Petco Abuse

[Mendez]

Hello all,
There's a Petco nearby my house that has two adult Jackson's chameleons, one male and one female housed together in a cage. The cage is wider than it is tall, has no hiding places, and the female is visibly stressed. I know that you are not supposed to house adult chameleons together (exception for breeding, but even then, it's only for 1 night) because they will stress each other out. I first saw the chameleons together in the cage about 3 weeks ago and decided to go back today to see if they still were. There was only an old lady at the register and didn't want to bother her, I want to go back and do something.

Don't worry, I know not to buy the chameleons at full price (or close to it) because it only adds fuel to the fire. I know the first step would be to "educate" them, but I know for companies like these is that ignorance is bliss. I doubt they would act. Is there anything I could do? Negotiating tips? Why do pet stores sell animals? All there is is abuse: nocturnal leopard geckos exposed to full daylight during the day, chameleons with poor conditions, and arboreal lizards with no branches to climb.

Pics: Sorry for the glare
https://photos.app.goo.gl/w4WK2fZRhr7MHrk59
https://photos.app.goo.gl/YQJ7sQuBkgSZJrPx6
https://photos.app.goo.gl/hY2khhbKon475yrn8
https://photos.app.goo.gl/puqD9MFQiZ5EZzn69
https://photos.app.goo.gl/NopBFVJGunqZb7Nr7

P.S--I'm new to the forums, and I have a young Jackson's chameleon.

 

[JoshD49]

The Petco near my house has 2 Panthers housed together. One male and one female. They seem to be young still but have a similar cage setup as the one you saw including a water dish.

They had another cage with a female jackson in a wide cage and she had substrate all over her. I felt so bad. Again she had a water dish and a food dish with meal worms in it.

 

[Remkon]

If you go back make sure you can back up anything you van say with facts.
Most of the time the 'expert' in charge of reptiles will just deny your comment.
Keep it friendly, it's not about who's right but you want to get something done.

I once notified a caretaker in my local reptile store that one of the veileds was sleeping under the baskingspot amd that it wasn't a good sign. They were housed multiple together so he was probably stressed out. The guy denied it being a problem but did seperate him eventually with the excuse that he was getting to big anyways.

 

[waynek]

There are some problems in life that have no solutions. If they were housing a dog so incorrectly that it threatened the animals life something might be done. But to the corporation of petco it’s only a lizard

 

[waynek]

And if you get the aspca or some other type of animal humane group involved they will just use it as fodder for their reptiles shouldn’t be pets position

 

[Remkon]

And if you get the aspca or some other type of animal humane group involved they will just use it as fodder for their reptiles shouldn’t be pets position

Yea, it's kinda the problem with animal activists ... I love animals but I hate activists...
They treat animal needs the same as human needs which means their 'freedom' is important. They rather see a chameleon get picked from a tree by a bird of prey than see it live a long and healthy life in captivity... Go figure...

I'm willing to bet that most animals kept in captivity that get their basic needs and enough space to move around in have a better quality life than those in the wild where they have to compete for food and space, have periods of extreme weather and can fall prey to various predators.
But just because some folk decided animals should be in the wild everything other than that is bad, period, no discussion possible.

But I don't think we shouldn't do anything, because it won't help anyways...
I think we should keep doing what we're doing and tell people commercial stores are bad and point them in the direction of a breeder for their desired animal. People may purchase their first reptile at petco but may never again but a second reptile there if they know that they are contributing to animal cruelty when doing so...
Maybe someone can build a website like http://dontpurchaseatpet.co/petsmartalsosucks make sure it comes in the top10 results when you google anything reptile related and educate everyone that is considering purchasing a reptile and offer good alternatives.

 

[JoshD49]

Here is a veiled I have watched grow up at the petsmart near my house from a few months old to what you see now. Its always seems to be leaning on something and not sure what else could be wrong. The cage looks so small and I have only seen it walking once. Most of the time its like this.

 

[Remkon]

Here is a veiled I have watched grow up at the petsmart near my house from a few months old to what you see now. Its always seems to be leaning on something and not sure what else could be wrong. The cage looks so small and I have only seen it walking once. Most of the time its like this.

Given the red light over the enclosure it's probably exhausted because at night he won't be able to get a proper rest if that's turned on...

 

[JoshD49]

Her are the Panthers and the Jackson I was talking about at Petco. I forgot to mention they actually have a dripper but its just sitting on and dripping into a water dish haha. The substrate in the Jackson cage is a fine dirt like substance and it gets on the crickets when the Cham eats them.

 

[JoshD49]

Given the red light over the enclosure it's probably exhausted because at night he won't be able to get a proper rest if that's turned on...

Yeah I was wondering what the point of that bulb is but all of their cages have it no matter whats in it. I just assumed it was so they can switch out the animla inside and not have to change hardware. The cage is so small though. Its about 12" x 12". The cham is almost as long as it is wide. If I was pro with chams I would consider buying him just to help him out.

