Very young Panther girl stopped eating

[desultadox]

Hi all... haven't been here in a while, but in April got a pair of Panther Chameleons after not keeping any for years. It's important to note that I got 2 chameleons at the same time, and their cage, lighting, plants, etc. are identical. The male is 2 months older than the female.

So my female Panther (Cereza) had been doing fine for the first 2 months I had her, but in the last month she's basically refused to eat anything at all. I cup feed her, which she had been fine with (not immediately, but she caught on). About a month ago she decided to stop eating altogether. For a few weeks she would only eat maybe 1 phoenix worm a day out of my hand. Now she won't even eat that. This entire week she ate nothing. Interestingly, when I take her out on my patio to get some sun, she becomes ravenous. She takes down Florida crab spiders like it's going out of style. One time when I wasn't paying close attention while cleaning my pool I looked over to find her munching on a baby brown anole! So I thought maybe she just didn't like eating in her cage. Well I brought Phoenix Worms outside and she wouldn't even look at them twice. Her eyes aren't sunken or anything, but she always seems really thirsty. I'm worried because I can see every bone all the way down to her tail now, I don't know how much longer she can handle this. She behaves pretty normal though.

I just put her on the the cricket keeper and after some hesitation, she did eat at least 3 of them (I left her alone for a while, so she could have eaten more). So inconsistent!

Again, I have a male 2 months older than her in identical conditions and he's an absolute pig! I can't feed him enough!

Any insights?




Your Chameleon - 6 month old female panther chameleon

Handling - Typically I take her outside on the patio on the weekends, so I handle her for a little bit at those times, but it's mostly just to drop her off on a tree outside.

Feeding - Main staple: phoenix worms, she gets these pretty much every day unless I run out. Silkworms are also common (but less frequent as I try to raise them). Hornworms and crickets rarely. Tried Superworms recently. She was eating ~ 5-7 phoenix worms and 2-3 silkworms a day.

Supplements - MWFSu: Calcium w/o D3, TTh: Reptivite multivitamin

Watering - A big morning mist and evening mist, dripper throughout the day.

Fecal Description - Not much to go off of lately; small, mostly white urate.

History - She was fine for like 3 months.


Cage Info:
Cage Type - Custom-built 48"H x 24"W x 24"L

Lighting - ZooMed PowerSun 100W

Temperature - Basking area gets up to 95, ambient is 80-85, night is 75ish

Lowest overnight temp? 75ish

Humidity - It's basically 100% when I leave to work, but probably drops to 60ish before I get back

Plants - The main tree is a big Hibiscus, there's some Bromeliads, too

Placement - My garage

Current Problem - Eating a lot less and always wanting to be out

 

[deerharvester]

I would say your basking temp is way high. I try to keep my younger ones basking around 83,84. Ambient 75. have you tried crickets, a couple of mine dont eat worms(they did at one point). The feeders that move a lot entice them. Also, maybe try freerange feeding some of the crickets.
Hope that helps

 

[Oliviabryant]

you may want to drop your night temps a bit too, not sure if you use a night light?
They need lower temps to get proper sleep, warmer temps make them restless a lot of the time

 

[Video Master]

Your supplements are off and need to be changed. You need to use Calcium with out D3 daily. Calcium with D3 2 times a month. Multivitamin 2 times a month.

Your temps are way too high and they are pretty much baking your chams.

You want your humidity to be in the 50 - 70 range.

I have linked the panther care sheet which has all the temps, humidity, supplement schedule, etc. for a panther cham.

https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/caresheets/panther/

 

[desultadox]

A lot of the temps/humidity are because I live in South Florida. There's no night light, it's just hot here. Maybe I could bring her inside to sleep? But I cant really move her cage so she'd be sleeping outside of it, not sure what impact that would have on her feeling "at home". That basking temp makes up a very small area of her palace (only 1 branch really gets that warm). Chameleons are pretty good at regulating themselves as long as you give them the opportunity. Plus the only place she really eats well is outside on my patio - where it's always 90+! Still I'll try lowering it a bit. I'll modify the dusting schedule a bit (still don't believe in the D3, given the amount of SoFla sun they get), but that doesn't do a bit of good if she's not eating at the moment! So far it seems like she may prefer crickets over worms, as she did eat a couple yesterday, so that's my current experiment. I hate dealing with crickets, but if that's what it takes so be it. Still, she doesn't show a lot of interest in those. I can't freerange them because the cage is way too big. The spiders she eats on the patio don't move at all, either.

So I'll lower the temps a little and change the dusting, but that doesn't explain how her neighbor with identical conditions is THRIVING. I was hoping there might be some kind of sickness/condition someone could tell me about that would cause this.

PS - Thanks for the replies!

 

[deerharvester]

U don't need d3, if ur Cham is outside. But imho, those temps are definitely high for that young of a Cham. When it gets that hot outside I dont have my younger ones outside.

 

[desultadox]

Well they live in my garage, but whenever I'm outside, so are they. This includes extended time periods on the weekends and occasionally for a shorter amount of time during the week. I just raised their lamps, trimmed their basking branch (so it doesn't get as close to the bulb), and added some more foliage to their cages. I'm still not convinced that's the issue here, but you're right, it's probably not good to keep the temps so high anyway.

 

[kinyonga]

Are the two in the same cage? Or have they been together? Can you post a photo of her please? Could she be gravid??

 

[deerharvester]

Also I forgot to ask, can they see each other. That could also be problematic, and cause this issue.

 

[desultadox]

Separate identical cages. They can't see each other, the cages are constructed of melamine to hold heat/humidity. There are vents and the ceiling is just large-holed PVC screen. I really think they have no idea of each other's existence, despite me taking them outside together (I put them on different ends of my back patio). It's so weird, she eats enough to survive, but no more. And her neighbor is a PIG! And she shows no signs of wear (besides boniness) - her eyes aren't sunken at all, her casque is not sunken, she is very agile and mobile around her cage. And this has been going on for a whole now and she doesn't seem to be suffering. I'm so confuzzled

 

[ataraxia]

Hi, does the reptivite you are supplementing w/d3? They have two versions. If yours does have d3. Id recommend no giving any for at least a month or a little longer. Just using the plain calcium you are using right now.

To the issue:
As far as your feeding issue is concerned. It sounds like she is bored of her feeders. You state she eats well on other feeders outside of the cage. That would tell me she has an appetite but for things you are not offering. Id suggest offering other feeders more frequently. Crickets, roaches and if it is wild caught feeders that she wants. Well, happy hunting

 

[desultadox]

No d3, but I noticed it did have vitamin A, so I got one without that. Of course, she doesn't consume much vitamin powder since the only time she really eats is when she's out on my patio. I did catch a bunch of spiders and put them in her cage but its impossible to know if she ate them (I assume she has been, I never see any webs). I've got a bunch of silkworms about a week away from eating size, hopefully she eats those, although she's had them before and didn't eat a lot. Is there a point where I should consider force-feeding her?