New Baby Chameleon won't eat or drink
- Thread starter Poveglia
- Start date
jajeanpierre
Chameleon Enthusiast
@Poveglia Try thinking the way your chameleon thinks. Baby chameleons are different than adults--much more reactive and shy. Think about how they live in the wild. Most chameleons just sit around and wait for food to come their way. Babies can starve to death if food isn't plentiful enough to walk within striking range. I see you have a bowl of meal worms in the bottom of his cage out in the open and very exposed. I can't tell how big your baby is, but I would not expect a baby to go down to the bottom of the cage and travel 18" in the open to food in a bowl. It just isn't likely to happen. You want to make everything easy for the baby--plentiful food that is always close.
Are your food items too big? The guide of "no bigger than the space between their eyes" doesn't always tell the whole story. Try smaller feeders and forget the meal worms. Free range the feeders. Many won't cup feed.
Hydration: I see what looks like a black tube running through the plastic mass of fake leaves on the right. Is that a dripper line? One point of a "dripper" is the movement of drops of water that the animal sees dripping and is attracted towards. Which leads to the next problem--layout of the furnishings.
You seem to be approaching the cage the way many novices do in a 2-dimensional way. Looking at the cage from the front, it appears as if there is cover and areas to move. Looking at the cage from a baby chameleon's perspective shows it doesn't seem to be quite adequate to my eyes.
First, you need cover at the top of the cage as others have mentioned. The cover needs to be in three dimensions and fill the entire cage, not just the back, side and bottom with bare in the middle. Babies often don't risk leaving cover to get near to their heat source/lights. You want the cage filled with places to hide and pathways to move around the whole cage, not just the sides. Plants on the bottom are not what a veiled wants or uses.
A common mistake many make using those masses of plastic plants is to leave them in an impenetrable mass which does nothing. Unless the baby is really tiny, they often can't or won't hide in them. Take the strands of plastic leaves, spread them out and wind them around branches. Remove some of the tufts and tie the tufts to other branches/vines so you get cover throughout the cage not just in two lumps of green plastic. Zip ties are a chameleon keeper's best friend. Can you tell I am not impressed with plastic?
Use living plants which will hold water droplets on their leaves for a much longer time than plastic because they are breathing and releasing humidity into the air. I often tie smaller plants in pots throughout the cage so I can get natural greenery high in the cage without having a big plant. A big hanging pothos from Home Depot can go along way. I often cut up a big pot of sword ferns and plant the clumps in smaller pots to hang around the cages.
The carpet on the bottom should go. If you are giving him enough water, it will be a sodden mess in no time. Dealing with water is a fact of chameleon keeping, especially in a cage that is not heavily planted.
Hope that helps and doesn't discourage you. I didn't mean it to sound critical but I think it does; and truth be told, I'm too lazy this morning to fix it!
That's not my intent, so apologies in advance for any perceived slight.
Are your food items too big? The guide of "no bigger than the space between their eyes" doesn't always tell the whole story. Try smaller feeders and forget the meal worms. Free range the feeders. Many won't cup feed.
Hydration: I see what looks like a black tube running through the plastic mass of fake leaves on the right. Is that a dripper line? One point of a "dripper" is the movement of drops of water that the animal sees dripping and is attracted towards. Which leads to the next problem--layout of the furnishings.
You seem to be approaching the cage the way many novices do in a 2-dimensional way. Looking at the cage from the front, it appears as if there is cover and areas to move. Looking at the cage from a baby chameleon's perspective shows it doesn't seem to be quite adequate to my eyes.
First, you need cover at the top of the cage as others have mentioned. The cover needs to be in three dimensions and fill the entire cage, not just the back, side and bottom with bare in the middle. Babies often don't risk leaving cover to get near to their heat source/lights. You want the cage filled with places to hide and pathways to move around the whole cage, not just the sides. Plants on the bottom are not what a veiled wants or uses.
A common mistake many make using those masses of plastic plants is to leave them in an impenetrable mass which does nothing. Unless the baby is really tiny, they often can't or won't hide in them. Take the strands of plastic leaves, spread them out and wind them around branches. Remove some of the tufts and tie the tufts to other branches/vines so you get cover throughout the cage not just in two lumps of green plastic. Zip ties are a chameleon keeper's best friend. Can you tell I am not impressed with plastic?
Use living plants which will hold water droplets on their leaves for a much longer time than plastic because they are breathing and releasing humidity into the air. I often tie smaller plants in pots throughout the cage so I can get natural greenery high in the cage without having a big plant. A big hanging pothos from Home Depot can go along way. I often cut up a big pot of sword ferns and plant the clumps in smaller pots to hang around the cages.
The carpet on the bottom should go. If you are giving him enough water, it will be a sodden mess in no time. Dealing with water is a fact of chameleon keeping, especially in a cage that is not heavily planted.
Hope that helps and doesn't discourage you. I didn't mean it to sound critical but I think it does; and truth be told, I'm too lazy this morning to fix it!
