Veiled Chameleon showing signs of lethargy

I did buy her a new deep dome fixture in hopes that would help the basking area and once the light was put into the deep dome fixture it seems the basking area is more intense but she is seeming more energetic and basking regularly since I placed it in their this evening. Maybe the dual light fixture from the infamous death kit is also just like the rest of the junk they sold me.
Also used the exact same bulb out of the other fixture which it looked like near nothing came out. In the deep dome it pushes a strong white heat light. Basking a little lower since the branches were moved but she seems to love it. Let’s hope our vet visit says it’s just that and not anything serious.
 
So their shedding does not equal their age. Babies can shed multiple times in a month if they are growing quickly. I asked about her age because casque height and her size is not equivalent of a 6 month old female. Depending on where you got her from she could have been much younger than you are thinking. With females we feed them as much as they want the first 7-8 months of their life before starting the reduction process. When you say large crickets these would be an inch long if you are ordering from normal suppliers. Which size wise for this small of a chameleon would be too large. You risk regurgitation with large feeders that are too big for them to fully chew and get down. Now if you have only been giving 4 feeders daily this could account for her smaller size. She would not be reaching her growth potential due to the decreased food intake.

Is the linear Uvb a T8 or T5HO these two are very different in output levels. So they would require different distances if it is a T8 then a 5.0 would not be putting out the UVB she needs at the distance to basking branches she is at.

With fogging you have no risk of an RI developing if the temps are not low enough. At 70-72 you are running a risk. It does not matter if the air circulation is good if there is warm air and moisture this is where they end up developing an RI. You would know if this was the case. It starts out most typically with them holding their nose up and gapping trying to breathe. There is also the risk of RI from bacteria. If your cage is holding bacteria from the moss being in it then this could be a risk.

The repti calcium you are using is without D3 version correct?

You said she has not wanted to eat. Which with the moss the concern would be impaction. Moss being in the cage could be the culprit if she has an impaction.

Note not all reptile vets know chameleons. With the supplements she is on do not let them give her a vitamin shot. This can cause an overdose and shut down her system especially in her current state of decline.

Double check her temps you want no hotter than 80 at the branch. Too hot and chams this young will actually dehydrate.

Best of luck at the vet. Hope they can help.
The bulb is a 10.0 UVB I don’t know where to find the info on it I took the bulb out to check I thought it was a 5.0. Should I place it higher above the cage?
 
Also as far as using the large crickets as feeders she handles them fine I do have some experience with reptiles but I’m no expert. She is not impacted or showing signs of impaction and/or RI she pooped today 3 hours maybe 4 from now so that disproves that. But she does have lack of appetite which is why I originally made the post at worst I think she could have a parasitic infection at best the dual head fixture wasn’t putting enough out for a full area effect of the 80 degree basking point so possible was too small of an area/not bright enough for her to notice.
 
She has been sleeping oddly for the past two days like seriously have not caught her basking under the heat. After changing the fixture she has spent more time under that light than I’ve seen from her ever before
 
The bulb is a 10.0 UVB I don’t know where to find the info on it I took the bulb out to check I thought it was a 5.0. Should I place it higher above the cage?
It’s essential for placement to know if it’s a T5 or T8 fixture as they are very different. It should say on the end of the uvb bulb which it is. Another way to tell is a T8 is a 1 inch wide bulb, while a T5 is a 1/2”. I’m still a bit confused about your Reptivite and calcium with D3. Can you post some pics of all of the supplements that you are using. Very often, the biggest things that cause our sweet chameleons to become ill is our errors, and even small ones that seem insignificant can have a tremendous impact.
After seeing more pics of her, I agree that she is probably younger than 6 months and should be getting much more to eat. I prefer to feed smaller feeders just for my animals comfort in swallowing. Plus, giving more of smaller feeders is a nice little bit of enrichment imho and easier to give a bit of variety in a single feeding. Getting called away right now. Just wanted to add a bit more to the excellent feedback given by @Beman and others.
 
It’s essential for placement to know if it’s a T5 or T8 fixture as they are very different. It should say on the end of the uvb bulb which it is. Another way to tell is a T8 is a 1 inch wide bulb, while a T5 is a 1/2”. I’m still a bit confused about your Reptivite and calcium with D3. Can you post some pics of all of the supplements that you are using. Very often, the biggest things that cause our sweet chameleons to become ill is our errors, and even small ones that seem insignificant can have a tremendous impact.
After seeing more pics of her, I agree that she is probably younger than 6 months and should be getting much more to eat. I prefer to feed smaller feeders just for my animals comfort in swallowing. Plus, giving more of smaller feeders is a nice little bit of enrichment imho and easier to give a bit of variety in a single feeding. Getting called away right now. Just wanted to add a bit more to the excellent feedback given by @Beman and others.
I already posted pictures of the supplements, it is calcium without d3 at every feeding and reptivite calcium with d3 and vitamins twice a month. By the look of the bulb it’s a 1 inch wide I’ll take it out again once her lights are out they go out in 30 minutes. I do feed hornworms as treats occasionally and Dubai roaches as treats as well. She does get a variety. I was gutloading my crickets with carrots and collard greens I have since gave them majority collard greens and little carrots.I will be buying more fruits and veggies to fix the gutloading but suplliments and feeders aren’t the problem I don’t think but we will all find out from the vet tomorrow
 
