Rescue Veiled Chameleon - Help ME Help HIM!

[kimmytheriault]

First, I hope I am posting this is the correct place - if not I apologize in advance and just direct me in the correct place to post this! Second, I tend to be long winded so I am going to try to be as brief as possible while also giving as much information as needed so you guys can help me. Third, to all of the active members here who freely offer advice to those of us (myself included) who are novices (at best!) I thoroughly appreciate what you do. I am welcome to all advice! Freely tell me what I am doing wrong so that I can correct it and make everything RIGHT for this guy - I am NOT one of those who will ask for advice and not take it, or become offended when it is given. So, here's my story/questions. I will bold my questions so those of you who don't wish to read my WHOLE BOOK can just answer my questions. Thanks in advance!!

Approximately a week ago a childhood friend of mine went into work (she is a Veterinarian who specializes in household pets and has a passion for livestock). Upon pulling in she found a 20 gallon glass tank with substrate, barely any branches, and a veiled chameleon sitting on the edge of a feeding dish. He was truly a sad sight. (My profile picture is actually a picture of this guy when I first laid eyes on him.) Knowing that I often "foster" animals (we recently adopted a kitten with one eye from her) and that I used to own gargoyle & crested geckos (and have SOME LIGHT knowledge of reptiles) she asked me if I could take this guy in. I agreed. He was seen by a reptile specialist/vet from a neighboring town who gave him a clean bill of health, an approximate age range of 5-ish months, and confirmed his sex. And off he came to my house, where we spent the next few days attempting to create an environment for him to thrive in - which lead me all over the internet in a mad dash to understand veiled chameleon husbandry - which is COMPLETELY different than gargoyle geckos (obviously). And, so here I am. Trying like hell to make sure this guy gets exactly what he deserves since the first few months of his life have clearly been stressful - something this guy doesn't deserve!

This is what we have done so far, and I just want confirmation from SOMEONE that we are on the right path OR, if not, steer us that way. We've already fell in love with this little dude (who my daughter quickly named "Custard") and decided this will be his home - he doesn't deserve to be shuffled around, or G-d forbid, discarded on another doorstep. This is where you come in - and that way you can help me save his guy and give him a quality existence!

Enclosure/Humidity?Temperature:
He now has a screened cage (I already forgot the dimensions of it - oops. I'll post pictures though so you can see if the size is appropriate). My husband is a computer programmer who devised a misting apparatus out of an ardunio, tubing, and a tank. It is currently set to mist his enclosure once an hour for approximately 20 seconds - this seems to be getting all of the leaves thoroughly misted (as I know chameleons won't drink from standing water.) Is this misting regimen too often, or not enough? We also have a spray bottle to spray the "cage" in between if it needs it and a "little dripper" which appears to have been a waste of money because I'm convinced it does absolutely nothing. As for Lighting he has a basking bulb that sits directly on the top of the change pretty close from where he sits on a synthetic vine, what should the distant be between the basking lamp and the vine to bask on? Is it possible that he could become burned by this? He then has a UVB Bulb that is situated on the back of his cage - I tried to get a hold of my husband to find out the exact wattage and output of this bulb because I do not know off the top of my head, but he isn't answering. Can you tell me what the proper amount is and I will update this thread with that info when I have it. The humidity ranges from 50-80% (usually it is around 65%) is that too large of a range - it is usually less humid early morning and during the night? If so, what would be the ideal humidity level? Temperature is approximately 80 degrees during the day and it can get down as low as 55 at night - is that too low? If so, what can I use to make sure it doesn't get too low at night? I understand that are bothered by "night lights" and the "red" night bulbs I traditionally used with my gecko's don't work with cham's. So, I'm slightly worried about that - although since it is summer right now I'm more worried about it in the upcoming months that this exact moment.

Plants:
He has a mixture of synthetic plants (plastic) and live ones - he has a hibiscus, a ficus, a Schefflera. I believe these plants are okay - as I looked at the list prior to my husband purchasing them - BUT I wanted to clarify since the internet can sometimes be misleading, or flat out wrong. Are these plants poisonous or are they fine? He also has varying sized sticks for climbing. The bottom of the cage is either lined with paper towel or nothing - we got rid of the substrate. We never used it with the gecko's for fear of compaction - was this the correct move for a cham?

Feeding:
So, he was clearly eating super worms, because these were what was in his dish when he was found. He has since decided that he will NOT eat ANY super worms at all and has decided that ONLY crickets are okay. I would like to make sure he has a well rounded diet, so what else should I be feeding him and how often? He is currently eating approximately 8 crickets a day (they have been "gut loaded" with sweet potato and a commercial cricket food). Should I use the commercial one, or stay away from it? What else should I feed these crickets to ensure he is getting the proper nutrients from them? Also, I am not currently, but should I be, dusting them with calcium even though he is a male? (I read online this is only pertinent with females.) Is that wrong? I'm truly concerned about the feeding - he is a ravenous feeder, but ONLY crickets! Any advice? (On a side note: My gecko's preferred fruits and MRP and although they ate crickets, it was more of a "treat" that they truly weren't even that interested in and a lot of the times I would find myself removing uneaten ones from the cage so I am NOT well versed AT ALL on proper cricket feeding/keeping.)