That's not my intent, so apologies in advance for any perceived slight.@Poveglia Try thinking the way your chameleon thinks. Baby chameleons are different than adults--much more reactive and shy. Think about how they live in the wild. Most chameleons just sit around and wait for food to come their way. Babies can starve to death if food isn't plentiful enough to walk within striking range. I see you have a bowl of meal worms in the bottom of his cage out in the open and very exposed. I can't tell how big your baby is, but I would not expect a baby to go down to the bottom of the cage and travel 18" in the open to food in a bowl. It just isn't likely to happen. You want to make everything easy for the baby--plentiful food that is always close.
Are your food items too big? The guide of "no bigger than the space between their eyes" doesn't always tell the whole story. Try smaller feeders and forget the meal worms. Free range the feeders. Many won't cup feed.
Hydration: I see what looks like a black tube running through the plastic mass of fake leaves on the right. Is that a dripper line? One point of a "dripper" is the movement of drops of water that the animal sees dripping and is attracted towards. Which leads to the next problem--layout of the furnishings.
You seem to be approaching the cage the way many novices do in a 2-dimensional way. Looking at the cage from the front, it appears as if there is cover and areas to move. Looking at the cage from a baby chameleon's perspective shows it doesn't seem to be quite adequate to my eyes.
First, you need cover at the top of the cage as others have mentioned. The cover needs to be in three dimensions and fill the entire cage, not just the back, side and bottom with bare in the middle. Babies often don't risk leaving cover to get near to their heat source/lights. You want the cage filled with places to hide and pathways to move around the whole cage, not just the sides. Plants on the bottom are not what a veiled wants or uses.
A common mistake many make using those masses of plastic plants is to leave them in an impenetrable mass which does nothing. Unless the baby is really tiny, they often can't or won't hide in them. Take the strands of plastic leaves, spread them out and wind them around branches. Remove some of the tufts and tie the tufts to other branches/vines so you get cover throughout the cage not just in two lumps of green plastic. Zip ties are a chameleon keeper's best friend. Can you tell I am not impressed with plastic?
Use living plants which will hold water droplets on their leaves for a much longer time than plastic because they are breathing and releasing humidity into the air. I often tie smaller plants in pots throughout the cage so I can get natural greenery high in the cage without having a big plant. A big hanging pothos from Home Depot can go along way. I often cut up a big pot of sword ferns and plant the clumps in smaller pots to hang around the cages.
The carpet on the bottom should go. If you are giving him enough water, it will be a sodden mess in no time. Dealing with water is a fact of chameleon keeping, especially in a cage that is not heavily planted.
Hope that helps and doesn't discourage you. I didn't mean it to sound critical but I think it does; and truth be told, I'm too lazy this morning to fix it!
No, please tell it like it is. This isn't about hurting my ego, it's about providing the best living area for my new resident. I will definitely do all that you said.
Also, the black "tube like thing" is one of those eco vines they sell at Petco. My dripper is on the top, and cant be seen in this photo, but I have it protruding from the side, dripping onto those plastic vines (with the drip basin underneath).
Another question I have....if the baby wont climb down, what do I do with the crickets? They seem to be just hiding on the bottom of the cage (I am removing the mat too). If they have nowhere to hide, will they climb up to him?
jajeanpierre
Chameleon Enthusiast
I just throw crickets in the top of the cage. Yes, I leave crickets in. I do provide good gut load for the crickets, so they eat well until the chameleon can find them. I sometimes have to round up the crickets congregating at the bottom, redust them and toss them into the top. Crickets do tend to climb up the screen.
I believe that you can't provide adequate hydration/humidity without some kind of automatic system. A good automatic mister (MistKing) is a godsend for chameleons, even veileds.
jamest0o0
Chameleon Enthusiast
Chams seem to only start drinking after water is spraying for a bit. Mist systems are great for this, i hand mist atm because i am home most of the day, but i'll be setting a mistking up. Usually takes about 5 minutes give or take of continuous misting for my panther to start drinking. I do this at least 3 times a day.
I forget who, but one of the experienced keepers here explained it like this: in the wild when it rains it could last a long time, they instinctually take their time deciding when to bathe and drink. So that is why it is important to spray what seems like unnecessary amounts of water into the cage.
Anyway seems like you'll be a great keeper, open to good advice. Glad to see someone committing.
I forget who, but one of the experienced keepers here explained it like this: in the wild when it rains it could last a long time, they instinctually take their time deciding when to bathe and drink. So that is why it is important to spray what seems like unnecessary amounts of water into the cage.
Anyway seems like you'll be a great keeper, open to good advice. Glad to see someone committing.
Owlco
Member
Always check your Champs poop and urate, if its a normal colour and doesn't look dehydrated your Cham probably just doesn't drink in front of you. I have only seen my chameleon drink a few times.
With the not eating food he probably is just scared or stressed out from being in his new enclosure. When i first brought my Chameleon home he only ate like 4 crickets a day, now its more like 15+. IF he continues not to eat I would go to the vet.
