Veiled Digging Question

[pssh]

I dont think anyone has said this yet, but it is very likely that she is diggin because it is too warm for her. You need a digital thermometer ASAP! As long as you can keep her temps correct, you can use that tank for a little while longer (maybe a couple of weeks, bit getting a nice screen cage or proper terrarium sooner would be better.) Since she doesnt have a UVB bulb yet, be sure to get a calcium with D3 and a plain calcium right away. Dust the crickets with the calcium with D3 as soon as you get it and get that UVB bulb soon!

Also, take out any substrate and replace it with paper towels or nothing. If she accidentally (or purposfully) eats any it can block her instestines causing impaction. This can be fatal.

 

[peacenlove]

people can be mean on this forum and im sorry for that i have had my share of people telling me i am a horrible chameleon owner.. but i understand your trying your best, i kinda skimed through these posts so im not 100% up to date, but i did have a baby for a while who did that and my guess was because she was in a glass cage she was digging because she was trying to climb up, i went and bought her a screen cage and after that she was never on the bottom. another thing you could do is buy a medium size fiscus tree and have her free roaming i have a couple free roaming chameleons, as long as u dont have cats or dogs she should be fine just put her in the tree if you can find some meshing rig some meshing around it i had another veild who would never leave her tree so she was always out free roaming in her tree, and with the water if you get a live plant and mist her daily the water will stick to the leaves and she will drink it that way. live plants are cheeper then buying the fake ones... once again i dont know how much help i have been i just skimmed all the posts someone might have already said what i have said, but what i have learned is chameleons hate glass cages, you could even try a bird cage if you have any bird cages i find are better then the screen cages if shes not small enough to squeeze outt because u can attach branches to the sides. anywho dont worry about what everyone else is saying that you "doing a bad job" your doing the best you can and i understand

 

[darthink]

Hi, Darthink!

The trick with the lights is to put the heat lamp all the way to one side. Don't center it. That will create airflow and offer different temperature options for the chameleon.

You definitely do want a UVB bulb. My suggestion would be to get an 18 inch because you'll be able to use that fixture with the adult cage. You can buy 18 inch fixtures at most places that sell fluorescent tubes (think Wal Mart, Home Depot). While you need a special bulb, you don't need a special fixture. Don't worry about the fact that the fixture is bigger than this cage. Just be aware that the areas on either side of her cage are getting UVB so you don't want to sit with a body part under it for extended periods of time (too much UVB for humans can cause skin cancer).

If you don't want to go with the 18 inch tube (which is, I believe, the smallest they make) this might be a situation in which a compact fluorescent is a good option as they are much smaller.

For either of these bulbs, go for the 5.0. The 10.0 is way too much UVB for such a small enclosure.

You'll be amazed at how much she can eat. At this age, you should be letting her eat as much as she can. Once she gets to be around 5 months old you will want to start backing off on the food. Here's a blog entry written by kinyongia (a stellar member of this board): http://raisingkittytheveiledchameleon.blogspot.com/2007/12/keeping-female-veiled.html You'll want to read that. It's about keeping females in a way that minimizes the frequency and sizes of egg clutches produced.

Thank Elizadolots! You've continued to be so nice and help me as best you can! I have been keeping the lamp on one side to allow for diverse temperature options.

So I scrutinized the boxes closer and have discovered that my bulbs definitely aren't UVB, and are UVA. So when I go to get a UVB, you suggest a tubular one? Like a long one of maybe 18 inches? And do you think the fixture holding it is cheaper at walmart, I'd probably assume so, hah. I'll certainly get a 5.0.

Also, for the feeding, let me ask you about a scenario, since I'm having trouble visualizing an internal cage environment. So If I get an all screen cage, let's say it's like 2 feet wide both ways and 4 feet tall. And I place only a big live plant inside for her to live on and maybe crawl on the edges of the cage if she wants. Well, how do I feed her? If I place crickets in there, they'll all be hanging around the bottom. I assume I just throw a crap load of crickets in there, they all hop around the bottom and she'll crawl down and get them and start eating them all up till she's content. Does that sound about right?

I dont think anyone has said this yet, but it is very likely that she is diggin because it is too warm for her. You need a digital thermometer ASAP! As long as you can keep her temps correct, you can use that tank for a little while longer (maybe a couple of weeks, bit getting a nice screen cage or proper terrarium sooner would be better.) Since she doesnt have a UVB bulb yet, be sure to get a calcium with D3 and a plain calcium right away. Dust the crickets with the calcium with D3 as soon as you get it and get that UVB bulb soon!