Frankly, this is becoming quite long and in fear of annoying the whole community I am going to cut it short here and just post some pics. Any and ALL advice is appreciated. Any answers to ANY questions is GREATLY APPRECIATED! If I am currently doing ANYTHING that can harm my chameleon PLEASE LET ME KNOW AND DON'T HOLD BACK. I am a big girl, and after reading a few of these threads I see that some individuals get their panties in a bundle after being corrected, I won't do that. I am honestly looking for help - so lay into me! It's the best way I can learn! I'm mostly concerned with the feeding and lighting - so help me out!

PS - Sorry the pictures aren't the best quality but I am still trying not to stress him out even more. He also shred ALL of his skin within the first few days of being here - is that nerves that caused that or just normal shedding? You can see the remnants of the shed on his crest.

 

[JGspecial]

awesome job so far. no lights at night, if it drops below 55-60 at night you can use a ceramic heater if you wish. as for feeders there are many sponsors on this forum who sell a plethora of feeders you can have delivered to you that you can try. some are horn worms, wax worms, phoenix worms, butter worms, dubia roaches, superworms (way better than mealworms) silk worms, walking sticks, ect........id mist more like 3-5 times a day for a longer period, say like for 2-4 minutes. for your size cage id use a 100 watt basking bulb and you want to have it at least 8 inches from him. have an area where he can bask that is isolated from the reast of the cage and let your uvb bulb be the focal point of his lighting needs. he needs to be able to get away from the extra heat and cool down. these are some of my thoughts but others will chime in who are more experienced. for me personally, drippers are useless if you have a misting system anyway, if the cage gets soaked, they will drink. the plants you have are fine. also veiled chams can eat plants too, you may be able to get him to eat some if you put out a cup of them. there is a list somewhere for the stuff he will potentially eat but i dont know what they are because mine wont eat any of it and i gave up on it. i dust my feeders every other feeding with repashy calcium plus lo D, but others have a different regimen.

 

[bobcochran]

Mist for longer and less often, you would like the cage to dry between mistings, especially with calyptratus.
Basking spot temps around 85f.. Yes, they will get burns if too close to the heat bulb! Veils can tolerate a pretty wide range in humidity-yours are fine. Create a temperature gradient with the cage, warmer at the top cooler toward the bottom, then he can choose temperature at any given time. Your night time temps are fine. Plants are all good. No substrate is great. Variety in diet is key for both food prey items and gut loads. Be sure to use calcium without D3 most feelings while he is growing, and calcium with D3 and vitamin supplement ~ twice a month.

Check the resources tap at the top of this page for complete care.

 

[kimmytheriault]

Thanks so much for both of your quick responses! I will definitely move his basking light up to at least eight inches from his vine immediately. I'll also have my husband change the settings on the mister - I didn't know the cage should be getting completely dry between mistings, so that is a HUGE help. We'll play around with the settings until it is thoroughly wetting his enclosure and then thoroughly drying between mistings! We will definitely do both of those things tonight. I'll also make sure to click around on the forum to find those individuals who sell feeders get some more info and probably purchase some- what would be amazing! I will also make sure to get a calcium supplement without D3 for everyday feedings and one with D3 to use twice a month - are there any good brands you guys recommend? I will also make sure to pick up another temperature gauge so that I can make sure that there is a definitive gradient between the top of the cage and the bottom - thankfully right now the bottom seems well shaded while the top appears sunny so I am hopeful that I have already been providing that (but if not I will quickly change that!)

I hope you both realize how much I appreciate these quick responses and advice!

 

[leslievilarino]

Here are two care sheets with lots of very helpful info-
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/entry/veiled-chameleon-care-sheet.395/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/entry/veiled-chameleon-care-sheet-part-2.396/

 

[leslievilarino]

I personally purchased Sticky Tongue Farms Outdoor Calcium without D3, Reptivite without D3, and Repticalcium with D3. I have heard lots of good things about each of these products

 

[jajeanpierre]

It looks like you've got a very good start with him. Congratulations on your new boy.

Veileds are really forgiving and if you start with a healthy one, they are tough as nails.

I am sure you are reading that they really are not pets that should be handled as that causes a lot of stress. Chameleons don't always show their stress when being handled. I have many adult wild caughts who sit very calmly on my hand only a day or two out of the box they were shipped in to America from Africa. They don't try to flee (although some do) and sit calmly on my hand. It is easy to misinterpret their apparent calmness and lack of fighting or fleeing with enjoying being on my hand. Nothing can be further from the truth! I'm sure they are just waiting for me to kill them. Stress suppresses the immune system, so if you can reduce the stresses on the animal, you will have a healthier animal.

You won't need any extra heat at night. A previous poster suggested additional heat at night at 55F to 60F. Veiled come from areas that go below freezing at night in the winter. I'm sure they don't like it in the 40sF but they handle it quite well as long as they can heat up sufficiently during the day.

