thankfully I already have a 20L dehumidifier I bought to try and battle the mold/ damp issue in my old property.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B06W526KFY/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1

I was just curious to whether anyone has had the same issue and whether glass/ hybrid enclosures where better at preventing it. I'm still unsure if the mist king/ the enclosure was the problem, it might just have been the area I lived in and the property that was at fault. I just really want to avoid the same issue in my new apartment as I've not yet had any problem with mold.

Thank you for the advice though, checking what the current ambient humidity levels of the room is a great idea and should help me manage the humidity better!

 

[AlexH1]

If you reuse the screen enclosure, do make sure to clean it well with vinegar to kill any mold spores. Or you could steam clean it too. Your chameleon was beautiful btw and to have him for 8 years is quite the achievement.

I have a steam cleaner but just to be safe I can also give it a wipe down with vinegar. Thank you for the tip!
He was great and it was sad seeing him go.

 

[Beman]

Thankfully I already have a 20L dehumidifier I bought to try and battle the mold/ damp issue in my old property.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B06W526KFY/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1

I was just curious to whether anyone has had the same issue and whether glass/ hybrid enclosures where better at preventing it. I'm still unsure if the mist king/ the enclosure was the problem, it might just have been the area I lived in and the property that was at fault. I just really want to avoid the same issue in my new apartment as I've not yet had any problem with mold.

Thank you for the advice though, checking what the current ambient humidity levels of the room is a great idea and should help me manage the humidity better!

So if you go glass you risk ambient levels in an enclosure being far too high. Also the size of the enclosure would be smaller than what is recommended for a panther or veiled. It will not prevent it though. Fish tanks in a room do the same thing. Screen or hybrid will give you airflow for the cage but still also if ambient levels run too high it will continue to be a risk. What I will say is it was 100% my high natural environment because I moved to AZ where there is virtually no humidity and have never had an issue.

 

[elizaann2]

You’ve been given great advice from some amazing keepers. 8 years is is wonderful! I can only hope that I get to be with my babies as long. Congrats! He looks like such a sweet thing.

Another option you may want to consider is a hybrid enclosure, this will help protect your home a little better than a screen enclosure. So long as your humidity levels in your enclosure doesn’t get too low you can also turn on a dehumidifier in your room or a fan to help.

 

[AlexH1]

So if you go glass you risk ambient levels in an enclosure being far too high. Also the size of the enclosure would be smaller than what is recommended for a panther or veiled. It will not prevent it though. Fish tanks in a room do the same thing. Screen or hybrid will give you airflow for the cage but still also if ambient levels run too high it will continue to be a risk. What I will say is it was 100% my high natural environment because I moved to AZ where there is virtually no humidity and have never had an issue.

Thank you!
After reading your message you definitely made me realize that where I used to live most likely had high moisture and humidity levels, I lived in a mountainous area or valley and there was often a build up of condensation on the windows and the build up of mold and damp was always by the window and not around the chameleons cage. I will definitely keep an eye on the humidity levels of the room though, I think that is a wise think to do.

Just out of curiosity, what is considered best now? Hybrid or screen, I remember doing my research 8 years ago and it seemed that screen/ mesh was considered best for the chameleon. That's why ultimately I bought one. At the time I never seen a hybrid like mesh with another material like wood/glass. (I do live in the UK so my options may be a little more limited) At the time I mainly had the option of Glass, Wood and Glass or Mesh.

 

[AlexH1]

You’ve been given great advice from some amazing keepers. 8 years is is wonderful! I can only hope that I get to be with my babies as long. Congrats! He looks like such a sweet thing.

Another option you may want to consider is a hybrid enclosure, this will help protect your home a little better than a screen enclosure. So long as your humidity levels in your enclosure doesn’t get too low you can also turn on a dehumidifier in your room or a fan to help.

Thank you!

I asked someone else this but considering you mentioned hybrid yourself. I'm curious to what is considered the best viv/ cage these days? I remember doing my research 8 years ago and it seemed that screen/ mesh was considered best for the chameleon. That's why ultimately I bought one. At the time I never seen a hybrid like mesh with another material like wood/glass. (I do live in the UK so my options may be a little more limited) At the time I mainly had the option of Glass, Wood and Glass or Mesh.

 

[MissSkittles]

I haven’t a clue what enclosures are available to you in the UK, but you can modify a screen enclosure to be more like a hybrid by attaching some acrylic panels to the frame of the back and/or sides. @Beman is the one who can probably tell you about this. You could even craft a faux background with plastic lighting egg crate, spray foam, silicone and coco coir. Some have converted old curio or china cabinets into enclosures. I’m being lazy and just going to give you the search results link rather than individual threads, but here’s some inspiration. https://www.chameleonforums.com/search/3546580/?q=Enclosure+thread&c[title_only]=1&o=relevance

 

[elizaann2]

Thank you!