Last edited:
I already posted pictures of the supplements, it is calcium without d3 at every feeding and reptivite calcium with d3 and vitamins twice a month. By the look of the bulb it’s a 1 inch wide I’ll take it out again once her lights are out they go out in 30 minutes. I do feed hornworms as treats occasionally and Dubai roaches as treats as well. She does get a variety. I was gutloading my crickets with carrots and collard greens I have since gave them majority collard greens and little carrots.I will be buying more fruits and veggies to fix the gutloading but suplliments and feeders aren’t the problem I don’t think but we will all find out from the vet tomorrow
Ok…I’m not seeing any pics of supplements. Maybe it’s the way you’re wording it that has me befuddled. The ReptiVite is a multivitamin and not a calcium. It comes in two version - one with D3 and one without. So, when you say
reptivite calcium with d3 and vitamins twice a month
that sounds like two separate products. I know it’s seems picayune, but vitamin D3 and proformed A are fat soluble and can build up to dangerous levels before you know it and can cause problems such as what you are seeing. It’s often the little things that matter. Same as with the type of uvb - T5 or T8. If you are using a 10.0 uvb bulb with a T5 that has been 4-8” away, she has been getting baked with uvb. If it is a 5.0 bulb with a T8 at the same distance, she may not be getting enough uvb. For her age, while the difference between her being 4 months old vs 6 months old may not seem like much, it really is. Not only are the younger chameleons much more fragile and less tolerant of any error at all, but they also need to be eating at least 15+ feeders of appropriate size daily. If she thinks the feeder is too big for her, she won’t eat it. So, she may be underfed and it’s catching up with her now. I didn’t even initially catch these things, which is why it’s so good to have other eyes and voices pitching in to help. There’s so much to learn with chameleons and it’s not always easy to even know what is the right info and what is wrong. We mostly go by the guidelines and standards of Chameleon Academy as simply put, it is the absolute best from the absolute best. https://chameleonacademy.com/
 
We made it to our appointment and the info is good. Iris is not iris. She is not a she, he is a he. I paid $110 the vet said he showed no signs of any illness at all, we spoke about his diet and where I purchased him from. We came across me remembering when I purchased him the representative at petsmart said he was fed only 2 small crickets daily and the gutload on those feeders is very bad. The vet said he did suffer from some malnutrition but he said if the pet store was only feeding her 2 small crickets daily he was never able to control his diet. He asked me how he fed when I got him and I said he ate much more the first 2-3 weeks he was fed all the small crickets he could eat in a 15 minute period twice a day and he would eat nearly 20-30 of them per feed. The vet said when a chameleon is sick from malnutrition like that it has to heal, and now since he gets to eat a diet he can regulate he won’t choose to eat every time and he is healing from the malnutrition, he said chameleons sometimes overeat after instances of malnutrion and it is common for a healing chameleon to rest during recovery after regulating their diet. So the pet store was feeding her incorrectly 2 small crickets a day for a chameleon that is 2 months old at the least he was very skinny I showed old pictures it is sad that pet stores are less informed than us on how to feed a reptile. We also spoke about the cage she was kept it was a 1x1 foot cage and that some pet stores don’t care about correct husbandry they care about getting the chameleon sold and sometimes they stay there for long periods of time.
 
Ok…I’m not seeing any pics of supplements. Maybe it’s the way you’re wording it that has me befuddled. The ReptiVite is a multivitamin and not a calcium. It comes in two version - one with D3 and one without. So, when you say

that sounds like two separate products. I know it’s seems picayune, but vitamin D3 and proformed A are fat soluble and can build up to dangerous levels before you know it and can cause problems such as what you are seeing. It’s often the little things that matter. Same as with the type of uvb - T5 or T8. If you are using a 10.0 uvb bulb with a T5 that has been 4-8” away, she has been getting baked with uvb. If it is a 5.0 bulb with a T8 at the same distance, she may not be getting enough uvb. For her age, while the difference between her being 4 months old vs 6 months old may not seem like much, it really is. Not only are the younger chameleons much more fragile and less tolerant of any error at all, but they also need to be eating at least 15+ feeders of appropriate size daily. If she thinks the feeder is too big for her, she won’t eat it. So, she may be underfed and it’s catching up with her now. I didn’t even initially catch these things, which is why it’s so good to have other eyes and voices pitching in to help. There’s so much to learn with chameleons and it’s not always easy to even know what is the right info and what is wrong. We mostly go by the guidelines and standards of Chameleon Academy as simply put, it is the absolute best from the absolute best. https://chameleonacademy.com/
here is another picture to reference, the reptivite does contain vitamins with d3 and calcium. Also he is about to shed
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    115.6 KB · Views: 37
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    157.9 KB · Views: 27
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    123.8 KB · Views: 40
I would really love to confirm gender for you. I need a picture of the chameleons back foot sitting on a branch from the side.