I would also recommend he get natural sunlight as much as possible. They don't seem to like to bask when it is at the hottest part of the day, but will bask in the morning. No UVB bulb made can replicate natural sunlight.

You mentioned that he had just shed. New imports will always shed right after import. I think they get dehydrated during import (four or five days in a box with no water) and once they hydrate, they immediately shed. Perhaps he was dehydrated before you got him and then once hydrated did the same thing the wild caught imports do--he shed.

Good luck and welcome to Chameleon Forums.

 

[JGspecial]

yeah jajeanpierre, i dont usually use heat emitters either for my veiled. i was just suggesting, just thinking of things that popped into my head forgetting about a veileds native climate changes. i have a few different species and where i have them we get cold winters and the temp drops at night considerably so using a space heater in the room or having a backup heat emitter isnt a very bad idea. youre right though, a bit drastic for this type of cham.

 

[kimmytheriault]

Thank you SO much EVERYONE! I am sorry I am just replying now but I did read these comments over the weekend and implemented all of the measures - I've been trying like hell to get everything perfect! I'm hoping we are almost there because I would like to allow him to settle. We purchased the above mentioned supplements and rush ordered them - they should arrive at some point today - as our local pet store did not carry the brands and I really wanted to make sure he had top notch products. I am gut loading the crickets with sweet potato as well as leafy greens, and once the supplements arrive I will start with those as well. I have also purchased some hornworms - and over time I will purchase other insects. Our lighting is up to standard. Everything seems to be in place for him to finally get settled. I even have a journal next to his enclosure so I can write down what he is eating, when, poop, demeanor, etc. (Just because since he is new I am having a hard time deciding what is "normal" and what is "stress" or problematic behaviors.)

I did read that they dislike handling - and it's funny because what was said is pretty much him to a T. Some days he seems calm when i am adjusting things in his enclosure and other times he hisses, puffs up, and runs away. We haven't yet taken him out for "pleasure" - he has only been handled when seeing the vet, removing him from his glass enclosure to place him in this one, and one other time when I was trying to place a new heat sensor (for the new thermometer we bought) in his basking area. Although, all that aside, I am currently a bit worried though, as his poops do not appear to have much urea in them (i hope i am using the correct terminology). There is very little white at the end of them and the "white" is more of a yellowish color. I tend to be a bit of a neurotic individual when it comes to my animals - so I don't know if this is me being myself or if he is slightly dehydrated. He did have a fecal test at his original appointment about a week and a half ago and everything seemed fine, but that was prior to his being moved into his current enclosure. My friend who is a vet is coming over tomorrow morning to check him out and make sure everything is still going well - I'm sure if she is concerned she will send us over to the specialist who saw him in the first place. So I'm trying to tell myself that today to make myself feel better. (Just to clarify though, he is acting completely normal, albeit moving a bit slower than previously but I don't know if that is because he is becoming acclimated to our movements around his cage or what.. the first few days here he would make a mad dash to the nearest vine that brought him up. Now he just peers disapprovingly at us and maybe slowly moves! He is eating normally, but is moving slower to catch the crickets as well. And he is still catching the "superworms" biting them in half and then leaving them along the bottom of the cage.)

Any thoughts? Thanks again for the previous advice! IT all came in handy!

 

[kimmytheriault]

This is how custard is looking today! I'm kinda worried about him though so I am posting something in the health forum. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

 

[alphakenc]

This is how custard is looking today! I'm kinda worried about him though so I am posting something in the health forum. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Put that dripper on top of the screen cage,he might learn to drink from it,u need the white urate to show he is hydrated.
Some of the cham will purposely kill a feeder n not even eating it after,maybe he just can't stand any "intruder" in his territory castle,no big deal.

 

[kimmytheriault]

Put that dripper on top of the screen cage,he might learn to drink from it,u need the white urate to show he is hydrated.
Some of the cham will purposely kill a feeder n not even eating it after,maybe he just can't stand any "intruder" in his territory castle,no big deal.

Thanks so much for the advice! We just put the dripper on the top of the cage and forced the tube in. I didn't end up writing in the forum, just called the vet instead. He had another fecal exam, I was told he appears hydrated, and ultimately he was given a clean bill of health, and I a stern talking to about not being so neurotic.

Thanks again for the continued help and support. It means a lot, especially because I tend to work myself up over nothing!


(And as to the killing a feeder and not eating it - this is his favorite past-time with superworms.. but we hardly use them anymore.. moved on to crickets, dubia's, and hornworms.)

 

[alphakenc]

Thanks so much for the advice! We just put the dripper on the top of the cage and forced the tube in. I didn't end up writing in the forum, just called the vet instead. He had another fecal exam, I was told he appears hydrated, and ultimately he was given a clean bill of health, and I a stern talking to about not being so neurotic.

Thanks again for the continued help and support. It means a lot, especially because I tend to work myself up over nothing!

Pleasure will be all mine,Im glad I can help a bit,together we all here learn n share our experience,Im glad ur cham pass the fecal test