Urgent help-eyes closed not eating -deteriorating

[kinyonga]

What colour are his urates? White, slight tinge of yellow, orange?
Is he drinking at all?

The eye issue may be from a lack of vitamin A. BTW, there are two forms of vitamin A …prEformed (retinol, form animal sources) or prOformed (From carotenes, veggie sources). It’s thought that chameleons can not convert the beta carotene sources and need the prEformed source…but prEformed sources are fat soluble and can build up in the system and lead to health issues so it’s important that we only use it twice a month…same for the D3. D3 from supplements can build up in the system…so we want the chameleon to produce most of its D3 from its exposure to the UVB light or the sunlight. It’s converted as needed by the chameleon and should not be able to lead to overdose as long as the chameleon can move in and out of the UVB at will.

 

[kinyonga]

For supplements, we recommend dusting lightly at all feedings but two a month with a phos free calcium powder. On the two remaining feedings, two weeks apart, dust lightly with repricing that has D3.

Now…it’s recommended that you gutload/feed your crickets, roaches, super worms with a wide assortment of greens such as collards, dandelions, kale, mustard greens, etc and veggies such as, sweet red peppers, sweet potatoes, zucchini, squash, carrots, etc and a very small amount of apple, pear, berries, etc.

 

[Gingero]

Hello! You've gotten some really great advice so far and I know it is a lot to digest. I'll try to help fill in some gaps.

1. You asked if you need a fixture to hold the bulb.. Yes you do. Here is a link to my shopping list that includes the fixture and discounts: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1sAESGOC5N8sU1Sv6d4ln5UELk35ycCeNL9vy-EcxNoY
2. Now that you've used the Reptivite twice, I would switch back to using calcium without D3. And start using your multivitamin 2x a month moving forward.
3. I think if you can make these changes quickly, there is a chance he will recover. His body condition looks good, but it is concerning if he is starting to shut down and has a decreased appetite.
4. As mentioned briefly, misting too much during the day can cause issues. There is too much of a good thing when it comes to chams just like how it can be problematic if there's too little. It needs to be jussst right which is what makes them so tricky to care for. I'd mist for 2-4 minutes in the morning and 2-4 minutes at night. And monitor his poops/urates and humidity levels once you get your hygrometer.

Here are some videos that should be helpful:

 

[kinyonga]

Hope you can wade throuh all that we’ve bombarded you with and get your chameleon on the road to recovery.

 

[Beman]

Hi @Lyrabean welcome... You have gotten wonderful info so far. Make sure you scroll through your thread. you will only get a notification about the last post added so it can be easy to miss someones feedback...

His body condition is actually really good. We have seen far worse. The cage changes will be important and the UVB change. If you ordered the UVB please send me a link to what you purchased.

Also can you post pictures pictures of your supplements. I want to make sure you have the correct supplements and know exactly how to use them.

 

[kinyonga]

Are his eyes open today at all? Will he open them if you bother him (touch him)?

Do you know the cage temperature where he’s sitting? He needs to be warm enough to digest his food…or he may not feel like eating.

Was he keeping his eyes shut when you took him to the vet?

You said…”Do I continue to force feed?”…if his eyes are always closed you may have no other choice. It’s better if he will eat on his own though…if you drip water slowly (one or two drops per second) on the end of his nose and he’s starts to drink put an insect BETWEEN his teeth so he will hopefully chomp down on it and start to chew it and swallow it.

Heres a recipe for bug juice that you can give him with a syringe if you have to force feed him and he won’t chew the insects and swallow them…
https://www.adcham.com/html/husbandry/bug-juice.html

 

[Lyrabean]

What colour are his urates? White, slight tinge of yellow, orange?
Is he drinking at all?

