Surprise Babies

[v zoo]

W got a female Jackson Chameleon about 4 months ago. She surprised us with babies a few days ago. We have 9 babies that we have separated from mom into a 10 gallon tank with lots of foliage. We have been able to keep the temp at 75-78 during the day and it doesn't drop below 65 at night. We are having a harder time keeping the humidity up (any suggestions would be greatly appreciated). We are also not sure how to make sure the babies are getting enough to eat. We are feeding them fruit flies. We live in North Dakota and are our area does not have a lot of pet stores that carry many reptile products. Any websites to order things through would also be appreciated. Any advice is welcome! We are doing our best to keep the babies alive and so far they are active and learning. Thank you.

 

[York1]

I just finished raising and rehoming 6 surprise jacksons.
You can order fruit fly cultures from www.joshsfrogs.com and pinhead crickets from ghann.com. You are going to need alot of bugs to keep the babies fat and happy. Also make sure you are misting them as many times a day as possible without flooding them out. If the babies stay hydrated the humidity shouldnt cause any trouble. In my reptile room the humidity stays around 30% and I was misting them 5-6 times a day. The cage would go as high as 80% during the mistings and then drop as low as 30-40% between mistings

 

[kplatvoet]

Have you seen this- it helped me a lot when I got my baby
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKTbUaOQ0aA - it was done by a member here.
Fruit flies
https://www.chameleonforums.com/fruit-fly-culturing-12441/?highlight=fruit+culturing-
When they get a bit older (3 or 4 weeks) try some stabble flies from mantisplace.com

 

[kplatvoet]

I had one more thought from your original post - The temps that jacksons in the wild of Kenya have at night are in the low 50's - my little girl (I got her at 2 weeks) actually was more active and hungrier when the lights came on when the temps went lower at night - I wouldn't try to keep them above 65 i would keep them above 50-
- and be careful with supplements especially D - jacksons need less than panthers and babies are more sensitive

 

[Action Jackson]

I had one more thought from your original post - The temps that jacksons in the wild of Kenya have at night are in the low 50's - my little girl (I got her at 2 weeks) actually was more active and hungrier when the lights came on when the temps went lower at night - I wouldn't try to keep them above 65 i would keep them above 50-
- and be careful with supplements especially D - jacksons need less than panthers and babies are more sensitive

Great advice!

 

[junglefries]

Order the small repashy fruit fly culture mix. Use some of the original flies you bought to start off a new culture or two. In about two weeks, the new ones will produce flies. Jax grow slowly. Therefore you will need the flies longer than with other chams. By the time your first culture starts to dry out, the next one(s) will be at full strength. I always keep one culture going for emergencies. Especially with female jax, i have had several surprise litters.

 

[v zoo]

Thank you.

Thank you all for the advice.

What do you feel is better for babies screen cage or tank? I have them in a 10 gallon tank now. If screen what's the best way to keep fruit files in?

Always open to more advice.

 

[Lovereps]

I have raised more than 50 Jackson's babies in these http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000OAYXTK/ref=wms_ohs_product?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I had them in groups of under 10 per terrarium, FWIW.

They are superior to glass aquaria because the are ventilated for proper air movement.
I would imagine that a very small fan, like the type for a computer processor, if on a screen to keep chams away from it and positioned so it sucks air out of a tank might be doable but I did not want to risk it.
It is my suspicion that a large number of the mysterious Jackson's baby deaths are actually due to long-term low level dehydration.
As I am not a biologist doing studies, I may be wrong but it is a strong suspicion of mine.

Feeding lots of fruit flies is essential while they are neonates.
They are growing quickly for their species and need far more food than you might guess.
Josh's Frogs has been a very reliable source of top quality, nutritious, large flightless fruit fly cultures. You can order producing cultures, supplies and non-producing cultures.
I prefer the Hydei above the melanogaster, as Hydei are a bit larger.
For immediate needs buy actively producing cultures because you will otherwise be waiting 3 weeks for them to hatch out for Hydei 2 weeks to hatch Melanogaster.
I love that if you order before 4PM their time (EDT) they ship the same day
http://www.joshsfrogs.com/food-nutrition/feeder-insects-supplies/fruit-flies-culturing-supplies-2/fruit-fly-cultures-2.html
I am in the suburbs of NYC and even here there is a lack of large cultures of flightless fruit flies in the local shops.
I'll post more later.