With the not eating food he probably is just scared or stressed out from being in his new enclosure. When i first brought my Chameleon home he only ate like 4 crickets a day, now its more like 15+. IF he continues not to eat I would go to the vet.
opheliaeatsbugs
Avid Member
You have received some amazing advice! I am a new keeper and reading all of the suggestions/advice brought me back several months ago when I was feeling just like you. Since December, I have re-vamped, re-done, added more, moved vines and branches, added a laying bin for my female, tried and failed and tried again to figure out the dripper/misting/drainage issue and generally spent hours and days reading through all the posts on this forum. I have taken more pics of poop then is probably normal. I let Ophelia climb (multiple times!) on a highly toxic plant in my back yard - purple nightshade. Sheesh... I bang my head on a brick wall and wonder how she will ever survive me! I mention that so you don't feel like you are the only one who made a mistake on plants
Thankfully, I found this forum early on and made it my mission to be the best keeper I can be and that means learning every day. These people are amazing! Follow the care sheets and post your progress
Thankfully, I found this forum early on and made it my mission to be the best keeper I can be and that means learning every day. These people are amazing! Follow the care sheets and post your progress
OK...whew...been shopping all day and made a ton of improvements. They are:
1.- All real plants now (only 1 plastic plant for climbing). Added a dwarf fern, hanging pothos, and a croton.
2.- Created a drainage system by hollowing out table, drilling a network of holes in the bottom, and creating a shower curtain barrier that all leads into a drip pan below.
3.- Ordered a MistKing...will be here Thursday.
4.- Removed bottom mat. The floor is now bare-bottom with drainage.
5.- Dripper is falling onto Pothos leaves, into Croton's pot.
Conclusion: Thanks all very much for your help! I've attached updated pics. The cham is DEFINATELY happier, and now has overhead cover, and has been exploring non stop! I also got him to eat 4 more crickets today! He is really active now and seems content! Hope I didn't over do it lol.
Any suggestions based on new setup?
1.- All real plants now (only 1 plastic plant for climbing). Added a dwarf fern, hanging pothos, and a croton.
2.- Created a drainage system by hollowing out table, drilling a network of holes in the bottom, and creating a shower curtain barrier that all leads into a drip pan below.
3.- Ordered a MistKing...will be here Thursday.
4.- Removed bottom mat. The floor is now bare-bottom with drainage.
5.- Dripper is falling onto Pothos leaves, into Croton's pot.
Conclusion: Thanks all very much for your help! I've attached updated pics. The cham is DEFINATELY happier, and now has overhead cover, and has been exploring non stop! I also got him to eat 4 more crickets today! He is really active now and seems content! Hope I didn't over do it lol.
Any suggestions based on new setup?
Attachments
opheliaeatsbugs
Avid Member
Good job on the real plants my only observation at this point is that you will need many more horizontal branches running left/right. The vines can weave vertically and, while the plants are a great addition, I would think they would need to be up higher with some coverage nearer the top of the enclosure.
my only observation at this point is that you will need many more horizontal branches running left/right. The vines can weave vertically and, while the plants are a great addition, I would think they would need to be up higher with some coverage nearer the top of the enclosure.Good job on the real plants
Yeah, I tried to find taller plants, but was having little luck (or they came in gigantic pots). This is why I went with the hanging Pothos. As it grows, the wines will weave and wrap around everything. I plan on adding a few more horizontal eco-vines when I get more money (just bought a MistKing).
opheliaeatsbugs
Avid Member
That's great news keep us posted with your progress
I hate crickets haha nasty things (but go for it!!) if you decide to add to your feeders, don't discount dubia roaches... they are so easy
keep us posted with your progressI hate crickets haha nasty things (but go for it!!) if you decide to add to your feeders, don't discount dubia roaches... they are so easy
I owe it to you guys. I sincerely thank you. Final nightly update...he ended up eating 10 crickets today and I did observe her drinking quite a bit directly from the Big Dripper. Honestly, her mood attitude, and general health raised 100 fold today alone, and I owe it to you guys. So seriously thank you for the wisdom and advice, and taking the time to even help a noobie.
Oh, and I cant wait for the MistKing to arrive!!!!
and I did observe her drinking quite a bit directly from the Big Dripper. Honestly, her mood attitude, and general health raised 100 fold today alone, and I owe it to you guys. So seriously thank you for the wisdom and advice, and taking the time to even help a noobie.Oh, and I cant wait for the MistKing to arrive!!!!
jamest0o0
Chameleon Enthusiast
Great to hear, don't hesitate to ask questions! I got into this hobby last summer and it's amazing how much everyone here knows. I can't imagine keeping a cham or anything without help from experienced keepers.
Btw i see you said it's a she, i believe they need a laying bin, not sure if anyone mentioned that?
Btw i see you said it's a she, i believe they need a laying bin, not sure if anyone mentioned that?
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