The eye issue may be from a lack of vitamin A. BTW, there are two forms of vitamin A …prEformed (retinol, form animal sources) or prOformed (From carotenes, veggie sources). It’s thought that chameleons can not convert the beta carotene sources and need the prEformed source…but prEformed sources are fat soluble and can build up in the system and lead to health issues so it’s important that we only use it twice a month…same for the D3. D3 from supplements can build up in the system…so we want the chameleon to produce most of its D3 from its exposure to the UVB light or the sunlight. It’s converted as needed by the chameleon and should not be able to lead to overdose as long as the chameleon can move in and out of the UVB at will.

Color is white and dark brown like normal… we have been giving him water from a syringe and he is drinking it up now. He was force fed two small worms today. I have the vitamin a from repadhy it arrived today. Should I put that in the water? And the d3 calcium too? I put him in natural sunlight dappled for two hours today until the new uvb lamp is installed it came without the fixture so reordered and will have it tmrw

 

[Lyrabean]

Are his eyes open today at all? Will he open them if you bother him (touch him)?

Do you know the cage temperature where he’s sitting? He needs to be warm enough to digest his food…or he may not feel like eating.

Was he keeping his eyes shut when you took him to the vet?

You said…”Do I continue to force feed?”…if his eyes are always closed you may have no other choice. It’s better if he will eat on his own though…if you drip water slowly (one or two drops per second) on the end of his nose and he’s starts to drink put an insect BETWEEN his teeth so he will hopefully chomp down on it and start to chew it and swallow it.

Heres a recipe for bug juice that you can give him with a syringe if you have to force feed him and he won’t chew the insects and swallow them…
https://www.adcham.com/html/husbandry/bug-juice.html

He is actively trying to rub his eyes very hard on my hand when I hold
Him like it’s itching. His eyes are closed constantly and he seems to bulge them up at times it’s hard ti explain. The cage temp is well above 85 in the light and 74 on the bottom . Thoughts? And thanks about the feeding. That is very helpful. He does swallow the waxworms I gave to him but I forcefully opened his mouth and put it in the back. Haven’t tried to drinking thing… but I will . He’s gobbling up water. Why are your thoughts on the eyes?

 

[Beman]

Color is white and dark brown like normal… we have been giving him water from a syringe and he is drinking it up now. He was force fed two small worms today. I have the vitamin a from repadhy it arrived today. Should I put that in the water? And the d3 calcium too? I put him in natural sunlight dappled for two hours today until the new uvb lamp is installed it came without the fixture so reordered and will have it tmrw

Please scroll up through your thread... You will only get notifications on the last post... Depending on your supplements you can actually make him worse. Please post pics of the supplements so we can tell you how to use them. Do not put anything in the water.

 

[Lyrabean]

Please scroll up through your thread... You will only get notifications on the last post... Depending on your supplements you can actually make him worse. Please post pics of the supplements so we can tell you how to use them. Do not put anything in the water.

Also hve the calcium with d3

 

[Beman]

Also hve the calcium with d3

You would not use the repashy supervite at all. This one is much too high in vitamin A for a chameleon.
The calcium without D3 is what you would lightly dust on feeders at almost all feedings. Then you need a multivitamin. The reptivite trial pack has D3 in it and is a multivitamin. You could use this. This would only be used 2 times a month say the 1st and the 15th.
We have to be really cautious with supplements that have D3 or A in them. Both of these are fat soluble so they store in the body and create a toxicity.

I prefer repashy calcium Plus LoD version for the multivitamin. Again this one would only be used 2 times a month. Then the Calcium without D3 at all other feedings. Supplements are lightly dusted not coated on the insects.

Did you upgrade your UVB fixture type and bulb? The compact screw in bulbs do not have the UVI output distance or strengths we need for chameleons. You want a T5HO fixture with a 5.0 or 6% bulb. Buy a 24 inch fixture because this is what the cage size will need to be upgraded to as well.

 

[kinyonga]

You said…”I have the vitamin a from repadhy it arrived today. Should I put that in the water? And the d3 calcium too?”…no…the idea is to coat her bugs lightly in the supplements on the normal schedule. You don’t want them to look like powdered donuts…a little powder goes a long way.