Like this... and this was the tarsal spur on my 6 month old male. They are on the back of the back feet.
 

Attachments

  • Tarsal spur1.jpg
    Tarsal spur1.jpg
    124.4 KB · Views: 43
  • tarsal Spur2.jpg
    tarsal Spur2.jpg
    118.9 KB · Views: 43
I will get a picture of the back feet shortly, the vet said he could tell by the bulge after the vent and the coloration and said sometimes it’s difficult to tell at the age of my chameleon he thought my chameleon was between 4-5 months old max not close to 6
 
Here’s some to look at I agree with the vet she is a he. More masculine looking chameleon. I thought it was a female when first bought until now because it really is hard to tell
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    195.5 KB · Views: 48
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    231.6 KB · Views: 42
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    191.8 KB · Views: 44
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    174.1 KB · Views: 39
@Beman and @MissSkittles thank you for all your help making sure my little guy is okay I think the husbandry is A+ now and he has been very active I think that helped tremendously but I’m offering him as much as he will eat and going to be keeping a close eye on his recovery from the pet store. I’m really thankful I got him from there even though he had a rough start to his life they mistreat chameleons at petsmart, they know nothing about how to take care of them the only reason they are alive there is because they sell them before they die from their care. I looked in the 1x1 cage earlier today getting more crickets and the chameleon inside of the enclosure at petsmart was so small but he was black, all black. My little guy never turns black they hate it there but I can’t dwell on it I’m not rich enough to save all the chameleons no matter how bad I want to.
 
Ok so this is what I see... I can not see the back of the back feet to tell if there is a tarsal spur in those pics. So I looked through all of your pics up close and found this. In the first pic you can see the back of the back foot. There is absolutely no tarsal spur there. It is totally smooth. And then when she is on the screen. There is no sign of a tarsal spur there either. So this means female not male.


Screenshot 2023-12-24 at 8.35.05 AM.png
Screenshot 2023-12-24 at 8.35.28 AM.png



I am not seeing any bulge after the vent. Which would indicate female. Also females can throw these patterns that yours is just with stress and irritation. These are not permanent patterns. This is a juvenile reacting to a source of stimulus causing the pattern change.

In my opinion you very much have a young female and not a male. I agree that she looks to be somewhere in the 4-5 months range however their husbandry the first few months of their lives and food intake directly impact their growth rate. So basing it off size is not reliable.
 
The vet said look liked a make cask shape color pattern and bulge after the vent but said it was still hard to tell. But you are right no tarsal spurs. I’ve been giving 30 mins of natural light and will be doing that for the next 5 days she/he is much more active and loves the light
 

Attachments

  • IMG_0192.jpeg
    IMG_0192.jpeg
    171.6 KB · Views: 44
  • IMG_0189.jpeg
    IMG_0189.jpeg
    178.8 KB · Views: 40
  • IMG_0190.jpeg
    IMG_0190.jpeg
    162.7 KB · Views: 39
  • IMG_0198.jpeg
    IMG_0198.jpeg
    152.1 KB · Views: 43
  • IMG_0200.jpeg
    IMG_0200.jpeg
    153.5 KB · Views: 38
  • IMG_0199.jpeg
    IMG_0199.jpeg
    156.3 KB · Views: 40
  • IMG_0197.jpeg
    IMG_0197.jpeg
    138.2 KB · Views: 39
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    116.3 KB · Views: 36
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    97 KB · Views: 43
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    114.5 KB · Views: 40
Idk if you guys have seen her from the back with the size comparison from my hand. She does not seem malnourished as she was when I got her
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    157.3 KB · Views: 40
The vet said look liked a make cask shape color pattern and bulge after the vent but said it was still hard to tell. But you are right no tarsal spurs. I’ve been giving 30 mins of natural light and will be doing that for the next 5 days she/he is much more active and loves the light

Idk if you guys have seen her from the back with the size comparison from my hand. She does not seem malnourished as she was when I got her
I hate to tell you this but sun through glass does not work for uvb only heat. The glass totally cuts the uvb. It is a young female and the patterns you are seeing are a stress reaction. Having other animals near her is going to cause unneeded stress. She is going to view them as a threat. Her body language is also showing this. Hunching down close to your hand is fear not comfort for them.

I do not think uvb is your issue based on what you have said. She has the proper uvb and temps in the enclosure. I think she needs more nutrition. And I would be curious to see what the results of the fecal sample come back as. Parasites can decrease appetite and reduce growth potential.
 
Back
Top Bottom