Also, take out any substrate and replace it with paper towels or nothing. If she accidentally (or purposfully) eats any it can block her instestines causing impaction. This can be fatal.

Thanks for your reply, pssh :b I had thought about that. But there are still a lot of option for her, for example the other sided of the cage on the net it shouldn't be too warm, or I have a little wooden hovel, but I doubt she'd like that since it's on the ground.

I did get a thermometer with a built in measurement for humidity, it's not digital, but it should get the job done just the same. I will be getting a new cage or something very soon.

Also, I will be getting the calcium supplements asap. So for these, is Repti Safe an example of something I'd use? So I need two types, a calcium with D3 and a calcium without? I suppose I put a few drops into the water I mist her with and do it on some kind of schedule?

And if you suggest I take out the substrate, I will. And just leave it empty glass at the bottom.

Thanks again for your help and reply!

people can be mean on this forum and im sorry for that i have had my share of people telling me i am a horrible chameleon owner.. but i understand your trying your best, i kinda skimed through these posts so im not 100% up to date, but i did have a baby for a while who did that and my guess was because she was in a glass cage she was digging because she was trying to climb up, i went and bought her a screen cage and after that she was never on the bottom. another thing you could do is buy a medium size fiscus tree and have her free roaming i have a couple free roaming chameleons, as long as u dont have cats or dogs she should be fine just put her in the tree if you can find some meshing rig some meshing around it i had another veild who would never leave her tree so she was always out free roaming in her tree, and with the water if you get a live plant and mist her daily the water will stick to the leaves and she will drink it that way. live plants are cheeper then buying the fake ones... once again i dont know how much help i have been i just skimmed all the posts someone might have already said what i have said, but what i have learned is chameleons hate glass cages, you could even try a bird cage if you have any bird cages i find are better then the screen cages if shes not small enough to squeeze outt because u can attach branches to the sides. anywho dont worry about what everyone else is saying that you "doing a bad job" your doing the best you can and i understand

Hi peacenlove! I'm very glad you can relate to me and are so friendly. Your post is actually a huge help and I absolutely love the idea of letting my chameleon roam around freely on her own little plant. Where did you buy your tree at, Lowes or something? And I guess you just washed it off heavily before putting it with your chameleon?

Also, does the water your tree gets mostly come from spraying the leaves? I'm sure every now and then you water its roots too perhaps? I just want to make sure I don't over water the plant causing mold to form on the surface. That'd probably be harmful to a chameleon.

Lastly, does your plant have regular potting soil? I usually mix miracle grow peat moss and perlite for the plant soil. Is this safe for a chameleon environment do you know?

Thanks again!

 

[Elizadolots]

I dont think anyone has said this yet, but it is very likely that she is diggin because it is too warm for her. You need a digital thermometer ASAP! As long as you can keep her temps correct, you can use that tank for a little while longer (maybe a couple of weeks, bit getting a nice screen cage or proper terrarium sooner would be better.) Since she doesnt have a UVB bulb yet, be sure to get a calcium with D3 and a plain calcium right away. Dust the crickets with the calcium with D3 as soon as you get it and get that UVB bulb soon!

Also, take out any substrate and replace it with paper towels or nothing. If she accidentally (or purposfully) eats any it can block her instestines causing impaction. This can be fatal.

These are good points. I would recommend something on the bottom though because she is going to visit the bottom in such a small enclosure and walking on glass doesn't seem pleasant. Paper towels, newsprint or a towel that gets replaced daily might be good.

but what i have learned is chameleons hate glass cages

Glass is used very successfully by some of our most accomplished keepers. Here's a thread you might find interesting:https://www.chameleonforums.com/everyone-who-knows-you-cant-keep-chams-glass-31937/

In particular, I think people should read this post by kinyongia:https://www.chameleonforums.com/eve...keep-chams-glass-31937/index4.html#post293517

However I have to disagree with you when you say that aquariums with only a screen lid are not good for chameleons due to airflow issues. I have kept C. chamaeleons in those cages and they have lived to be over 6 years old in them. Likewise for veileds, panthers, dwarf jackson's, fischer's, etc. and they have lived good long lives with no health issues.

IMHO, if the lights are placed to one side or corner of the cage, there is still a chimney affect. (Learned this "technique" from a science experiment in which an aquarium was used to show exactly this.)

When I first started keeping chameleons over 20 years ago there were only aquariums available or wooden cages with glass doors that only had a small cut-away area for the lights in the wooden lids....and I used both of those for mine. I never had any problems that I could say were as a result of having used them. My first WC adult C. chamaeleons were kept in the wooden cages with the glass doors and even though they were WC and adult when I got them, I had most of them for over 4 years.

