Repti-Glo 5.0's ?

[mikek]

Hi folks, I am looking for ANY feedback on Hagen Repti-Glo 5.0 linear flourescent bulbs. I am running into MBD issues with male panther chameleons (my females always seem fine, even when gravid). As far as I can tell, the MBD seems to be from TOO much D3. I ran into this issue two years ago with another male and came to the conclusion that I was supplementing too much Calcium w/ D3 while using these bulbs. I have since tried to regulate it and use Calcium once or twice a week and Calcium w/D3 once a week to every 10 days. I know that this may be a little too often (after talking with some other chameleon keepers), but is it enough to show signs of over supplementation ?
I have a hatchling as well and sadly discovered some bowing in his front limbs today. All of my other chams are in screen enclosures but this little guy has been raised in a 10 gallon tank. He (starting to look male) has his Repti-Glo 5.0 on 12 hours a day, as well as his incandescent 40 watt heat bulb. All of my veileds have been fine and I use stronger bulbs on them (Hagen Repti-Glo 8.0 or 10.0's). This has only shown up in two male panthers and now this 3 month juvenile.
I have really racked my brain over this one and am now starting to wonder if the bulbs are stronger than I realize or perhaps inferior to other brands. Please note these are the Hagen Repti-Glo's, not the Zoo Med Repti-Suns (which I now realize most people use). I am not out to slander any products, just want to come up with healthy solutions for my chameleons' well being.
Any input is greatly appreciated and I welcome pm's for those that may not wish to post publicly.

Kind regards,
Mike Knott

 

[sandrachameleon]

If anything, the ReptiGlo tubes (which I have historically used exclusively without issue) are less potent in the optimal UV range than the ReptiSun bulbs. I do not think using ReptiGlo tubes are likely to cause too much d3 in the system - the chameleon would move out of the UVB if it needed to (this assumes it can in your set-up).

how frequently do you change the tubes?

What brand of supplements do you use?

What insects do you use and What do you gutload the insects with?

 

[mikek]

Hi Sandra, Thanks for replying ! And yes, it's me, Mike K from Victoria. Here are some replies to your post :
1. Bulb was brand new
2. Supplements ;
Calcium (w/D3): - RepCal Calcium w/D3 (ultrafine)
- Miner-Al I (w/D3)
- Fluker's Calcium w/D3 (ultrafine)
Calcium :-Jurassi-Cal (my main source of Calcium for the
herps
-T-Rex 2:1 Calcium/Phosphorus powder
3. Gutload ; I was using Nutrafin fish flake food and potato slices until I spoke with you. As far as I can tell, the flakes didn't have any pre-formed vitamin A but to be safe I am now using Yam slices and Fluker's commercial gutlaod (until I can round up all of the ingredients to make my own).
Thanks for replying and any other info is appreciated.

 

[kinyonga]

This one?
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=17236

 

[summoner12]

sounds like all you give your guy a lot of D3.....

I like to use Reptisun lamps over the Reptiglo. The Reptisun lamps last a lot longer and have been shown to have a high yield of D3 processing.

Can you post some pics of your guy? Maybe it isn't a MBD issue?

 

[dodolah]

do you mind posting a picture of your enclosure?
I want to know how you set up the lights, the basking spot, and so on.
I agree.. essentially you have 3 sources of calcium with D3. that is a bit excessive.

 

[Vampire.queen]

I don't think ReptiGlo's are that bad- they are very common among the breeders in the Czech Republic and I haven't heard of a problem caused by the lack of UVB or something like that...

 

[summoner12]

I don't think ReptiGlo's are that bad- they are very common among the breeders in the Czech Republic and I haven't heard of a problem caused by the lack of UVB or something like that...

These lamps just don't last as long as a Reptisun.... It isn't that they are bad... just need to be replaced more often and positioned closer. The UVB drops off kinda fast. If the people using these lamps keeps up on the routine of changing them... there shouldn't be any issues.

 

[Vampire.queen]

Yeah, that's true- they have to be changed every 6 months.

I use Narva Reptilight 4%UVB.

 

[sandrachameleon]

I believe Mike doesnt use all the D3 products at once, but rather rotates. He has also said he decreased his use of D3 recently, to "Calcium w/D3 once a week to ten days"
Mike I think you could very well be right that you were providing too much D3 in the past, but your current schedule of approx three times a month should be okay - depends which of the products/brands you're now using.

If I recall correctly, Mike uses screen cages and its probable that some of the UVB is blocked by the density of that screen, which might make a ReptiGlo 8.0(changed every six months) or a reptiSUN 5.0 better choices than the ReptiGlo5. I have used Reptiglo 5.0s for more than ten years without issue, but I dont have screen blocking the UVB so I feel more is available to my chams. Using the ReptiGlo 5.0 with a dense screen probably indicates a need to use d3 a little more often.

Mike, next time I make a batch of dry gutload, I can double how much I make and share with you, if you like.

 

[Ryan123]

I heard the coiled Repti Glo 5.0 cause potential blindness and possible death to chameleons. Chameleons Northwest, where i bought my female panther morph cross, sent me articles about it.

 

[sandrachameleon]

Pretty sure He is using tubes, not CFLs

 

[jones5233]

I use Reptiglo 5.0 tubes and don't have any problem, reason 1 is only one place (50 miles away from me has them.) #2 is the reptisun is roughly $16 higher ( buy 2 reptiglos get one free lol)! The only problem i c is that i would go longer on the calcium with d3 dustings. i would recommend every 15 days(twice a month) a multivitamin every other d3 dusting(once a month). this is working well with me. I also use calcium without d3 5-6 times a week give or take a day. Hope this helps and good luck to u and ur cham.
-Eric

 

[mikek]

Thanks for the input, everyone. I will try to post pics of this hatchling's enclosure soon, as well as my adult cages (yes, sadly, I still have my Flexariums !).Sandra, you are right, I am not using any all of the Calcium w/ D3 products at once, simply using multiple brands and rotating them.
I unplugged my little guy's 5.0 three days ago and the difference is remarkable. He is more alert, more active, and as odd as it sounds the bowing of the limbs seems to have almost corrected itself ! Seriously, just three days ago he was starting to walk funny and his limbs were starting to show the bowing that a couple of my adult males developed and now he seems to be a whole lot better.
I have really tried to sincerely sort this issue out for a long time and truly believe it is an issue of TOO MUCH D3 that has caused this with my males. I have four adult female Paradalis (two beauties from Sandra, two from another well respected Canadian breeder) as well as adult veiled chameleons with NO MBD ISSUES. I have even rehabilitated a seriously ill veiled chameleon (male) that was slated for euthanasia due to his advanced MBD. It has only been the two male panthers and then the recent concern over this juvenile (who seems to be looking male).
I know that the Flexarium style cages aren't the best and I intend to upgrade to the aluminum frame style screen cages. Nonetheless, I change my 5.0's every four months ! I know this may seem wasteful but I re-use my bulbs on some of my geckos that have lesser D3 requirements.
Sandra, I would happily pitch in financially next time you make your gut load batches and really appreciate the offer.
I am now (by process of elimination) starting to wonder if I am simply coating my prey items (primarily crickets) way too much. I cut the frequency of Calcium w/D3 down, but admittedly coat them pretty thoroughly. Could this alone contribute to some of my problems ?
I thank everyone who has taken the time to read this thread, especially those of you with words of wisdom to share !