naterowley
Avid Member
Oh no Sonny I'm so sorry 
I know how much you love your scaly kids <3
Be kind to yourself during this time
I know how much you love your scaly kids <3 Be kind to yourself during this time
Sudden deaths
- Thread starter Sonny13
- Start date
Sonny13
Chameleon Enthusiast
Thank you, will doOh no Sonny I'm so sorry
Be kind to yourself during this time
TheMotherChameleon
Established Member
I’m so sorry you had to go through this. 
R.I.P Archi.
R.I.P Archi.
Sherbertsmysunshine
Chameleon Enthusiast
elizaann2
Chameleon Enthusiast
Oh my goodness, I am so heartbroken reading this. I am so sorry for your loss. What an impossible situation to be in. Sending you all the love and hugsI’m sorry I need to actualize this thread again and I needed time to recover from the shock and I’m still full in grief. We lost our beautiful Archi boy out of nothing!!Still can’t believe it!! Nothing was wrong with him and he was on the edge of shedding. Saturday we finally had some warm and sunny weather, perfect weather for the crew to go outside. Therefore, it was Archi’s and Neo’s turn to get their olive tree sunshine. After 1 hour I went inside (got full view on them from the 1st floor) to warm up dinner and I had constant observation on them and they stayed at place basking. Before I went inside, I checked on them and Archi was fully active constantly scanning, normal colors and nothing out of the ordinary. On the other hand because he needed to start with his shed, every few minutes he would bloat his gular and open his mouth for a few seconds (typical yawning). This last time, because the light breeze, a leaf was blown in his mouth while yawning and got stock on his tongue, which I removed (maybe he did shoot for a bug). After 10 maybe 15 minutes inside, I came back checking on them (still basking at the same spot) but now I noticed Archi’s eye was closed and when I checked closer I saw a small twig of the olive tree, square, in his mouth, it was probably blown in his mouth again while yawning or he did shoot for a bug again. But saw also lots of saliva around his mouth, I removed the twig which was also stuck to his tongue and this is when he started making strange movements with tongue (pushing upwards) and started biting his own tongue. This was when realized something bad is going on, so I took him out of the tree and he already was a bit lethargic but still biting his tongue, tried several times to open his mouth, where he bit me with full force (missing skin on my fingertips). And kept pushing his tongue against his palate, during this his colors weren’t distressed nor were his eyes detracted (at some point they did, but returned). After some time moving around with his tongue, I even watered tongue and tried to push his tongue completely in his mouth so he couldn’t bite it. Somewhere in between his tongue fell out completely (like paralyzed) and I carefully move it back inside folding it back over his hyoid bone, but his hyoid horn kept pointing upwards. During this still no eyes pulled in, therefore giving me hope. Even tried mouth-to-mouth resuscitation, in the thought he maybe had struggling with breathing. He only opened once his eyes, had completely weak grip but could bite me with full force. I think after 40 minutes his eyes went to death mode and I couldn't get any reaction anymore, then he overstretched himself twice, arching his back and that was it, I lost him
So what the hell happened??!! I just don’t know!! From alive and well till death within 45 minutes. I’m thinking of 3 options:
1) Somehow the twigs of olive trees are poisonous
2) Some kind insect bit him on his tongue, ants are always present in tree and also bees where flying around and he had an anaphylactic shock
3) Or.........it had to do with his first time real UVB
I’m such a mess right now, Archi was the last one I expected to leave us, he was just year and the youngster of the crew.
It took me hours to finally burry him next to Cher.
Poor boy I failed you, R.I.P. Archibald
My boy’s last picture being alive
View attachment 354386
After he passed away (so unreal and still as handsome)
View attachment 354387
Lindasjackson
Chameleon Enthusiast
@Sonny13 I and Eustis are so sorry to hear of your loss of Archi! There was nothing you could have done to prevent this but I know it hurts! You and your family are in my prayers. Hold your sweet memories of him in your heart. I lost two Jackson’s years ago when I first tried my hand at keeping them and I still remember the joy and wonder they brought me! I hold them in my heart to.
