OK, so I just had a special moment with my baby Chameleon

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Poveglia

Member
He is going through shedding, was extremely stressed and pacing his cage, rubbing against everything. So, I took him out, and he was very nervous at first.

I started to gently scratch him, and after about 1/2 hour, he started closing his eyes and rubbing against my fingers, quite hard, like a cat! I continued to scratch him for a good hour before putting him back in his cage, and he actually did NOT want to go back in.

It was a super sweet moment!!! He was so cute, rubbing against me, and now he is hanging out at the front of the cage!

Awesome bonding moment!
 
I know! I wasn't expecting this at all. When it was all said and done, I helped her remove most of her shedding skin, and she fell asleep on me while it was happening. I did this for over 2 hours lol! I think I just established a very good trust moment with him/her....

the cutest part was when I got to her lower back...she was arching her butt in the air like a cat lol
 
Poveglia said:
He is going through shedding, was extremely stressed and pacing his cage, rubbing against everything. So, I took him out, and he was very nervous at first.

I started to gently scratch him, and after about 1/2 hour, he started closing his eyes and rubbing against my fingers, quite hard, like a cat! I continued to scratch him for a good hour before putting him back in his cage, and he actually did NOT want to go back in.

It was a super sweet moment!!! He was so cute, rubbing against me, and now he is hanging out at the front of the cage!

Awesome bonding moment!
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nooooooooooooooo. noooooo no this again, please read about chameleon closing their Eyes. it is not what you Think.
 
Care to fill me in? I mean, the Chameleon was definitely rubbing against me, and it's color was not in any way changing to "stressed", in fact...it was quite obvious she was enjoying this.
 
Poveglia said:
Care to fill me in? I mean, the Chameleon was definitely rubbing against me, and it's color was not in any way changing to "stressed", in fact...it was quite obvious she was enjoying this.
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no this is beyond frustrating. you are on you own. do as you please with this, search and look it up. more than this I really do not have any wish to try to convince one more person about this.
 
wavingsnail said:
What happened here is what's BEEN happening here. People with no real understanding of the animal they're keeping post about their chameleon showing signs of stress and equating it with "bonding" and "love". Neither of these things is something a chameleon can experience.
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Please, can you and @leedragon explain instead of sounding mad? Some people will not go and search it on their own. To me, the way that you two came off was a bit harsh and turned me off. I get it, it's frustrating, but please don't take it out on others if they don't know what the problem is. Take that moment to educate them instead of sounding peed off. It'll come off across much better. I know you probably didn't mean to sound rude, but that's the tone that I read it in.
 
TheAmazingGerby said:
Please, can you and @leedragon explain instead of sounding mad? Some people will not go and search it on their own. To me, the way that you two came off was a bit harsh and turned me off. I get it, it's frustrating, but please don't take it out on others if they don't know what the problem is. Take that moment to educate them instead of sounding peed off. It'll come off across much better. I know you probably didn't mean to sound rude, but that's the tone that I read it in.
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Here's the thing:

While I understand that these are forums and are meant to be a pool of knowledge for chameleon keepers, it's very frustrating when members refuse to search things out at all.

A big problem is that many people graduate from beginner lizards like leopard geckos and beardies, who, to an extent, ARE capable of bonding with their keepers, so the assumption is that all lizards are the same and a chameleon will as well.

Unfortunately 99.9% of chameleons will never show anything other than basic recognition of their keeper, and that is because you have become a food source and a part of their environment.

Larger lizards like monitors, tegus and iguanas actually can show what could be described as bonding behavior with humans, and if anything, you can attribute that to their larger brains and the fact that they are not prey animals like chameleons.

Unfortunately chameleons basically exist in a state of fear and paranoia. The only defense they have is blending in and hoping to not be seen, so when that fails, they get incredibly stressed. A sure fire sign of stress in reptiles, but chameleons in particular, is closing their eyes. If they can't physically escape you, they will do the next best thing, which is closing their eyes to "shut you out" and eliminate the visual stressors.

Stress can be deadly in chameleons, and is something most of us here are keenly aware of and do not take lightly.
 
wavingsnail said:
Here's the thing:

While I understand that these are forums and are meant to be a pool of knowledge for chameleon keepers, it's very frustrating when members refuse to search things out at all.

A big problem is that many people graduate from beginner lizards like leopard geckos and beardies, who, to an extent, ARE capable of bonding with their keepers, so the assumption is that all lizards are the same and a chameleon will as well.

Unfortunately 99.9% of chameleons will never show anything other than basic recognition of their keeper, and that is because you have become a food source and a part of their environment.

