some nice pictures....
- Thread starter kameleons jvo
- Start date
kameleons jvo
Avid Member
How do you get wild caught Furcifer balteatus?
All animals have paperwork!
kameleons jvo
Avid Member
all animals have correct paperwork,i dont see any problem of building up a stable breeding group of certain species in captivity.
leedragon
Chameleon Enthusiast
Kent67
Retired Moderator
Really? Please explain your logic here because I don't get it. Are you saying you don't see any difference between wild caughts with quotas that have a track record of sustainability vs. paying criminals to smuggle species that were suspended from trade in an attempt to protect wild populations?
leedragon
Chameleon Enthusiast
taking animals from the wild change the natural balance of the populations, to protect the animals you either get CB animals or you can visit them in the natural enviroment
Motherlode Chameleon
Chameleon Enthusiast
Isn't that is what is happening though? The gravid females have been collected from the wild? I know Europe and Asia go by a different set of rules compared to the USA however if these Furcifer balteatus are not smuggled (which is highly dubious as they are an IUCN Red List endangered species and always have been known as difficult to keep incaptivity) I would request a picture of CITES documents to shut up all the critics. Preferably with the signing CITES officials name on the document.
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kameleons jvo
Avid Member
ALL my animals have paperwork were you can trace them to the original import(yellow CITES paper with import number)plus i got a yearly control by Belgium FOD Wildlife who controls if everything goes by all regulations!!
So people who have their doubts or have problems with jealousy are not my problem
More of these post and i quit this threat ok
leedragon
Chameleon Enthusiast
ALL my animals have paperwork were you can trace them to the original import(yellow CITES paper with import number)plus i got a yearly control by Belgium FOD Wildlife who controls if everything goes by all regulations!!
So people who have their doubts or have problems with jealousy are not my problem
More of these post and i quit this threat ok
no trying to offend you jurgen, I know you are a respectable chameleon keeper, I was just discussion the wild caught topic it appear on the thread
kameleons jvo
Avid Member
I'm not pointing at you leedragon and i understand your discussion.
The point is if you have animals without legal paperwork where officials cant trace them to original imports you working illegal and am against it!
If you have all paperwork including official import cites papers and proof of breeding plus you are conform EU regulations you have 100 percent legal animals!!
This makes the big difference,i'm not gonna keep any further discussions about this everything i want to say i have sad.
This threat is ment to give info about keeping and breeding rare chameleon species in Europe and i want to keep it that way!
Kent67
Retired Moderator
Ah, yes, the jealousy reasoning. Where have I heard that before? Sorry, Jurgen, I have a long history of voicing my opinion against smuggling chameleons. It's not something new and I'm not trying to pick on you alone. There are plenty of species available to keep; why is it so necessary to have the ones you're not supposed to have? If I'm jealous, then how is that for selfish? Whether you have CITES "papers" for them or not (and aren't those banned from import by the EU, anyway?) isn't really the issue. It's the knowledge that Furcifer balteatus hasn't been legally exported from Madagascar to another CITES member nation in 19 years. Now some adult, even gravid, show up with cbb "papers?" I think we know better, don't we? I apologize if I have offended you but I am offended by smuggling protected, especially endangered, chameleons. I can't help it.
Sorry, Jurgen, I have a long history of voicing my opinion against smuggling chameleons. It's not something new and I'm not trying to pick on you alone. There are plenty of species available to keep; why is it so necessary to have the ones you're not supposed to have? If I'm jealous, then how is that for selfish? Whether you have CITES "papers" for them or not (and aren't those banned from import by the EU, anyway?) isn't really the issue. It's the knowledge that Furcifer balteatus hasn't been legally exported from Madagascar to another CITES member nation in 19 years. Now some adult, even gravid, show up with cbb "papers?" I think we know better, don't we? I apologize if I have offended you but I am offended by smuggling protected, especially endangered, chameleons. I can't help it.
leedragon
Chameleon Enthusiast
well if anyone wants to see for themself if the animals you are buying are legal I think jurgen can give you a copy of the papers and you can look it up yourself? he has paper of the legality of the animals, and you don´t really have proof of that those animlas are smuggled
kameleons jvo
Avid Member
Like a said before from all the species i'm keeping i have all necessary paperwork.
I have regularly control by FOD wildlife and everything is perfect legal.
I'm selling and exporting chameleons all over the world do you really believe CITES bureau will give me export permits if you cant proof the origin of your original breeding stock,Jezus
Like i said before i'm gone quit talking about this issue,you are free to think and believe what you want off course.
I have regularly control by FOD wildlife and everything is perfect legal.
I'm selling and exporting chameleons all over the world do you really believe CITES bureau will give me export permits if you cant proof the origin of your original breeding stock,Jezus
Like i said before i'm gone quit talking about this issue,you are free to think and believe what you want off course.
kameleons jvo
Avid Member
First an for all a Merry Christmas to all of you
And for all the non believers here are some pictures of European breeding succes with Furcifer Baltaetus
Enjoy.....
Digging female...
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
And for all the non believers here are some pictures of European breeding succes with Furcifer Baltaetus
Enjoy.....
Digging female...
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
kameleons jvo
Avid Member
kameleons jvo
Avid Member