 

[Remkon]

Yeah I was wondering what the point of that bulb is but all of their cages have it no matter whats in it. I just assumed it was so they can switch out the animla inside and not have to change hardware. The cage is so small though. Its about 12" x 12". The cham is almost as long as it is wide. If I was pro with chams I would consider buying him just to help him out.

Red lights 9/10 times are used for heati g/lighting at night... Chameleons (and various other reptiles) need darkness to sleep l, they have a parietal eye on top of their head that will notice the light and keeps em from getting proper rest.

Even if it's difficult not to help the reptile out you still simply shouldn't. By helping this one you'll just help the store with their business and motivate them to restock. Better buy from a good breeder so you get a good healthy animal and you support the breeder to keep doing what he's doing.

 

[JoshD49]

Yeah I'm planning on going the breeder route I just meant if I could keep more then one I wanted to help the little guy out. I see what your saying by not giving money to the machine and will definitely not support them but it's hard to watch an animal suffer. I feel the same way when I see their cats. I'm glad Petco no longer carries salt water fish so at least someone got through to them about something.

 

[Virgil1972]

Sometimes the best thing to do for the animals at those stores is to just move on. I never buy animals from stores that don't take care of them, it just rewarded the stores for mistreating them. I have a theory that petco takes bad care of their animals so people feel bad for them and buy them.

 

[jamest0o0]

I first learned how terrible Petco was when I got in the saltwater hobby. Youd see tangs in 5g tanks covered in ich...

 

[JacksJill]

There are threads here were people had polite discussions with the pet store manager and things did change for the better. They no longer carry chameleons in that store. It's worth a try.
The water bowl while unnecessary and probably unsanitary is to keep people from constantly asking why they don't have any water for the chameleon. Apparently the general public does know that animals need water just not how it is best supplied.

 

[CamrynTheCham22]

I agree. This topic seems to have no valid argument for the side of Petco, yet they continue to neglect and mistreat their animals. I noticed that the Petco near me stopped carrying veiled chameleons. Though this seems good, they soon started carrying panther chameleons for over $230. Who would waste their money on an animal with no written history, susceptibility to illnesses and health problems (because of inadequate care and neglect), bad experiences with humans, unhealthy environment, etc.? It just boggles my mind. My heart goes out to all of those animals and people who are trying to better this situation.

 

[andrearamirezo91]

I agree. This topic seems to have no valid argument for the side of Petco, yet they continue to neglect and mistreat their animals. I noticed that the Petco near me stopped carrying veiled chameleons. Though this seems good, they soon started carrying panther chameleons for over $230. Who would waste their money on an animal with no written history, susceptibility to illnesses and health problems (because of inadequate care and neglect), bad experiences with humans, unhealthy environment, etc.? It just boggles my mind. My heart goes out to all of those animals and people who are trying to better this situation.

Most of the time it’s just ignorance.. sadly a lot of people that buy animals do it out of impulse.. they don’t really take their time to do proper research. These big stores also take advantage of people’s ignorance and keep treating animals the way they do because they can. It’s like the whole issue with poor betta fish. All stores will tell you they’ll survive in a .25g bowl with no filter and no heater so they can make the sale but that couldn’t be further from the truth

 

[Char333p]

I just got a chameleon a month ago or so... and i went to pick up some crix. Saw a ambilobe panther... i wanted to rescue it then and there.. he was so faded in color... had improper lighting ...a dripper hanging over a water bowl... poor thing was beautiful though..

 

[CamrynTheCham22]

I just got a chameleon a month ago or so... and i went to pick up some crix. Saw a ambilobe panther... i wanted to rescue it then and there.. he was so faded in color... had improper lighting ...a dripper hanging over a water bowl... poor thing was beautiful though..

That unfortunately is another way chain pet stores make their money. Whether the stores mean to or not, people see the poor conditions of their animals and buy them out of pity, therefore supporting the business, and reinforcing the idea that treating their animals abysmally will not keep people from buying them. It is just a sad, sad cycle that never ends well for the animal.

 

[Tucklander]

I know all to well about the big box store Cham...the manager who read my first guys vet report (vet put the chameleon to sleep) just said, would you like another one, we will have two in Tuesday or Wednesday or just your money back! No emotion, no I’m sorry I sold you a sick animal with MBD already started, no we will try to do better, nothing! It was just $$$. My new guy from FLCHAMS is doing great. I wish I’d have found the forums first, several of you breed and it would’ve been cool to keep up with the breeder. But Harry’s doing great ( so far, so good) . I hate I haven’t sourced feeders from non-big box pet store. Any suggestions? Crickets and worms online people have ordered? I don’t want to support PetSmart and Petco. And I am supporting both. As one is on my way home, and one is beside the grocery store...convenient but treat thier animals like absolute merchandise!