I asked someone else this but considering you mentioned hybrid yourself. I'm curious to what is considered the best viv/ cage these days? I remember doing my research 8 years ago and it seemed that screen/ mesh was considered best for the chameleon. That's why ultimately I bought one. At the time I never seen a hybrid like mesh with another material like wood/glass. (I do live in the UK so my options may be a little more limited) At the time I mainly had the option of Glass, Wood and Glass or Mesh.

I am in the same boat as Miss Skittles, I unfortunately do now know what enclosures are available to you in the UK. You can turn your current enclosure into a hybrid with corrugated plastic. Check out the DIY Chameleon Guys on YouTube. There are plenty of videos there to show you ways to turn a screen enclosure into a hybrid. They are nice because you can have a more humid environment for yor chameleon, but then the rest of the room doesn't have to be so. With a screen enclosure the humidity and temps will match that of the room. I live in a very dry part of the U.S. and a hybrid is a necessity for me. The enclosed walls also helps protect my floors and walls from mist so I don't get water everywhere. If you go with glass, you may just need to keep an eye on temps to ensure they dont get too high. Glass tends to hold in heat far better, knowing you are in the UK that may actually be a benefit for you...it can be quite cold there!

 

[Beman]

Thank you!
After reading your message you definitely made me realize that where I used to live most likely had high moisture and humidity levels, I lived in a mountainous area or valley and there was often a build up of condensation on the windows and the build up of mold and damp was always by the window and not around the chameleons cage. I will definitely keep an eye on the humidity levels of the room though, I think that is a wise think to do.

Just out of curiosity, what is considered best now? Hybrid or screen, I remember doing my research 8 years ago and it seemed that screen/ mesh was considered best for the chameleon. That's why ultimately I bought one. At the time I never seen a hybrid like mesh with another material like wood/glass. (I do live in the UK so my options may be a little more limited) At the time I mainly had the option of Glass, Wood and Glass or Mesh.

Hybrid seems to be the direction most are going. That is what my boy has been in for almost 6 years. So top panel is screen then the service door at the bottom is screen so this allows for the chimney effect. What I like about it is no matter the environment you have better control over your levels both humidity and temp. But you get the airflow that is needed. Here is a link to all of the hybrid cages I have had and how I set mine up. https://www.chameleonforums.com/media/albums/my-enclosures.6672/

Note on one of mine I converted as when I got it it was screen and vinyl side panels. I removed this and then got 1/4 inch pvc sheets. Cut them to size with a razor and then I screwed mine to the frame. I was short on time so could not use silicone or something that would be better lol. I just did not have the time for it to cure and gas off. But this still has worked great for me and Beman is still in the same cage.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/media/medium-tall-atrium-coverted-to-solid-sides-and-back.51909/

 

[AlexH1]

Hybrid seems to be the direction most are going. That is what my boy has been in for almost 6 years. So top panel is screen then the service door at the bottom is screen so this allows for the chimney effect. What I like about it is no matter the environment you have better control over your levels both humidity and temp. But you get the airflow that is needed. Here is a link to all of the hybrid cages I have had and how I set mine up. https://www.chameleonforums.com/media/albums/my-enclosures.6672/

Note on one of mine I converted as when I got it it was screen and vinyl side panels. I removed this and then got 1/4 inch pvc sheets. Cut them to size with a razor and then I screwed mine to the frame. I was short on time so could not use silicone or something that would be better lol. I just did not have the time for it to cure and gas off. But this still has worked great for me and Beman is still in the same cage.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/media/medium-tall-atrium-coverted-to-solid-sides-and-back.51909/

Thank you for being so helpful and I love your enclosure setups.
I've been motoring the ambient humidity level of the room I'll be keeping my new Sambava in and it hangs at around 50-55%

 

[Beman]

Thank you for being so helpful and I love your enclosure setups.
I've been motoring the ambient humidity level of the room I'll be keeping my new Sambava in and it hangs at around 50-55%

My pleasure. So with that ambient I would either do a hybrid or get a screen and convert it yourself. Maybe make it so you can remove a side panel if needed to allow for more air flow certain times of the year. Get creative and have fun with it. Main thing about a full hybrid is you may need to add a pc fan to the top so you can pull air up and out of the cage. And you want to ensure you have a full vent at the bottom to allow for the chimney effect.

You can expect anywhere from 10-20% bump in humidity in the cage. This is going to be based on how many plants you put in, How much your misting (may need to adjust misting length so that your main mistings are happening late afternoon rather than morning), and of course exactly how you set up the cage. Meaning if you have a removable panel etc. This is where having a half screen half solid walls can be helpful. You can have a solid back wall and one side wall. Put the basking lamp in that back corner so your temps stabilize more. It will create a heat gradient. Then you allow for additional airflow. Aim misting heads to the walls that have solid sides so you do not get over spray.

I would avoid going bioactive if your humidity runs that high. This can increase the humidity more than you like and can make it harder to pull it down without a dehumidifier in the room.