You said…”He is actively trying to rub his eyes very hard on my hand when I hold Him like it’s itching. His eyes are closed constantly and he seems to bulge them up at times it’s hard ti explain”…I think you need to get him to a good exotics/chameleon vet and get this issue resolved.

You said…”The cage temp is well above 85 in the light and 74 on the bottom” the basking shouldn’t be well above 85F…it should be closer to 80-83F.

You said…”He does swallow the waxworms I gave to him but I forcefully opened his mouth and put it in the back”…putting it in the back won’t give him much opportunity to chew it. That’s whynI suggested the drinking way of doing it.

You said…”He’s gobbling up water”…sometimes this indicates that a chameleon is ill.

You said…”Why are your thoughts on the eyes?”…I’m not a vet…all I can do is speak from what I’ve learned in all my years of keeping chameleons and other reptiles….although it could be a vitamin A issue, I’m thinking it’s most likely either something stuck in the eye or an infection….but you need a good vet to deal with this.

I hope you get things sorted out quickly.

 

[Lyrabean]

You said…”I have the vitamin a from repadhy it arrived today. Should I put that in the water? And the d3 calcium too?”…no…the idea is to coat her bugs lightly in the supplements on the normal schedule. You don’t want them to look like powdered donuts…a little powder goes a long way.

You said…”He is actively trying to rub his eyes very hard on my hand when I hold Him like it’s itching. His eyes are closed constantly and he seems to bulge them up at times it’s hard ti explain”…I think you need to get him to a good exotics/chameleon vet and get this issue resolved.

You said…”The cage temp is well above 85 in the light and 74 on the bottom” the basking shouldn’t be well above 85F…it should be closer to 80-83F.

You said…”He does swallow the waxworms I gave to him but I forcefully opened his mouth and put it in the back”…putting it in the back won’t give him much opportunity to chew it. That’s whynI suggested the drinking way of doing it.

You said…”He’s gobbling up water”…sometimes this indicates that a chameleon is ill.

You said…”Why are your thoughts on the eyes?”…I’m not a vet…all I can do is speak from what I’ve learned in all my years of keeping chameleons and other reptiles….although it could be a vitamin A issue, I’m thinking it’s most likely either something stuck in the eye or an infection….but you need a good vet to deal with this.

I hope you get things sorted out quickly.

I brought him to the ONLY reptile vet before I posted to this forum and he wasn’t much help. Just gave him a fluid shot and recommended repashy vitamins and did a fecal. I got the repashy vitamins and they weren’t even the right ones because the vet wasn’t specific enough. He did a fecal too which was negative. The only reptile vet not diagnosing him, This is why I am posting here…

 

[Beman]

@Lyrabean how is he doing today? Where do you live?

 

[Lyrabean]

Hi guys, wanted to let you know things are starting to look up! He is starting to open his left eye abs is much more energetic . Still not eating but was happy to eat 4 crickets when slightly opening his mouth and putting it in between his teeth. I am hopeful for the next few days… taking him outside yesterday really perked him up as advices above

 

[kinyonga]

I brought him to the ONLY reptile vet before I posted to this forum and he wasn’t much help. Just gave him a fluid shot and recommended repashy vitamins and did a fecal. I got the repashy vitamins and they weren’t even the right ones because the vet wasn’t specific enough. He did a fecal too which was negative. The only reptile vet not diagnosing him, This is why I am posting here…

I know…I read your previous posts…several times actually.

 

[Lyrabean]

Thanks you to everyone that helped! He has pulled through and is eating 🍽 n his own!!!!

 

[Beman]

Thanks you to everyone that helped! He has pulled through and is eating 🍽 n his own!!!!

Did you get the linear UVB light?

 

[Lyrabean]

Did you get the linear UVB light?

Yes!

 

[elizaann2]

So happy to hear that!