 

[peacenlove]

Hi peacenlove! I'm very glad you can relate to me and are so friendly. Your post is actually a huge help and I absolutely love the idea of letting my chameleon roam around freely on her own little plant. Where did you buy your tree at, Lowes or something? And I guess you just washed it off heavily before putting it with your chameleon?

Also, does the water your tree gets mostly come from spraying the leaves? I'm sure every now and then you water its roots too perhaps? I just want to make sure I don't over water the plant causing mold to form on the surface. That'd probably be harmful to a chameleon.

Lastly, does your plant have regular potting soil? I usually mix miracle grow peat moss and perlite for the plant soil. Is this safe for a chameleon environment do you know?

Thanks again! [/QUOTE]

of course i was attacked on a post once by people telling me i was a bad owner and a horrible person for buying a panther and selling my veileds and it upset me a lot i actually stayed away from the forum for a while because of it so i know what its like and its mean for people to judge others when they dont know the full story.

with the plants i would spray the leaves she hated being sprayed and she would go and lick them herself and i sprayed them 2-3 times a day but she came to me really dehydrated so she needed it. but with watering the plant whenever the dirt got dry i watered it and i bought it from wallmart and yes i washed it off, with the mold i didnt really care i just pickd it out whenever it grew, i have found mold grows in almost all my trees but i just clean it as soon as it pops up i guess thats the price you pay when you have a animal that needs a lot of humidity, i would be careufull tho my chameleon was very teritorial and never left her tree sometimes she would wander and i would find her in places she wasnt supposed to be so id make sure she cant go anywhere or get lost, they can fall a good couple feet also so she could fall to the floor so those are some things to think about, and with the subtrate, i just got eco dirt and put a layer on top of the fertilized dirt, then i let her poo fertilize the tree after that, i have a fiscus in my meller chameleon cage and all her poo just firtilizes the tree i never have to clean her cage....now i know the "experts" will prob have something bad to say about this post but its what i found worked best for me and whoever it was that said glass is good was wrong, glass cages causes the chameleon to rub and rubbing can become harmfull and give cleft lips its a chameleons nature to climb and they cant climb up glass, and like a previous post said it can get to hot in a glass terrarium, another thing with lighting make sure she cant touch it at all or she will burn herself, something cool u could do is set up a vine around your room she could climb i have a whole corner of my room for my chameleon and she loves it but i put her away at night and when im not home, so u can mix it up where you have a free roaming and a cage for her so she can be free when your home and watching her and be put away when your not home sorry for the long post.. i talk alot haha

 

[Decadancin]

Based on my experience...

Hi Darthink, I have been reading this thread, and it seems so familiar. I started with a glass aquarium (20 gallon) with the intention of getting a larger enclosure when my guy got a bit bigger. It was hard to keep humidity and temperature where I wanted it, but not impossible. I added an air tube to allow a bit more air circulation, and this did help a bit. Your girl will grow extremely quickly, and will need a bigger home sooner than you think! My advice to you is to think this through before you start spending money. Plan for the cage you will have down the road. Don't buy a light fixture that will also have to be replaced when you upgrade again. The tone of the members may not always come across as what you want to hear, but they want you to learn and give the best home to your new responsibility. There are no perfect cham handbooks, but lots of basics to start with. Varied temp within the enclosure is a must, correct humidity range, UVB lighting, and foliage for shelter and security. I would not use live plants in a tank so small, and I do agree that her enclosure needs to be bigger. Best of luck to you, and of course your new addition, and feel free to PM me if you have any questions or concerns. Welcome to the forum!

 

[Elizadolots]

So If I get an all screen cage, let's say it's like 2 feet wide both ways and 4 feet tall. And I place only a big live plant inside for her to live on and maybe crawl on the edges of the cage if she wants. Well, how do I feed her? If I place crickets in there, they'll all be hanging around the bottom. I assume I just throw a crap load of crickets in there, they all hop around the bottom and she'll crawl down and get them and start eating them all up till she's content. Does that sound about right?

I recommend a fairly dense cage in terms of plants, places to crawl around. You want pathways she can climb and leaves she can hide under. You can use lots of different things to create walkways for her. With metal screen cages you can easily use wooden dowels cut to fit the cage and secured with tacks through the holes in the screen.

As to feeding you can let her hunt. It's good exercise for her. Crickets will almost always go to the roof anyway so she shouldn't have a problem finding them. However, many people prefer to contain the feeders in a large cage so they know that they've been found and eaten. There are a lot of different DIY feeder cups ideas in the enclosure forum.