You said…”1) Somehow the twigs of olive trees are poisonous
2) Some kind insect bit him on his tongue, ants are always present in tree and also bees where flying around and he had an anaphylactic shock
3) Or.........it had to do with his first time real UVB”…I suppose the first two are possibilities…not thinking the 3rd option is though.
I do know that it’s not unusual for chameleons to do things like that with the tongue when they are dying though.
I’m still looking into it to see if I can give you an answer.
Don’t blame yourself…we only have so much control over what happens…and I know you do all you can to give them a good life…keep him in your heart.
2) Some kind insect bit him on his tongue, ants are always present in tree and also bees where flying around and he had an anaphylactic shock
3) Or.........it had to do with his first time real UVB”…I suppose the first two are possibilities…not thinking the 3rd option is though.
I do know that it’s not unusual for chameleons to do things like that with the tongue when they are dying though.
I’m still looking into it to see if I can give you an answer.
Don’t blame yourself…we only have so much control over what happens…and I know you do all you can to give them a good life…keep him in your heart.
Sonny13
Chameleon Enthusiast
So sorry for your loss... He was absolutely gorgeous and you did all you could to give him a good life
I’m so sorry you had to go through this.
I'm so sorry @Sonny13 It's horrible how fast they can go... Praying you find peace knowing you were the best cham parents Archi could ask for ❤
Oh Sonny, I’m so sorry to hear this
Archi was so fortunate to be in your care for the time he had here on earth . My heart breaks for you and your family. Sending you a huge hug.
Thank you all for your kind wordsYou said…”1) Somehow the twigs of olive trees are poisonous
2) Some kind insect bit him on his tongue, ants are always present in tree and also bees where flying around and he had an anaphylactic shock
3) Or.........it had to do with his first time real UVB”…I suppose the first two are possibilities…not thinking the 3rd option is though.
I do know that it’s not unusual for chameleons to do things like that with the tongue when they are dying though.
I’m still looking into it to see if I can give you an answer.
Don’t blame yourself…we only have so much control over what happens…and I know you do all you can to give them a good life…keep him in your heart.
We'll get over it by time.........Hopefully my boy finds Cher in her cloud tree and they both can snack on silks while watching down on us 
Sonny13
Chameleon Enthusiast
Thank you for your feedback and research
CalamityCrow
Avid Member
Adding data points to this thread... My cham Boogie was just about a year old when he suddenly died. I got an exotics forensics pathologist to do a necropsy and I've attached the report. I checked on my little guy at least 2x a day and never saw any signs of gout or infection. It's possible it was a congenital issue, or possibly humidity too low (it IS hard to keep things humid in the desert though I think I got it dialed in after a month or two of keeping here), or any combo of things. I hope this is useful for folks - They sure do hide their ailments very well. I *may* have been able to spot it earlier if I'd regularly weighed him, but maybe not. Life is fleeting, friends - hug your loved ones and give love to your chams. <3
elizaann2
Chameleon Enthusiast
Thank you so much for sharing
dinomom
Chameleon Enthusiast
Thank you so much for sharing. You would not have been able to discern the visceral gout. And bacterial infections are always possible. Either of which could have started at the breeder. Hopefully your mind is eased somewhat and you can know that you are an extremely responsible keeper.
GrannyK
Chameleon Enthusiast
Thank you for sharing this!! I lost a panther last year around this time with a very similar situation. I feel like it hurts more when it happens so quick. Glad you have some sort of answers and had the necropsy done on him. I’m still kicking myself I didn’t request one.
CalamityCrow
Avid Member
Yeah, I think some of dealing with my guilt was an extreme need TO KNOW. I'm very blessed I'm in a financial space to be able to get those questions answered, and I wanted to make sure I shared it with everyone here so hopefully they could benefit too. Perhaps your panther also suffered something similar - Try not to feel too guilty that you didn't... Can't change the past! But at least you know you gave your cham a good life for as long as he was able to live.
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