 

[Lovereps]

What do you feel is better for babies screen cage or tank? I have them in a 10 gallon tank now. If screen what's the best way to keep fruit files in?
QUOTE]

Only the finest screening keeps fruit flies in. The Exo-Terra that I linked to above has a nice fine mesh top. I've used the 18x18x24 size with 2 or more small umbrella plants (schefflera arboricola) .
For horizontal basking and to help them move around from one side to the other , I pushed about two dozen bamboo shish kabob skewers into the foam background that comes with the terraria.
Fruit flies will inevitably escape anyway but a finer mesh minimizes the escapee rate.

My absolute favorite time of day is their bedtime, when they all hang from the ends of leaves like miniature, living Christmas tree ornaments.

Different people have had success using different types of enclosures.
I don't know if jdog/rawg277201 (of youtube video/chamforum fame) started his baby Jackson's out in other enclosures or if he was able to find a small enough mesh to contain the feeders.

The first month they dined solely on Josh's Frogs Hydei cultures--aside from the initial Petco tiny melanogaster culture. Josh's Frogs uses a culture medium designed for optimal nutrition.
When temps were too cold for cultures to be shipped, I was able to source some from SnailTail who is on Long Island.
I also liked the cultures from New England Herpetoculture http://www.neherpetoculture.com/bugs as they were productive and use Repashy media or their own formulation.
Josh's Frogs allows you to specifically order producing cultures.

For true pinhead size crickets, which I only used after they were a month or so
old , my favorite source is https://www.armstrongcrickets.com/ because they are they true domestic brown cricket, which is less aggressive and bitey than many other cricket species.

Line the bottom of your enclosure with paper towels because they will make it easy to keep the cage immaculately clean, can easily be changed and will help hold a bit of the humidity in. You don't want the paper towels drenched and you don't want poops to accumulate.

I did not use any heat light, as room temps were typically about 68-72 , so all the lighting was 6 month old long fluorescent Reptisun 5.0 bulbs. This emitted enough heat for digestion and enough UVB for good health.

Rather than guessing where humidity levels are, an inexpensive thermometer/hygrometer like this lets you know when you need to mist again http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0013BKDO8/ref=wms_ohs_product?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Just remember to remove it while you mist or you'll need to buy another.
I made sure that for the first 3 months or so, there was plenty of food present during all waking hours.
This way, by the time the fat, gluttonous ones have had their fill, the more timid, skinnier ones had gotten to fill their bellies too.

They can stay together for a few months but typically should be separated into individual enclosures at around 3-4 months of age.

An adjustable hand mister from Home Depot works great since it allows you to spray the finest mist while they are babies and to mist larger droplets when they are older.

You will probably need to spray them with a fine mist 3 or 4 times daily for several minutes to ensure that everyone drinks enough.
Even the Jackson's babies take a while before their brains tell them they need to drink.

Having read on the forums in the past that you will drown babies if you spray them directly, I will tell you that having sprayed all of the babies from the beginning with a fine mist resulted in exactly zero drowning.

I also think it is bad for a few reasons to have plenty of feeders running around the enclosure with have nothing for them to eat.
Keep a bit of fresh bug food in each day, so the feeders remain nutritious.

Others may have had success using other types of enclosures and methods but this is what has worked very well for me.

 

[v zoo]

When and how to separate???

I am just wondering at what age it is best to separate my baby Jackson's. Should I separate them each into their own cages or females together, males together????

Any advice would be great.

Thank you all.

 

[laurie]

This is just what I did at one time.

http://www.livemonarch.com/store_enclosures.php
I used the 13 x13 x24. I kept 4 per cage. Fruit flys also do not get out.

What I have now:

http://dragonstrand.com

I use the 4 pack baby raiser. I kept the babies one per cage. They did really well, you could tell if each one was eating & pooping. Big added extra fruit flys do not get out.

 

[laurie]

This is the best I can offer for pictures - I don't take pictures.

This is from a forum member

https://www.chameleonforums.com/new-nursery-set-up-product-review-125351/