Larger lizards like monitors, tegus and iguanas actually can show what could be described as bonding behavior with humans, and if anything, you can attribute that to their larger brains and the fact that they are not prey animals like chameleons.

Unfortunately chameleons basically exist in a state of fear and paranoia. The only defense they have is blending in and hoping to not be seen, so when that fails, they get incredibly stressed. A sure fire sign of stress in reptiles, but chameleons in particular, is closing their eyes. If they can't physically escape you, they will do the next best thing, which is closing their eyes to "shut you out" and eliminate the visual stressors.

Stress can be deadly in chameleons, and is something most of us here are keenly aware of and do not take lightly.
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Thank you. That was a lot better and educational!
 
First off "buddy", I have shown nothing but being open and receptive towards feedback and posts here, since this is my first chameleon, but I am no child and most likely have A LOT more experience with reptiles than you. Secondly, I would have been open to you "advice" if you two had given some...instead of raving like lunatics. I searched you and Lee's posts, and for such an important subject, you guys didn't post a lot on it that I can see. In fact, both of you had some very "noobish" comments in your beginnings.

Third, I 100% disagree with you about that "Unfortunately 99.9% of chameleons will never show anything other than basic recognition of their keeper". Back up any of your claims in actual science.

Now, I agree with you IF my chameleon was only closing their eyes, I can recognize when an animal is stressed (again, not my first reptile or pet). But the OTHER signs and actions that I had described were not in any way symptoms of a stressed pet.

Funny, I didn't realize there were so many herpetologists in these forums.....oh wait, you're most likely not and only relaying YOUR research with chameleons, which from the looks of it, started in 2016. So...yeah...troll elsewhere....
 
I think some of our frustration comes from the fact that we see the same problems over and over and over again and there is literally a search bar where people can easily find answers but so many members want information spoon fed to them. Not just people here happens everywhere
 
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Poveglia said:
First off "buddy", I have shown nothing but being open and receptive towards feedback and posts here, since this is my first chameleon, but I am no child and most likely have A LOT more experience with reptiles than you. Secondly, I would have been open to you "advice" if you two had given some...instead of raving like lunatics. I searched you and Lee's posts, and for such an important subject, you guys didn't post a lot on it that I can see. In fact, both of you had some very "noobish" comments in your beginnings.

Third, I 100% disagree with you about that "Unfortunately 99.9% of chameleons will never show anything other than basic recognition of their keeper". Back up any of your claims in actual science.

Now, I agree with you IF my chameleon was only closing their eyes, I can recognize when an animal is stressed (again, not my first reptile or pet). But the OTHER signs and actions that I had described were not in any way symptoms of a stressed pet.

Funny, I didn't realize there were so many herpetologists in these forums.....oh wait, you're most likely not and only relaying YOUR research with chameleons, which from the looks of it, started in 2016. So...yeah...troll elsewhere....
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And yet I'm the one "raving like a lunatic".

Funny that you were clever enough to search our individual post histories, but not the actual search function of the forum.

Good luck with your chameleon, lizard whisperer.
 
Nursemaia said:
I think some of her frustration comes from the fact that we see the same problems over and over and over again and there is literally a search bar were people can easily find answers but so many members want information spoon fed to them. Not just people here happens everywhere
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I agree with that. I even do it myself. I try to research before I ask, but if it's something medical and you're worried, it can be hard to take the time to sit and research instead of making a post and letting someone do the research for you
 
TheAmazingGerby said:
I agree with that. I even do it myself. I try to research before I ask, but if it's something medical and you're worried, it can be hard to take the time to sit and research instead of making a post and letting someone do the research for you
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I get that. Another source of frustration is people asking a question, not liking the answer they get, becoming argumentative and continuing to do what they had a question about in the first place.
 
Which I searched....I understand the eye closing thing (which I didn't search, since that was only a brief moment), but I did search the "rubbing against me like a cat", and didn't really see much for that.

Care to explain that behavior?

I'm not equating it to "affection"...I'm equating it to her being extremely itchy from the dry skin, and was obviously enjoying my scratches, to the point where she was "rubbing back" on my finger.

Also, I've been around reptile and pet owners for the last 25+ years, and I also can spot the difference between good, caring owners and the pet fanatics.......
 
wavingsnail said:
I get that. Another source of frustration is people asking a question, not liking the answer they get, becoming argumentative and continuing to do what they had a question about in the first place.
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Which I have NEVER done on these forums...until you and leedragon went batsh*t on me......
 
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