Here are links to a couple of threads that might be helpful.

https://www.chameleonforums.com/modified-milk-jug-feeding-cup-40365/

https://www.chameleonforums.com/diy-cup-feeder-video-11712/



Here's a video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEBvjGTFwpk&feature=youtu.be

My main suggestion (and I don't see it addressed in those threads) is that you have drainage in the cup. Inevitably water will find its way into the cup and one thing crickets excel at is drowning in a tiny amount of water so, poke holes or something!

 

[darthink]

Hi peacenlove! I'm very glad you can relate to me and are so friendly. Your post is actually a huge help and I absolutely love the idea of letting my chameleon roam around freely on her own little plant. Where did you buy your tree at, Lowes or something? And I guess you just washed it off heavily before putting it with your chameleon?

Also, does the water your tree gets mostly come from spraying the leaves? I'm sure every now and then you water its roots too perhaps? I just want to make sure I don't over water the plant causing mold to form on the surface. That'd probably be harmful to a chameleon.

Lastly, does your plant have regular potting soil? I usually mix miracle grow peat moss and perlite for the plant soil. Is this safe for a chameleon environment do you know?

Thanks again!

of course i was attacked on a post once by people telling me i was a bad owner and a horrible person for buying a panther and selling my veileds and it upset me a lot i actually stayed away from the forum for a while because of it so i know what its like and its mean for people to judge others when they dont know the full story.

with the plants i would spray the leaves she hated being sprayed and she would go and lick them herself and i sprayed them 2-3 times a day but she came to me really dehydrated so she needed it. but with watering the plant whenever the dirt got dry i watered it and i bought it from wallmart and yes i washed it off, with the mold i didnt really care i just pickd it out whenever it grew, i have found mold grows in almost all my trees but i just clean it as soon as it pops up i guess thats the price you pay when you have a animal that needs a lot of humidity, i would be careufull tho my chameleon was very teritorial and never left her tree sometimes she would wander and i would find her in places she wasnt supposed to be so id make sure she cant go anywhere or get lost, they can fall a good couple feet also so she could fall to the floor so those are some things to think about, and with the subtrate, i just got eco dirt and put a layer on top of the fertilized dirt, then i let her poo fertilize the tree after that, i have a fiscus in my meller chameleon cage and all her poo just firtilizes the tree i never have to clean her cage....now i know the "experts" will prob have something bad to say about this post but its what i found worked best for me and whoever it was that said glass is good was wrong, glass cages causes the chameleon to rub and rubbing can become harmfull and give cleft lips its a chameleons nature to climb and they cant climb up glass, and like a previous post said it can get to hot in a glass terrarium, another thing with lighting make sure she cant touch it at all or she will burn herself, something cool u could do is set up a vine around your room she could climb i have a whole corner of my room for my chameleon and she loves it but i put her away at night and when im not home, so u can mix it up where you have a free roaming and a cage for her so she can be free when your home and watching her and be put away when your not home sorry for the long post.. i talk alot haha[/QUOTE]

I don't mind the length of the post at all, thanks! So did you just scrape her poopy off the leaves and stuff and drop it into the soil? And where did you get the "eco dirt?"

 

[peacenlove]

I don't mind the length of the post at all, thanks! So did you just scrape her poopy off the leaves and stuff and drop it into the soil? And where did you get the "eco dirt?"[/QUOTE]

u can buy the eco dirt at petco its 7$ for three bricks which are a lot... haha and ya i clean the poo off the leaves. my chameleons are to big that it goes to the bottom, i still have to clean the cage because the smell can get bad but i just scoop up the top layer of dirt and replace it maybe once a month. my chameleons only poo once or twice a week. my meller usually poos in her free roam so i have to clean it right away... shes a brat like that haha

 

[DavidBuchan]

Hello, welcome to the forum You've had loads of good info so far, just want to suggest this all-round basic caresheet for Veileds which I found useful (part 2 has suggestions for numbers of feeders and gutload stuff) - https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/chameleonsinmyhouse/395-veiled-chameleon-care-sheet.html

 

[pssh]

The supplements are powders that you dust onto feeders and she eats them that way. Use plain calcium at almost every feeding, use the calcium with D3 once every 1-2 weeks (it depends on the brand, so let us know so we can help you set up a schedule) and use a multivitamin once every 2 weeks.

As for the termometer, digital ones are much better than the 'reptile' ones that you stick onto the cage. They can be as much as 10+ degrees off which can mean the difference between an acceptable temperature and cooking your chameleon alive.