New Member/Gender Question?

[zelink14]

So I decided that staying in contact with fellow Chameleon owners would be a great idea. Mostly because I am a first-time owner of a chameleon.

Anyway, my name is Lynda and I purchased a male veiled chameleon in October. I've been enjoying him a lot. I just had an episode this week where he -- whose name is Ridley -- stopped eating, stayed in the corner, and became EXTREMELY aggressive. Last night I was really scared he was going to die because he was black and at the bottom of his cage. This afternoon after class, before going to my vet appointment, I found that he'd eaten the crickets in his feeding cup. Yay! Anyway, so he seems to be doing fine...

But about the vet appointment, the doctor was extremely helpful and friendly, and I hate to doubt her knowledge, but she informed me that Ridley is a female (currently about 4 months). Her reasons for believing this is that Ridley doesn't show any bulges at the base of her tail, and also because she's aggressive. My only reason for doubting that particular diagnosis is because I informed the breeder I got Ridley from that I wanted a male (because they are supposedly friendlier, longer-lived, and more colorful) and he made a point of checking the spurs on every veiled's feet. Ridley turned out to be the only male in the cage at that time.

Well, anyway. Sorry for the long back story. So what should I trust? the spurs on Ridley's backfeet, or the lack of hemipenal bulge? I would like to know so I can be prepared for egg-laying.

Here's a photo that was taken today. If closer pictures would be preferred, I can try taking some at a later time.

I look forward to engaging in the forums!

 

[NewOwner]

Hahaha.. i also have a 4 month old veiled chamelen.. who was said to be a guy. but is a girl... Welcome to the forums

 

[Julirs]

Does Ridly have spurs? Can you take a pic of his back heels? By his coloring I would have guessed she by lack of barring, but the picture angle could be off.

 

[zelink14]

Does Ridly have spurs? Can you take a pic of his back heels? By his coloring I would have guessed she by lack of barring, but the picture angle could be off.

S/he has gone to sleep for the night, so I'll try to get a picture tomorrow morning and post it ASAP.

 

[zelink14]

Hahaha.. i also have a 4 month old veiled chamelen.. who was said to be a guy. but is a girl... Welcome to the forums

Hey, so we're in the same boat! (maybe) Awesome. Guess we'll see what happens...

Thanks! You too!

 

[laurie]

Wekcome to the forum, you will find some very knowledgeable and helpful people on this forum. Also some of it is just sheer fun.

 

[zelink14]

Wekcome to the forum, you will find some very knowledgeable and helpful people on this forum. Also some of it is just sheer fun.

Thank you! After this recent episode I know that having a "support group" would be so comforting since I don't know anyone personally who owns any reptiles. Also, I lost a bearded dragon once and don't want it to happen again.

 

[kaity]

Male Veiled Chams do have spurs, not all chams have suprs but Veiled do... so is he has spurs he is indeed a male.

 

[kinyonga]

Females can lay eggs without being mated and two of the signs that they are ready are not eating and sitting low in the cage....I would put some place in the cage for her to dig to show you if she's ready.

 

[Brad Ramsey]

Looking for a hemipenal bulge on a 4 month old veiled chameleon is kind of silly.

They don't show like panthers and the spur on a male veiled is an easy way to determine sex from day one.

Your vet seems a bit unknowledgeable to me.

-Brad

 

[zelink14]

Looking for a hemipenal bulge on a 4 month old veiled chameleon is kind of silly.

They don't show like panthers and the spur on a male veiled is an easy way to determine sex from day one.

Your vet seems a bit unknowledgeable to me.

-Brad

You know, that's EXACTLY what I thought. I remember it being very hard to sex my beardie because she was still so young. Luckily, I knew in advance that veileds have a specific secondary sexual trait that is instantly recognizable. I'm sure this vet is great with other exotics, but I may consider trying a different one in the future.

I'll get a photo of the legs just in case. Thanks for the help.

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

Welcome to the forum. Glad to see a fellow Puget Sounder here. That's a very handsome chameleon you have there. He/She was VERY young when purchased, if you got it in October and it's about 4 months old now. When very young, sometimes I've had to use a magnifying glass to check the spurs, because, depending on how the animal is "cupping" its foot, a spur-like fold can appear behind the rear feet.

Did you purchase Ridley at the Breeder's Expo in Puyallup?

 

[zelink14]

Did you purchase Ridley at the Breeder's Expo in Puyallup?

I did. You must've been there, or heard about it.

Yeah, wish I'd known that was too young... "he" seems to be okay, though. Hopefully I can continue to keep him that way!

But, until I can get those photos for everyone to look at, what does cause
a chameleon to suddenly not eat or bask, and especially sit at the bottom of the cage black? (besides being with eggs, if anything) I know not eating can be because of not being able to shed, being caused by being dehydrated. (awful cycle)

Also, I noticed something yesterday, too. After I brought Ridley home from the vet -- who suddenly seemed fine and hungry -- he ate a few crickets almost immediately after I put them in. I noticed shortly after that Ridley was perched on a branch nearby and black again. He went back to normal shortly after, and has seemed fine since. Do chameleons only turn black when they're stressed or angry, or can they turn black because of something like an upset stomach?

 

[zelink14]

By his coloring I would have guessed she by lack of barring, but the picture angle could be off.

Can you explain to me what "barring" is? I noticed it somewhere else on the forum, and I assume that's the skin pattern. So that means males and females have different patterns too?

Fascinating. I'll get a picture asap.

 

[WelshOneEmma]

Male Veiled Chams do have spurs, not all chams have suprs but Veiled do... so is he has spurs he is indeed a male.

Hate to burst the bubble, but my first cham was a veiled, who indeed had good sized spurs and stripes, BUT was actually a female. The vet had a feel, no male genitalia was found and an x-ray showed eggs in there. Unfortunatley she dies (kidney disease) and when the necropsy was done there were eggs in there. The only indication that 'he' was a 'she' was the small casque. So whilst spurs are a usual indicator, they are not definitive. My vet was able to determine female instantly by checking for the male parts.

 

[honeybee1985]

Hate to burst the bubble, but my first cham was a veiled, who indeed had good sized spurs and stripes, BUT was actually a female. The vet had a feel, no male genitalia was found and an x-ray showed eggs in there. Unfortunatley she dies (kidney disease) and when the necropsy was done there were eggs in there. The only indication that 'he' was a 'she' was the small casque. So whilst spurs are a usual indicator, they are not definitive. My vet was able to determine female instantly by checking for the male parts.

Oh god Emma! Don't tell me that. Cassius has a comparitivley small casque and now I'll be forever doubting his sex unless he lays eggs lol!!

 

[WelshOneEmma]

Oh god Emma! Don't tell me that. Cassius has a comparitivley small casque and now I'll be forever doubting his sex unless he lays eggs lol!!

I do think that we had a very unusual case, so i wouldn't be too worried! The only indication we had was her trying to lay eggs (the never ending thread where everyone was debating the sex of my cham - was very amusing!). She was about 6 months old when this kicked off - how old is yours? We do tend to attract strange animals in my house (one of my rats is a hermaphrodite) so it was probably just my luck! Did burst the bubble that sexing veileds was simple though!

 

[Chase]

It is very rare for a female to have barring and spurs. But, Sexing Veileds is very easy, you just got a wierd one lol.

 

[honeybee1985]

I do think that we had a very unusual case, so i wouldn't be too worried! The only indication we had was her trying to lay eggs (the never ending thread where everyone was debating the sex of my cham - was very amusing!). She was about 6 months old when this kicked off - how old is yours? We do tend to attract strange animals in my house (one of my rats is a hermaphrodite) so it was probably just my luck! Did burst the bubble that sexing veileds was simple though!

Ah that's ok then! Cass is around 1 year so I'm sure it'd be obvious by now if he was a girl. It's an interesting note about sexing though. A hermaphrodite rat, a gender confused chameleon and goldfish that live for years and years?! You sure know how to pick 'em lol. I bet your house is an awesome place to live!

 

[WelshOneEmma]

Ah that's ok then! Cass is around 1 year so I'm sure it'd be obvious by now if he was a girl. It's an interesting note about sexing though. A hermaphrodite rat, a gender confused chameleon and goldfish that live for years and years?! You sure know how to pick 'em lol. I bet your house is an awesome place to live!

My boyfriend reckons that it was a male to start with, but with all the estroegen in the house (all the animals are female) we turned him female! Highly unlikely but he's sticking to it! We do have a bit of a menagerie - 3 cats, 4 rats, 14 fish and a chameleon! Loving every bit of it!